db05's long term plan (5 years)

[aewanko]

Now I'm curious, what so special about OC? Can you send me a copy?

It's a massive contrapuntal work consisting of many movements. It was made as a "hommage" to Busoni's Fantastica Contrapuntistica. Ask ahinton for more info.

[tanman]

Well, I did include Fantaisie Impromptu, Moonlight, Pathetique, Hammerklavier and Rach 2 in my list... I might die trying one of these pieces. In that case, I won't live to hear myself play Sorabji.

Now I'm curious, what so special about OC? Can you send me a copy?

just that it's...      

[db05]

It's a massive contrapuntal work consisting of many movements. It was made as a "hommage" to Busoni's Fantastica Contrapuntistica. Ask ahinton for more info.

*drool*

Iwantiwantiwant... 

[tanman]

*drool*

Iwantiwantiwant... 

 

so now do you plan on devoting your life to perfect OC?   

[db05]

so now do you plan on devoting your life to perfect OC?   

Either that or the complete works of Scarlatti (note that some pieces are still being discovered). 

[tanman]

Either that or the complete works of Scarlatti (note that some pieces are still being discovered). 

can perfecting english country tunes by finnisy also another option? 

[db05]

UPDATE:

Class today. Guess what.

Piano teacher gave me a piece today to learn for next year's grand recital *pwera usog*; I can't believe I got it this early. I was planning to learn an invention and request to upgrade my Bach First Lessons to Inventions (therefore upgrading most of my required studies), but I forgot about all that because of this.

And then... Tomorrow... OMG...

This great teacher is coming to our school and will be teaching a few students tomorrow (for a reasonable price). I found out JUST TODAY. But this happens only once in a while, and it happens that I'm available and there's still a slot for me. So I said I'll join although my sonatina isn't 1/2 done. I learned only 1st and 3rd movements, complete and memorized but with problems I can't seem to solve. The 2nd I found really hard to learn and even harder to interpret. So I guess I'm in trouble now.......

I hope this professor would help me with this, in that case it's okay to embarrass myself making all those mistakes. On the other hand, I may annoy the hell out of him with this half-baked sonatina and embarrass my teacher as well!! 

Yeah yeah I should study up but I'm too excited and nervous to function correctly. Felt like vomiting on the bus home. Feverish, even.   

[concerto_love]

Really?!?! Congrats, db!!!  OMG.... Well, me and cai will compete in other school's vocal competition... Cai'll be my accompany, and... OMG, the competition will b held in October 24th and I never heard the song before... Guess I should try my best...

[db05]

UPDATE:

I was so nervous I couldn't sleep until after midnight. I came early to school to study up, and broke my piano practice record. A total of 4 hours on the piano. Yeah, I was already exhausted an hour before the lesson. Would have practiced longer and better if I had enough sleep... But all is well. The professor was a nice guy. That was really helpful, well worth the cost.

Well I don't want to tell everything because who knows, he might be a member here... Besides it's hard to explain and a bit embarrassing...

[tanman]

congrats! that's good that you found a good professor.

[db05]

Really?!?! Congrats, db!!!  OMG.... Well, me and cai will compete in other school's vocal competition... Cai'll be my accompany, and... OMG, the competition will b held in October 24th and I never heard the song before... Guess I should try my best...

Good luck!!

I have something besides piano, too. Guitar recital at the end of the month and I don't know if I'll make it. The Entertainer. Who knew it was THAT long?? I haven't memorized it yet........ Got carried away by piano. Still exhausted/ slightly feverish, should I take a rest? 

congrats! that's good that you found a good professor.

Yeah! I just wish I could play better next time and impress him. Still stuck on beginner stage... I haven't been playing for that long, but still... 

[concerto_love]

Ganbatte, db!!  I have write my program to a paper and ask cai about it, I'll submit it later... Maybe I should try to search a new teacher...

[db05]

Ganbatte, db!!  I have write my program to a paper and ask cai about it, I'll submit it later... Maybe I should try to search a new teacher...

Sure.

Gah, I think I really DO have to rest now. My brain isn't working, maybe it's an aftershock of practicing through exhaustion.

Or too much chatting with a certain SOMEONE...

My guitar teacher (read: first teacher/ mentor) is going to kill me. I have turned completely to piano, I think.

I still have to rework my piano plan in light of recent events. I want to impress the professor when he comes back. Or at least play something different.

Ahhhhhhhhh this is insane!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm going NUTS!!

