Learning and Playing by ear alone?

[G.W.K]

Hi all,

I usually learn new pieces by ear because I am terrible at reading sheet music. But how many of you use this method? Does it work for you? What advantages/disadvantages do you find using this method? Or do you think using sheet music should be the only way to learn a piece?

Just wondering,

G.W.K

[ollymuxworthy]

I have never ever practised sight-reading as my musical ear is sufficent to pick up all the notes I hear. If I have a piano piece on a CD, I'll learn it from the CD rather than having to buy sheet music.
Music is sound anyway, so shouldn't need written notation. As much as notation can be useful if you can't hear the piece, I'm sure many people who sight-read would like to hear the piece first, and then those of us who play by ear can play from that. I have played loads of pieces in concerts, and not a single one has been learned from sheet music.

[pianowolfi]

Really, what is the problem about learning to read music? You have learnt reading text, abc and all that. Do you also ask somebody to read for you everytime you want to read a book? People who want to play music and don't want to read it seem to me like illiterates.

[G.W.K]

Really, what is the problem about learning to read music? You have learnt reading text, abc and all that. Do you also ask somebody to read for you everytime you want to read a book? People who want to play music and don't want to read it seem to me like illiterates.

What if you can't read? What if you are partially-sighted? What if your stupid? What if you were never taught sheet-music or don't have time to be taught it professionally?

Everyone has different methods to things, different approaches. Don't question them because it doesn't make that person LESS capable of doing something. They just do it in a different way to you.

G.W.K

[pianowolfi]

What if you can't read? What if you are partially-sighted? What if your stupid? What if you were never taught sheet-music or don't have time to be taught it professionally?

Well as far as I can tell all these what ifs are not the case here. Just utter laziness.

[richard black]

Music is sound anyway, so shouldn't need written notation.

Yes, of course. And clearly it was quite unnecessary for, say, Beethoven to write down his symphonies - the orchestra could just have listened to a recording....

[javacisnotrecognized]

The problem with learning solely by ear is that if the recording you learned from has any serious flaws, you'll pick them up as well. Of course that's no reason not to do it, but I would suggest following along with a copy of the score or something. Plus, there are alot of things that are just so (Visually) obvious in a score that you may not hear in a recording..

[healdie]

I personally need to use the score I am not good a picking things by ear alone but I like to hear a recording as well

I often find myself in Situations at college where i am given some music and told to play it so being able sight read moderatly well is good for me

[magomax]

Personally I think playing by ear is a extraordinary skill. I mean, if you play up to a certain level of piano you should be able to learn really easy pieces by ear, but if they play an intermidiate or advanced level piece I think there's no way you can play every single note right... and I think playing it differently from how the author played it is not a good thing.

[mad_max2024]

Personally I think playing by ear is a extraordinary skill.

I agree.
But it shouldn't be used as an excuse not to learn how to read.
I don't see a reason why you shouldn't aim at developing both skills if you have the chance.

[ahbach]

I personally need to hear a piece before I can play it, and then I need the sheet music as well, it just serves as a backup. Many of the classical pieces are difficult for me to play in the key that they are composed in, and I can usually play parts of the pieces by ear and never look at sheet music. There are many people world wide that can play anything and never see sheet music, they just play by ear, I think that is a beautiful talent, God has really blessed those people!!!! And for anyone to say that not learning sheet music is laziness, well that's just stupidity on their part. Music can be made many ways, and you don't have to have a piece of paper telling you what to play!!!!!

[ollymuxworthy]

The problem with learning solely by ear is that if the recording you learned from has any serious flaws, you'll pick them up as well.

This can also be true in the score, though - if a note has been misplaced then you'll play it wrong. If you pay a good price for the sheet music, then you don't expect mistakes; equally, if you pay a good price for a recording, then you don't expect to find mistakes.

I was never taught how to sight-read by my first piano teacher, and by my second I was just expected to know, but I didn't. This might have been irritating to him at first, but after a while he took it for granted that he could play something through and I could play it back for him. I guess it's all in the eye (or the ear, to that matter) of the beholder whether it is necessary to learn to sight read.

Despite this, I really wish I could now. Is it too late to learn?

[G.W.K]

I don't see a reason why you shouldn't aim at developing both skills if you have the chance.

