top five composers that are still alive.

[richard black]

All right, since this thread has been bumped, I think it's high time to add Tobias Picker to it.

And did Thomas Adès get mentioned yet? I may have missed him.

[djealnla]

New list:

Pierre Boulez, Charles Wuorinen, Alexander Goehr, Michael Finnissy, Andrew Violette.

[djealnla]

All right, since this thread has been bumped, I think it's high time to add Tobias Picker to it.

And did Thomas Adès get mentioned yet? I may have missed him.

He did (see https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=31881.msg374826#msg374826).

[thalbergmad]

New list:

Pierre Boulez, Charles Wuorinen, Alexander Goehr, Michael Finnissy, Andrew Violette.

Sounds like plinky heaven.

Thal

[indutrial]

Wuorinen is definitely still on my list, although I'd rather him continue composing chamber works than take a ton of time to work on that Brokeback Mountain opera. I don't have anything against the project, but I've let myself get spoiled by works like his 2nd Piano Quintet, Sonata for Guitar and Piano, etc...

I don't know much about Andrew Violette, but I feel like I was largely unimpressed by the piano sonata sets released by Innova. I'll have to listen to them again to be sure, but I remember thinking that his works were completely reflective of his background, which made him seem like one of those insufferable and pretentious NYC musicians who spends more time convincing himself of the genius of Cage and Satie than he spends honing his craft.

[djealnla]

Sounds like plinky heaven.

I couldn't find the word "plinky" in my dictionary, but if it's supposed to be negative, I can only say Violette's music is tonal.

[retrouvailles]

Plinky just seems to be thal's favorite word as of late for pieces that he doesn't understand. Shame, for many of my favorite composers can be plinky. Am I crazy for liking them? No! Those who don't like them are the crazy ones.

[thalbergmad]

Yup, I sure am crazy.

Can anyone tell me anything about this Tobias Picker chap mentioned earlier??

I only ask because in the last batch of scores I bought was something called "Keys to the City" and it looks a bit mental.

Thal

[ahinton]

Plinky just seems to be thal's favorite word as of late for pieces that he doesn't understand.

Only one of them; plonky often gets equal exposure from that quarter - and they often appear together like the twins from hell in his posts. How Violette manages to end up being so described is, however, quite beyond me...

[retrouvailles]

Can anyone tell me anything about this Tobias Picker chap mentioned earlier??

His music is anything but mental. It's highly romantic, very accessible music. You should either love it or hate it for that reason. I personally don't care for it too much, but that's just me.

[thalbergmad]

Jolly good, I will give this "keys to the City" a listen.

Has anyone mentioned Callum Kenmuir yet??

Nice to have a romanticist still with us.

Thal

[retrouvailles]

thal, there are plenty of romanticists still with us. Tobias Picker is just one of the many of them. You just have to do some investigation to find them. Not all of them are good, sadly.

[ahinton]

thal, there are plenty of romanticists still with us. Tobias Picker is just one of the many of them. You just have to do some investigation to find them. Not all of them are good, sadly.

Thal actually even knows at least one of them.

Best,

Alistair

[thalbergmad]

As far as I am aware, I do not actually know any romantic composers.

Thal

[ahinton]

As far as I am aware, I do not actually know any romantic composers.

Then perhaps the issue in this particular instance is (rather unusually for you, I submit) one of the extent of your awareness.

Best,

Alistair

[thalbergmad]

Still thinking.

Richard Meyrick has done some transcriptions, but no compositions as far as I am aware.

Nope, I still do not know any.

Thal

[ahinton]

Still thinking.

Good! Keep it up; you never klnow, you might even arrive at a conclusion or three...

Richard Meyrick has done some transcriptions, but no compositions as far as I am aware.

I haven't seen him in more years than I care to remember; I recall him practising in a room on the ground floor of RCM in the days when he was studying with Cyril Smith (as had my own teacher Stephen Savage).