[loonbohol]

He must be impressed if you play a Franz Liszt composition.

Only that they are hard.

[shinerl]

Sure.

Gah, I think I really DO have to rest now. My brain isn't working, maybe it's an aftershock of practicing through exhaustion.

Or too much chatting with a certain SOMEONE...

My guitar teacher (read: first teacher/ mentor) is going to kill me. I have turned completely to piano, I think.

I still have to rework my piano plan in light of recent events. I want to impress the professor when he comes back. Or at least play something different.

Ahhhhhhhhh this is insane!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm going NUTS!!

I got so exhausted during the Tokyo University Entrance exams
They mase me so careless that I failed every single entrance exams ranging from Tokyo university to KEIO.

[loonbohol]

We'll rest then!

Have a beautiful vacation.

[fredericfrancoischopin]

Here is my plan for the next 5 years. I am currently taking a music course that includes piano lessons. It lasts 3 years, and I'm on 2nd year so I graduate in 2 years. After that, graduation recital. I can teach piano at the school when I graduate. I also want to join the grand recital next year- if I choose to teach I'd probably be disqualified to  - I hope I'd be at an advanced level by then. After grad recital, I have to choice either to teach or to audition for conservatory.

In accordance with Sir bernhard's ideas, I made a list of pieces I'd love to play in 5 years. The pieces I'm totally crazy about don't reach 100. Add required work and it may be enough though.  I include some "cute little pieces"; please don't stone me. And I may miss some important composers/ works.

i would add la campanella for encore

3 short pieces bernhard introduced here: https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,7810.msg78598.html#msg78598
Satie - 3 gymnopedies
Schumann - Traumerei, Happy Farmer
Beethoven - Fur Elise, Moonlight, Pathetique Sonatas
Schubert - Moment Musical
Chopin Preludes No. 7, 20, 15 (Raindrop), etc
some Nocturnes
Waltzes in Db (Minute) and C#m
Fantaisie-Impromptu
Kuhlau - Sonatina in C
Mozart - Bread and Butter, Sonata in C, Sonata in A (Alla Turca), Fantasia in Dm, Twinkle Star Variations
Scarlatti - K 040, 032, 034, 208, 175, 213, 183, 197, 466
Albeniz - Suite Espana, Espanola I
Granados - Spanish Dance, Oriental
Debussy - Reverie, Girl with the Flaxen Hair, Suite Bergamasque
Bach - some inventions, sinfonias, WTC
Ravel - Prelude
Rachmaninoff - Prelude in C#m, Concerto No. 2
Liszt - Consolation, Liebestraum
Gershwin - Preludes, Rhapsody in Blue
Strauss - Blue Danube
Hambro - Happy Birthday, Ludwig
Dan Pi - Oops Fugue

In accordance with Sir lostinidlewonder's suggestion, I've started sight reading. I want to start easy, and slowly go through all levels. Note that I'm limited by my stock of books. Here is my sight-reading plan.

Piano Pieces for Children
Indroduction to the Romantic Era
Kuhlau Sonatinas Bk 1
Bach Inventions
Sinfonias
Scarlatti Sonatas (30 pcs)
The Joy of Chopin/ Chopin Selected Favorites
Well Tempered Clavier Bk 1
Chopin Etudes

Is this plan good? Am I missing something? Suggestions are most welcome! Thanks! 

[db05]

Unfortunately, am staying away from chords/ octaves in the right hand since I have a broken little finger. I guess that means: no La Campanella, Rach Prelude in C#m, Rach 2, Heroic Polonaise, etc.

I would gladly specialize in Baroque music. 

[db05]

db05's long term plan (5 years) UPDATE:

My classmates and I are planning to go to conservatory together. At first it was just wishful thinking, but my teacher is serious and so are my classmates. I'm not sure about myself, frankly I'm worried about them and if I don't go they might not either. I don't want to let them down...

This, grand recital and graduation recital messes up my plan entirely, so forget about the original post. Going to conservatory would mean playing level 8 pieces in 1-2 years, and I still don't know about their sight reading requirement. Help, I'm panicking...