I do want to read sheet music as it would make things much quicker than having to re-listen to pieces over-and-over again. However, at this point in time...I have no way of being taught. Books can only take me so far.

G.W.K

[cmg]

Hi all,

I usually learn new pieces by ear because I am terrible at reading sheet music. But how many of you use this method? Does it work for you? What advantages/disadvantages do you find using this method? Or do you think using sheet music should be the only way to learn a piece?

Just wondering,

G.W.K

G.W.K., if you're just using your ear it's no wonder Rachmaninov gives you the fits.  Try those hands of yours, will you?

[G.W.K]

G.W.K., if you're just using your ear it's no wonder Rachmaninov gives you the fits.  Try those hands of yours, will you?

LOL...not a brilliant joke, cmg!

G.W.K

[cmg]

LOL...not a brilliant joke, cmg!

G.W.K

Sorry, G.W.K.  I'm suffering from a hangnail.

[G.W.K]

Sorry, G.W.K.  I'm suffering from a hangnail.

Cut it off. Like Vincent Van Gogh did with his ear.

G.W.K

[ahbach]

Don't get me wrong reading sheet music is a very good thing, I only wish I could do it better!!! but there are people out there that don't have a way to fully understand what their looking at, unless they have the money for a teacher to explain everything to them, so many people resort to the next best thing playing by ear!!!!  But if you cut it off you might have some problems!!!!! lol!!!

[general disarray]

I do want to read sheet music as it would make things much quicker than having to re-listen to pieces over-and-over again. However, at this point in time...I have no way of being taught. Books can only take me so far.

G.W.K

Of course, you can be taught, G.W.K.  Now, sing along with me:

"Let's start at the very beginning,
The very best place to start.
When you learn to read you learn A,B,C,
When you sing you begin with Do, Re, Mi!
The first three letters just happen to be:  do, re, mi!  do, re, mi!
Do, re, mi, fa, so, la, ti . . .

Do, a deer, a female deer!
Re, a drop of golden sun!
Mi, a name I call myself!
Fa, a long long way to run!
So, a needle pulling thread!
La, a note to follow So!
Ti, a drink with jam and bread!
And that brings us back to Do, Do, Do, Do!!"

(All together now, children!!  You, too, G.W.K.!!)

[G.W.K]

Of course, you can be taught, G.W.K.  Now, sing along with me:

"Let's start at the very beginning,
The very best place to start.
When you learn to read you learn A,B,C,
When you sing you begin with Do, Re, Mi!
The first three letters just happen to be:  do, re, mi!  do, re, mi!
Do, re, mi, fa, so, la, ti . . .

Do, a deer, a female deer!
Re, a drop of golden sun!
Mi, a name I call myself!
Fa, a long long way to run!
So, a needle pulling thread!
La, a note to follow So!
Ti, a drink with jam and bread!
And that brings us back to Do, Do, Do, Do!!"

(All together now, children!!  You, too, G.W.K.!!)

Very amusing General Disarray, I doubt "The Sound of Music" will be much use to me.

G.W.K

[nyonyo]

What if you can't read? What if you are partially-sighted? What if your stupid? What if you were never taught sheet-music or don't have time to be taught it professionally?

Everyone has different methods to things, different approaches. Don't question them because it doesn't make that person LESS capable of doing something. They just do it in a different way to you.

G.W.K

From my 20 years experience of teaching, I found that students who have problem learning how to read music, they also have problem learning at school. Learning reading music is not like learning calculus or chemistry. People who have normal intelligence should have no problem, only those who are below normal average may not be able to do this.

Combining reading and listening is a faster way to learn a piece, especially for pieces that are very difficult to count.

[G.W.K]

From my 20 years experience of teaching, I found that students who have problem learning how to read music, they also have problem learning at school. Learning reading music is not like learning calculus or chemistry. People who have normal intelligence should have no problem, only those who are below normal average may not be able to do this.

Just to let you know: I've left school. I did very well as I now have 5 Highers and 3 Advanced Highers (Scottish Qualifications) and I also have professional catering qualifications, a hygiene certificate and I am a Microsoft Certified Specialist, had work experience with one of the Queen's Representatives and I am now studying Psychology at college and I have achieved all of this whilst being a teenager and having an IQ of 120.

