The High Left Wrist Phenomenon

[opus10no2]

I've noticed when watching some pianists, particularly in octave playing, the left wrist is noticably higher than the knuckle joints when compared to RH.

Could it be an anatomical difference or is it due to the left arm using the position to support movement from the elbow joint? assuming the left hand is more often required for volume rather than speed.

Before assuming it's a sign of bad technique, note that I first discovered it years ago when watching Hamelin.

[opus10no2]

spam

[aewanko]

Probably the human anatomy has something to do with it.

[opus10no2]

Well I'm not ashamed to say my technique is alot like Hamelin's

[javacisnotrecognized]

I'm pretty sure it's something related to handedness. Also, Hamelins LH collapses alot, so it's not so unlikely that it would collapse during octaves also.

Do you have any videos of this happening to anyone else ?

[retrouvailles]

Well I'm not ashamed to say my technique is alot like Hamelin's

Why do you still come here?

[franzliszt2]

My LH octaves are very different to my RH. I can use 13 a lot with my RH, and play scales etc...using 13 14 15...but with my LH I can only use 14 and 15 comfortably...even though my LH has a larger stretch. I have a 10th in RH and an uncomfrtable 11th in LH.

I find high wrist octaves awkward for a lot of things. The problem is, you hav to create the octave shape with the fingers and hit. If you want a warmer sound you can play from above and drop into the key. I personally find that for really fast scale passages in octaves I use a normal wrist position, so I can use the fingers independently from the arm, becasue that is the only way to get extreme speed. The wrist can only move so fast...but the fingers can move very fast....if yu relax everything, you can crawl up and down on 345 and if the arm is relaxed the thumb will be relaxed, and then you can just move very quickly. I suppose the wrist plays a major role here, but at the same time, it does not really, becasue ll it does is stay relaxed and support the fingers.


Hamelin has huge hands, so I don't see why he plays with a high wrist. Usually people play with a high wrist becasue of hand size issues....but he has really large hands. I am not at all convinced by his tone production though, so if he wants to poke at his octaves thats fine for him.

The LH is more prone to getting tense as well, and I find if I start to get tense, or just tired usually becasue of tension) my LH wrist will begin to rise. I try to avoid this, becasue I don't like it at all, and it feels awkward (for me).

Octaves are very personal at the end of the day 

[faulty_damper]

The wrist being higher has nothing to do with the dominance of the hand.  The reason is quite simple: It's easier to play in such a position.

Virtually everyone will adopt such a position.  There is much less strain and increased leverage and support compared to other ways.

Those who do not adopt it haven't discovered that it is the easiest and most comfortable.

I should add that this only applies to very specific contexts.

[opus10no2]

It's most notable when the hands are performing extended parallel sequences of octaves, they are performing the same task but with different techniques.

Pianists aren't all the same, but it seems there is always a slightly different technique in each hand, and I think this is less about anatomy than the different uses they have in piano writing/playing.

[faulty_damper]

No pair of hands are exact mirrors of each other.  Each is slightly different thus slightly different manners of movement.  The muscular development of the hands/arms is also different due to the requirements of each hand.  This means each hand will be suited to different manners of movement.

[opus10no2]

Yes I agree, but observe Hamelin in particular, it's especially interesting because he is famed for having hands of 'equal' ability.

[gyzzzmo]

Well I'm not ashamed to say my technique is alot like Hamelin's

Holy cow, so the only thing to do to get Hamelins technique is to put my left wrist higher??

I will adopt this trick AND RULE THE WORLD!

[javacisnotrecognized]

Yes I agree, but observe Hamelin in particular, it's especially interesting because he is famed for having hands of 'equal' ability.

So are the Asians; So was Gould & Horowitz. If he had equal ability in both hands, wouldn't they be at the same height? (Or is this what you just asked?)

Also, note that the passage he was playing wasn't paralell octaves - they were staggered. This may, on the other hand () be something specific to Hamelin.

Possibly related questions: How come Horowitz would tightly curl the 2nd & 4th fingers of his LH and stick the 3rd out straight when playing octaves, as if to give a rude gesture ?

How come, on virtually every pair of hands I've seen on a pianist, there is slightly more space between the 2nd and the thumb on the LH than on the RH?

Very interesting indeed 

[richard black]

My wrists don't sit at the same height either, my L is usually lower than my R. I've noticed but can't be bothered doing anything about it because it seems not to be a big deal. I dare say Hamelin is in the same situation.