Audition requirements:
1. scales and arpeggios, 4 octaves, major and minor
2. 1 piece BACH - from inventions, sinfonias, WTC, toccatas, partitas or suites
3. 1 VIRTUOSIC ETUDE - from Czerny 299, Chopin, Liszt, Rach, Scriabin, Prokofiev or Debussy
4. 1 FAST MVT - of a 3-mvt classical sonata by Haydn, Mozart or Beethoven
5. FREE CHOICE - preferably 19th or 20th century
6. SIGHT READING

Can you suggest some pieces? Too many to listen to and choose from, I'm afraid. I'll show this to my teacher too, for ideas. I'd rather not play something overplayed. And I'm not fond of etudes, esp. Czerny. Save me. 

[m19834]

Save me. 

That is a little silly, don't you think ?  Especially considering the fact --and perhaps you ought to do so-- that you have commented on not having any mentors and being expected to fill in the gaps on your own.  Here you are being asked to fulfill a requirement that is there for a reason, and you have people to turn to whom are backing you up, you say you would like to play the piano, yet you would just "rather not" play a study. 

I went through a phase of that after reading this forum for a while.  I was never actually "against" etudes and studies, as a matter of fact I liked them, but I also never really knew what their worth truly was until more recently.  Of course, it's more how than what when it comes to developing technique, however, sometimes the what can really aid the how.

If that's the requirement, then that's the requirement, and either you want to get into the conservatory badly enough to swallow your pride and do what is required of you, or you don't.  It seems you are not actually arguing with anybody but yourself  :-.

In any event, I am just here to tell you what I see, as always.

[db05]

That is a little silly, don't you think ?

Just the extent of my confusion. People aren't "backing me up" as much as they confuse me. The other day, a few hours after I posted that, I realized this is not what I want. These are not my goals but someone else's. I'd really be content with being a piano teacher at the local school, nice, little not-so-steady job teaching kids. I don't need WTC and virtuoso etudes for that.

If that's the requirement, then that's the requirement, and either you want to get into the conservatory badly enough to swallow your pride and do what is required of you, or you don't.  It seems you are not actually arguing with anybody but yourself  .

Sure, I have fulfilled requirements before in school without seeing the point and it doesn't hurt. The fact is that I realized early on that I'll never be a great pianist to the point that I can play Chopets or even Inventions. But sometimes I get so arrogant I forget. I have very poor coordination such that I can't sight read beyond grade 2. On top of that, I got such bad pitch I won't pass the exams before the audition (no matter how good I get at theory).

To cite examples so you know I'm not kidding:

- I started Czerny 599 (method for beginners) last year under a strict teacher who demanded I sight-read it. At the same time, Hanon 1 and 2 and C major scale, 4 octaves. I had that teacher for more than 1 month, and we never got beyond those Hanon and No. 11 of the Czerny. Was sobbing on most of the lessons and once I took a "bathroom break" just to cry. I can't say how sick I was of those exercises. I practiced a lot but it didn't help plus my back and my arms would be in pain. And my teacher was a doctor. 

- Luckily, she went on a vacation that December and I took the opportunity to switch teachers. I asked my new teacher to help me with sight-reading and he lent me a grade 2 book. I tried it, but after 2 weeks I just had to give up. I could read the notes but playing them was a different matter. I explained it to my teacher and he said he was baffled and didn't know a case like me before. Since then I made it a point to drill everything HS. That's the only way I made any progress.

- I've been studying Invention No. 1 since September to acquire technique. 3 months and as impossible as before. And it's still in HS segments stage. What a waste of time.

[db05]

I thought exhaustive thinking and planning would make up for my weaknesses, but I was really off the mark. It's about time I face with reality.

In any event, I am just here to tell you what I see, as always.

And for that, Karli, thank you.

[m19834]

I thought exhaustive thinking and planning would make up for my weaknesses

Well, it is not unusual at all to try to have something else make up for what one feels is missing in their life.  I have definitely been in the exhaustive planning stages before, you are not alone there.  I have also done some *pretty* silly things with my life to try to make up for what had been missing.  And, we are talking about years of it.

but I was really off the mark. It's about time I face with reality.

Well, facing reality is difficult sometimes, no doubt about that.  But, difficult or not, it's a good thing to do.  And, sometimes facing reality doesn't happen until things have become such that it's a bit painful.

And for that, Karli, thank you.

Well, Db, you are welcome of course.  I just have to say though that the whole "thank you" episode from before had a purpose beyond me getting a "thank you." 

[db05]

Well, Db, you are welcome of course.  I just have to say though that the whole "thank you" episode from before had a purpose beyond me getting a "thank you." 

I know it did, unfortunately I can only guess what that added purpose was.

*sigh* Again, back to square one. Maybe one of these days I'll just play piano without a plan and timer and see where it leads me. Merry Christmas.