So, questioning my intelligence is not needed. I meet the "people of normal intelligence" requirement. In fact an IQ of 120 is classified as slightly "above average".

It clearly looks like your 20 years of experience hasn't taught you that there are a few exceptions. And that you should not judge people based purely on instincts. However, now you know.

G.W.K

[pianowolfi]

Okay, seriously there are quite a few cases of "music dyslexia". I hope you are not one of them, G.W.K

[yuc4h]

...

It seems that you are not really here to seek advice or anything. you just voice your opinions and consider everything that contradicts them as an insult. If you don't want to hear the advice of other people then don't ask.

Also, the fact that you feel it is necessary to brag about your qualifications in an anonymous internet forum suggests that your IQ is way below 120. If you were that intelligent, you would also realize that measurement of IQ is always highly biased and uncertain.

[G.W.K]

It seems that gwk isn't really here to seek advice or anything. He just voices his opinions considers everything that contradicts them as an insult. If you don't want to hear the advice of other people then don't ask.

Also, the fact that you feel it is necessary to brag about your qualifications in an anonymous internet forum suggests that your IQ is way below 120. If you were that intelligent, you would also realize that measurement of IQ is always highly biased and uncertain.

You misunderstand my intentions. Although I may be a bit forceful with my replies, I do ask for opinions...I just don't take certain things as lightly as others. However, I do read and understand everyone's opinions. I fail to see why people stuggle to grasp the concept that some learn by ear, and not sheet-reading.

I am not bragging, I'm stating the facts. The fact that someone believes I am an unintelligent child who is at school was wrong, and I am correcting them. However, I agree that it could have been dealt in a better way.

I know IQs are constantly questioned, I just threw it in for effect...LOL

G.W.K

[yuc4h]

Well, I don't really have any reason to doubt your motives :­)

There are many musicians that play only by ear. There are also many that solely depend on written music. Don't you think it would be valuable to be able to do both?

Since your intelligence is apparently above average, you should have no problem studying the reading of musical notation by yourself. The understanding of notation is one of the easiest things in studying the music since the theory behind it is fairly simple. The real difficulties begin if and when you decide to study sight reading more advanced material.

[G.W.K]

Well, I don't really have any reason to doubt your reasons

There are many musicians that play only by ear. There are also many that solely depend on written music. Don't you think it would be valuable to be able to do both?

Since your intelligence is apparently above average, you should have no problem studying the reading of musical notation by yourself. The understanding of notation is one of the easiest things in studying the music since the theory behind it is fairly simple. The real difficulties begin if and when you decide to study sight reading more advanced material.

Ah...perhaps I haven't been quite that clear. I can read basic music, it's the more advanced stuff that I cannot.

G.W.K

[yuc4h]

I don't think that it would be possible to learn virtuoso pieces by only using your ear. Rather, listen to the piece while following the sheet. If there is something on the sheet you can't read, use the recording to fill in the blanks. By listening the piece you should be able to get the timing, trills, etc. right.

[pianowolfi]

Just for the record: the fact that I recommend to learn music reading does not mean that I don't appreciate the ability to play by ear.

[nyonyo]

GWK,

If you do not have the ability to read music well, nobody can help you. You have to be grateful to have golden ears.

By the way, why did you even ask people?  You know that you won't be able to read music anyway, regardless what people say about the advantage of being able to learn piano pieces by reading.

I am sorry that you fell into those unfortunate people who cannot read music. I just cannot imagine to learn, say, Bach WTC without reading the music. It will take forever.

I still believe that IQ has strong correlation to the music reading abiltiy. I have noticed that  smart kids will keep looking at notes written on the book while they play, because they understand what written on the book. Sorry to say, unintelligent kids will just look at their fingers while they play. The music means nothing to them, the have to really depend on what they heard.

[G.W.K]

By the way, why did you even ask people?  You know that you won't be able to read music anyway, regardless what people say about the advantage of being able to learn piano pieces by reading.

I asked people what they thought about learning by ear. The advantages/disadvantages, if they used it themselves, etc. I wasn't really asking for criticism on myself.

G.W.K

[chozartmaninoff]

I first got interested in the piano when i learned i could play by ear. Its an amazing gift. However i think playing by ear alone isnt enough, After i learned to play by ear i started to read music aswell, the two go together great. Hear a piece, play it by ear, and then write it on manuscript paper, no need to by sheet music.