Best,

Alistair

[tb230]

Would be interesting to hear your opinions on Rolf Wallin 's music. Another star for Thal's plinky heaven?

According to Wikipedia, "Wallin’s music combines an intuitive freedom with a rigorous mathematical approach, such as use of fractal algorithms to construct melody and harmony, resulting in a music that often hints at the influence of Ligeti, Xenakis and Berio."

[nanabush]

Now THAT is cool. 

[sordel]

Certainly one of the difficulties here is that we don't have many works recorded by many of the candidates. At the more commercial end, we have loads of Part, Reich, Glass, Tavener and Adams, but most composers have substantial works unperformed and I have no idea, for example, what Alistair's oeuvre would include.

I have most of Thomas Ades's recordings and he is clearly a major talent, but he is only 40 and a place in the top 5 seems premature, even if history proves that he is or was worthy of it.

Rzewski's reputation seems to rest on a small number of piano pieces and - although I think that "The People United [etc.]", "The Housewife's Lament" and "Four North American Ballads" are fine pieces of composition, I have also heard things by him that were considerably less imposing.

With Elliott Carter, Birtwhistle, Ferneyhough I feel that their names get included more from piety than affection, but I'd be happy to be turned around on them.

Is there no interest on these forums in Hans Werner Henze?

[djealnla]

Would be interesting to hear your opinions on Rolf Wallin 's music. Another star for Thal's plinky heaven?

According to Wikipedia, "Wallin’s music combines an intuitive freedom with a rigorous mathematical approach, such as use of fractal algorithms to construct melody and harmony, resulting in a music that often hints at the influence of Ligeti, Xenakis and Berio."

Is it just me, or is this guy actually plundering "his" ideas from Boulez's Sur Incises?

[djealnla]

With Elliott Carter, Birtwhistle, Ferneyhough I feel that their names get included more from piety than affection, but I'd be happy to be turned around on them.

It's Birtwistle, actually. I agree with you about Ferneyhough.

[thalbergmad]

Does anyone know if there is a recording of Tavener's Palintropos??

Thal

[sordel]

It's Birtwistle, actually.

Sorry, that's what comes from basing one's spelling on deprecating jokes made by one's parents.

[retrouvailles]

Does anyone know if there is a recording of Tavener's Palintropos??

Thal

Why specifically that piece? I have heard some of Tavener's music and it is rather static and banal and does almost nothing for me. His piano music I have had better experiences with, though.

[thalbergmad]

Because it is for Piano & Orchestra and that is my fetish.

Thal

[indutrial]

With Elliott Carter, Birtwhistle, Ferneyhough I feel that their names get included more from piety than affection, but I'd be happy to be turned around on them.

Is there no interest on these forums in Hans Werner Henze?

I like the small number of works I've heard by Henze and would certainly like to check out more of his output.

I don't remember my top five on this thread, though I'm certain it included Carter, Wuorinen, Norgard, and perhaps Dusapin and/or Dutilleux. Recently, Poul Ruders might find his way there as well. Of those, Carter was probably the most difficult one for me to come around to, and I'd be lying if I said that I liked the whole of his output without question.

A great help in coming around to my favorites was the prolific amount of recording that's available from those composers. Though many of Wuorinen's works (and especially his recent pieces) have not made it to CD, the amount of older pieces available is pretty impressive. The same goes for Carter.

I would agree that it's hard to level judgment about modern composers whose work hasn't made it to record, or whose recordings are excruciatingly difficult to track down. Lots of recent composers would fall into this category for me, including Ib Norholm, Allen Anderson, Martin Boykan, Rand Steiger, etc... Many of these composers could likely be favorites of mine if I knew more about their output.

I would also have to agree with you about Ferneyhough's appeal. 80% of people I've encountered who celebrate his genius seem to feel better about weaponizing him as a heavy namedrop than about how any of his works affect them. Maybe the same goes for Carter, though...

After hearing his excellent Naxos quartets, I'm a little bit tempted to include Peter Maxwell Davies, but I don't know much about his other works.