[arensky]

. Maybe one of these days I'll just play piano without a plan and timer and see where it leads me.

The best way for sure. You plan, and God laughs.  Just play what you like, see where it takes you and enjoy the ride. 

I've read many of your posts; you have a tendency to think too much. Piano (or any instrument) is more like a sport than an intellectual activity, in terms actually doing it. The thinking is in the preparation and the approach to playing; but once you start to play, the intellect must take a back seat to the physical; when you throw a ball, do you think about it? Hopefully not, you just throw it. It's the same with piano. Of course there's more involved in playing an instrument, but the principle remains the same. Hope this makes sense. 

[db05]

The best way for sure. You plan, and God laughs.  Just play what you like, see where it takes you and enjoy the ride. 

I've read many of your posts; you have a tendency to think too much. Piano (or any instrument) is more like a sport than an intellectual activity, in terms actually doing it. The thinking is in the preparation and the approach to playing; but once you start to play, the intellect must take a back seat to the physical; when you throw a ball, do you think about it? Hopefully not, you just throw it. It's the same with piano. Of course there's more involved in playing an instrument, but the principle remains the same. Hope this makes sense. 

Not so sure about that. I tried it today, and got tired and frustrated.

What's sad is not good at sports either. Playing piano is the closest I get to being in the moment, I do not have enough coordination to take things as they come. So no fast-paced video games for me, either. It does take a lot of fun out of life.

[m19834]

I know it did, unfortunately I can only guess what that added purpose was.

I have faith that one day you will know .

when you throw a ball, do you think about it? Hopefully not, you just throw it. It's the same with piano. Of course there's more involved in playing an instrument, but the principle remains the same. Hope this makes sense. 

hmmm ... I just have to quickly say that there are of course, in professional playing, "good" ways and techniques to throw a ball, and then some that are not so good.  It's the same with any sport, there are learned techniques to hopefully improve the outcome and proficiency.  There is a "danger" in overthinking probably anything we do !  But, you could say that never giving thought at all to those things means that the individual is simply untrained or so. 

Not thinking doesn't necessarily equal better, but neither does thinking ... necessarily.

[db05]

I have faith that one day you will know .

hmmm ... I just have to quickly say that there are of course, in professional playing, "good" ways and techniques to throw a ball, and then some that are not so good.  It's the same with any sport, there are learned techniques to hopefully improve the outcome and proficiency.  There is a "danger" in overthinking probably anything we do !  But, you could say that never giving thought at all to those things means that the individual is simply untrained or so. 

Not thinking doesn't necessarily equal better, but neither does thinking ... necessarily.

Ooooooooooh we are straying from the topic. Which in my world, is GOOD. 
I love Karli. 
(Sorry, just got busted today. All-out rejected.)

[m19834]

Ooooooooooh we are straying from the topic.

Really ?  I have been under the impression that the main topic here is you  , and in that sense, my posts were faithfully directed toward that particular topic ... more or less 

[db05]

Really ?  I have been under the impression that the main topic here is you  , and in that sense, my posts were faithfully directed toward that particular topic ... more or less 

I thought we were thinking about thinking, which is neither planning nor studying but related to it. Planning was the main topic. I have 2 plan threads. One long-term, the other short-term. The thread about ME is the one in Anything but Piano. 

  Will you be my friend?

[m19834]

I thought we were thinking about thinking, which is neither planning nor studying but related to it. Planning was the main topic. I have 2 plan threads. One long-term, the other short-term. The thread about ME is the one in Anything but Piano. 

Then you are fooling yourself, my dear .

Will you be my friend?

No. 

[db05]

Then you are fooling yourself, my dear .

No. 

I'm a failure. Can't even keep threads on topic.
Sorry. 

[arensky]

I have faith that one day you will know .

hmmm ... I just have to quickly say that there are of course, in professional playing, "good" ways and techniques to throw a ball, and then some that are not so good.  It's the same with any sport, there are learned techniques to hopefully improve the outcome and proficiency.  There is a "danger" in overthinking probably anything we do !  But, you could say that never giving thought at all to those things means that the individual is simply untrained or so. 

Not thinking doesn't necessarily equal better, but neither does thinking ... necessarily.

In practicing, we think, plan, try, and most likely try again a few times, changing our approach and technique as we go until the problem is solved. This applies to both music and sport. When it comes time to actually play/perform, the thinking is a drawback. Heh, I just came from teaching a lesson to a very talented, coordinated and skilled young person who hardly ever thinks, and his playing is a mess, needlessly. We are slowly winning the battle, though. 