Choz

[richard black]

Art Tatum learned by ear alone.

But I challenge anyone here to name a single classical pianist of repute who managed it.

(I'm aware there was a celebrated 19th-century organist - can't remember which one - who was blind from birth. However, the church organ repertoire is small: improvising is a large part of the job. Kind of puts him in the same category as Tatum, in a way.)

[csharp_minor]

I asked people what they thought about learning by ear. The advantages/disadvantages, if they used it themselves,

When I started out I used to force myself to read the music and never hear a recording of it, or I couldn't because there was no recording of it!

I now use a recording and reading to learn a piece, as I usaly have difficulty with the time values of some notes. I find learning a piece this way is much more faster for me, although I would love to be able to sight read quicky. I suppose this way is ok as Im never gonna be a piano teacher or anything like that!

[magomax]

Oh my god in a day there are a thousand new posts. Hey if I can give small piece of advice, I think there's no need to be harsh, everyone who's here is interested in music and I think that's enough to be respectful to each other.

About the issue, I don't know if this happens to you, but many times I'm learning a piece, when I already play it accurately and I check some recordings it happens that I've given it a different interpretation and many times I keep it my way because I like it more. So the problem of just listening to it is you are more influenced by the artist that performed the piece. For example "Rumores de la caleta" by Albeniz was played really fast by the artist I heard, and I liked it more slower the way I used to play it. Other times you realize there are some parts you could change or improve and that you do. But for me the listening is a way to complement the reading...

[end]

G.W.K.:

what a wonderful skill! I wish I could play piano by ear! (At the moment, I can't play it at all, as I'm just beginning)  

I think it's a privilege of you folks who can play by ear. However, even if I could do it, I'd put in the effort to develop my reading/sight reading. Why bother? Because then you won't need to know the pieces by heart. Just taking the score, you'll be able to play it again (all the notes). It'd be quicker than listening to the piece again and again.

Also, sometimes I don't want to invest too much time on a piece and I just play it (sight reading) a couple of times, then go on to the next. There are loads of scores available free on the net.

I still can't sight read as fast as I wish I could, but I'll surely keep working on it.

Another nice thing: I love to have a score with me on the bus, to read on the go. You can "listen" to music that's just in your mind (and on that piece of paper). It's a way to "play" my instrument (I study other ones than the piano) when I can't actually be touching it. It's a pleasure on long flights, too.

Learning to read music (better than you already do) is not so difficult. There are lots of resources on the net, freely available. Unfortunately, the gift you have (playing by ear) is something I can only dream of!

[learner of liszt]

I suggest you learn to read music. That way, you can learn pieces more easily and accurately. Although there are cases when learning by ear may be useful. For example, if it was a recorded improvisation that you want to learn, playing by ear could be useful there. But other than that, it will probably just cripple your technique.

[quasimodo]

Well as far as I can tell all these what ifs are not the case here. Just utter laziness.

I second that.
Myself, I'm a very poor reader and use my ear a lot. However I force myself to work with scores, because that's the only way to progress in reading as well as in playing.
It's only all that it takes: kick oneself's butt and read music.

[anna_crusis]

I use both ear and sight reading, and I think both are invaluable if not essential.

Playing by ear is great because you can take any melody you've heard (even one from childhood) and work up an arrangement in ten or fifteen minutes. That's a lot of fun, and you also learn a lot about music in the process. It doesn't have to be completely faithfull to the original and, in some ways, that's better.

Sight reading though is the greatest gift I ever could have asked for. Sight reading opened up a whole world for me, just as learning to read as a child changed my life. To be able to pick up a manuscript, look at it and know instantly how to play it is a fantastic thing. To learn a classical piece by ear would be so much more tedious and complicated and time consuming. As someone said, you can take a score anywhere and enjoy reading it, studying it and learning from it.

If you think learning to read music well is not important, you're missing out on so much. It may seem difficult or near impossible at first, but if you think back you'll remember that learning to read was just as difficult. I can vividly remember my sister trying to teach me to read, and it seemed impossible and frustrating. I was the worst reader in the class, and then one day it just started clicking and from then on I never looked back. It's the same with reading music, so just hang in there.