My prescription for him is very different from Db05's. There is a balance to be found in everything, different people have different strengths and weaknesses. Some of us need to think more, others should think less.

[arensky]

Not so sure about that. I tried it today, and got tired and frustrated.

Well, I meant long term. Try again tomorrow, and the next day. Just enjoy the piano. Don't look at it like a mountain to be climbed or a thing to be subjugated. Just "play", in the child's sense of the word. Have fun, why not?

What's sad is not good at sports either. Playing piano is the closest I get to being in the moment, I do not have enough coordination to take things as they come. So no fast-paced video games for me, either. It does take a lot of fun out of life.

I am very much the same way, lol my attempts at sport when I was younger were pretty laughable. Piano was the only in-the moment activity I was ever good at, and it became my life. Success there led me to an understanding of how other physical coordination activities work, now I'm a pretty good pool player and surprised myself when I randomly joined a work softball team a couple of years ago. Not everyone is a prodigy and that's ok. You're awfully self critical, you should stop beating yourself up. Other people will always be there to do that for you; don't help them. 

Fast paced video games are a waste of time. As for fun, have your own Db05 fun. You might as well

[pinoypianist]

db05's long term plan (5 years) UPDATE:

Audition requirements:
1. scales and arpeggios, 4 octaves, major and minor
2. 1 piece BACH - from inventions, sinfonias, WTC, toccatas, partitas or suites
3. 1 VIRTUOSIC ETUDE - from Czerny 299, Chopin, Liszt, Rach, Scriabin, Prokofiev or Debussy
4. 1 FAST MVT - of a 3-mvt classical sonata by Haydn, Mozart or Beethoven
5. FREE CHOICE - preferably 19th or 20th century
6. SIGHT READING

Can you suggest some pieces? Too many to listen to and choose from, I'm afraid. I'll show this to my teacher too, for ideas. I'd rather not play something overplayed. And I'm not fond of etudes, esp. Czerny. Save me. 

Which conservatory? looks like the audition requirements from my school.

[db05]

I am very much the same way, lol my attempts at sport when I was younger were pretty laughable. Piano was the only in-the moment activity I was ever good at, and it became my life... Not everyone is a prodigy and that's ok. You're awfully self critical, you should stop beating yourself up. Other people will always be there to do that for you; don't help them. 

Fast paced video games are a waste of time. As for fun, have your own Db05 fun. You might as well

My own fun? Not being able to "catch up" with everyone else means that I'm pretty much alone. Having fun alone can only go a long way. I was never good at anything substantial that I can do for the rest of my life. And I have to do something else or I'll be bored to depression. Anime, drawing, video games, books, poetry, punk, metal, electric guitar, classical guitar... I've went through those... Someday, piano might have to go too. Maybe soon.

People don't beat me up; they don't have to. That would be throwing rocks at a drowning man. What kills me is that they expect me to be normal, which I am NOT. I'd rather be called autistic, retard or even psychopath.

Which conservatory? looks like the audition requirements from my school.

Well DUH. 
If it were just me I wouldn't be auditioning for ANY conservatory. So sick and tired or living up to someone else's standard. And I want to really master the basics. Go back to the start...

[amelialw]

Unfortunately, am staying away from chords/ octaves in the right hand since I have a broken little finger. I guess that means: no La Campanella, Rach Prelude in C#m, Rach 2, Heroic Polonaise, etc.

I would gladly specialize in Baroque music. 

please do not tell me that you are going to give up on pieces like that just because of this problem, true, it is a big one but guess what...my little finger on my r.h is broken too. When i 1st went to my teacher in canada it had reached a point where that finger was practically useless and so weak that i could barely even use it. She refused to give up on me though and now i can play decently with that little finger of mine though it will never be normal again...so please, don't give up

[db05]

please do not tell me that you are going to give up on pieces like that just because of this problem, true, it is a big one but guess what...my little finger on my r.h is broken too. When i 1st went to my teacher in canada it had reached a point where that finger was practically useless and so weak that i could barely even use it. She refused to give up on me though and now i can play decently with that little finger of mine though it will never be normal again...so please, don't give up

When the time comes, if it ever comes, maybe I'll play some of those pieces. At the beginner level it's not so much of a problem, except for the time I was playing keyboard for a band and chords were unavoidable...