Pantcho Vladigueroff

[voxgabrieli]

everytime i search for a new song to play on the piano i find something i like. but they are famuous and played too much. and many has becomed bored of listening to it that they have heared many times over and over again for many years.

does anyone have any suggestion to early modern or romantic pieces that  i would like to play, but is not the most famuous piece? or maybee other pieces that is hard to find because it is not so known.  it can be any classic category too.

it would be nice if i could find something new i havent heared before.

Hi everybody. I found that old topic here and hope that the links bellow could be useful.

Please take a look here: https://www.editionelm.eu/cpv_e.htm for first editions of works by Pantcho Vladigueroff - the famous Bulgarian composer of XX century. There are 6 books of piano pieces as well as his complete list of works for two pianos in 4 hands / piano duo.

Well, if you search for a new repertoire neither "famuous and played too much" nor "boring of listening" but still classical, let's say "well forgoten" — so that's the point to start looking for!

Best,

Vox

https://www.editionelm.eu/pantcho_e.htm
https://www.editionelm.eu/cpv_e.htm
https://www.editionelm.eu/

[thalbergmad]

I know it shouldn't, but it really winds me up when someones first post is an advert and even more so when they have dug up 3 1/2 year old post to justify posting links.

Maybe it is just me.

Thal

[allthumbs]

I'm with you Thal, it does seem like crass commercialism.

I would hazzard a guess that there is some benefit to be had between the poster and the site advertised.

[thalbergmad]

I have been here for years, but would still not be comfortable in posting an advert.

Thal

Banjo lessons $30 per hour.

PM me for instant booking.

[voxgabrieli]

I have been here for years, but would still not be comfortable in posting an advert.

Thal

Banjo lessons $30 per hour.

PM me for instant booking.

Well done, Thal, well done, Banjo boy! And not even a single word about the music of Pantcho Vladigueroff!?? I'm really surprised!

I entered this wonderful forum just because I found the name of Pantcho Vladigueroff mentioned in that old topic. It was mentioned only once with no response at all. That's why I started this topic now. Because...

1. Vladigueroff is not known for the western world just because he lived in Bulgaria most of his life. Well, this means for you in the West "Behind the Iron Curtain" (do you, banjo boy, know about it!??) where nothing was approachable for you and very very little was understandable!

2. Vladigueroff lived and worked in Germany until 1932 and than moved to his fatherland because of his jewish origin. Yes, he choose Bulgaria instead of... many other possibilities. When in Germany almost all of his works where published by Universal edition. These works written prior to his leaving Germany are known to the musical world, but it is very strange to watch how his works written after this period step by step go down in popularity - undeservedly I would say.

So, do you, banjo boy, know how many concertos for piano Vladigueroff has!? Do you know who was the firs performer of his first concerto!??? Have you ever heard a single note from this composer!?

You, banjo boy, blame me of "crass commercialism" while I speak of music. What to say if someone tries to use piano street's Music Dictionary - he has to pay for single translation. Is this also a "crass commercialism"!?? I wouldn't say so, because we all know that's the way the world moves around. And - fortunately - I don't need any translations.

Vox

https://www.editionelm.eu

[rachmaninova]

Well done, Thal, well done, Banjo boy! And not even a single word about the music of Pantcho Vladigueroff!?? I'm really surprised!

I entered this wonderful forum just because I found the name of Pantcho Vladigueroff mentioned in that old topic. It was mentioned only once with no response at all. That's why I started this topic now. Because...

1. Vladigueroff is not known for the western world just because he lived in Bulgaria most of his life. Well, this means for you in the West "Behind the Iron Curtain" (do you, banjo boy, know about it!??) where nothing was approachable for you and very very little was understandable!

2. Vladigueroff lived and worked in Germany until 1932 and than moved to his fatherland because of his jewish origin. Yes, he choose Bulgaria instead of... many other possibilities. When in Germany almost all of his works where published by Universal edition. These works written prior to his leaving Germany are known to the musical world, but it is very strange to watch how his works written after this period step by step go down in popularity - undeservedly I would say.

So, do you, banjo boy, know how many concertos for piano Vladigueroff has!? Do you know who was the firs performer of his first concerto!??? Have you ever heard a single note from this composer!?

You, banjo boy, blame me of "crass commercialism" while I speak of music. What to say if someone tries to use piano street's Music Dictionary - he has to pay for single translation. Is this also a "crass commercialism"!?? I wouldn't say so, because we all know that's the way the world moves around. And - fortunately - I don't need any translations.

Vox

https://www.editionelm.eu

Not that Thal needs someone to defend him, but you messed with the wrong person. If there is someone on this forum who is very well acquainted with more "obscure" composers, that one should be Thal!
Really, you've just signed up in this forum and don't even try to read other posts to see who are the experts here...?

Well, if you search for a new repertoire neither "famuous and played too much" nor "boring of listening" but still classical, let's say "well forgoten" — so that's the point to start looking for!

Best,

Vox

Please note that if you make a search on "less known composers" or "obscure composers" or something like that, you'll find tons of topics on this subject.
And please, do try to search for "VLADIGEROV". I think you'll be surprised... 

[thalbergmad]

Well done, Thal, well done, Banjo boy! And not even a single word about the music of Pantcho Vladigueroff!?? I'm really surprised!

I entered this wonderful forum just because I found the name of Pantcho Vladigueroff mentioned in that old topic. It was mentioned only once with no response at all. That's why I started this topic now. Because...

1. Vladigueroff is not known for the western world just because he lived in Bulgaria most of his life. Well, this means for you in the West "Behind the Iron Curtain" (do you, banjo boy, know about it!??) where nothing was approachable for you and very very little was understandable!

2. Vladigueroff lived and worked in Germany until 1932 and than moved to his fatherland because of his jewish origin. Yes, he choose Bulgaria instead of... many other possibilities. When in Germany almost all of his works where published by Universal edition. These works written prior to his leaving Germany are known to the musical world, but it is very strange to watch how his works written after this period step by step go down in popularity - undeservedly I would say.

So, do you, banjo boy, know how many concertos for piano Vladigueroff has!? Do you know who was the firs performer of his first concerto!??? Have you ever heard a single note from this composer!?

You, banjo boy, blame me of "crass commercialism" while I speak of music. What to say if someone tries to use piano street's Music Dictionary - he has to pay for single translation. Is this also a "crass commercialism"!?? I wouldn't say so, because we all know that's the way the world moves around. And - fortunately - I don't need any translations.

Vox

https://www.editionelm.eu

OK vox baby you have had your say.

1. I am actually aware of Vladigerov, but i only generally remember composers that had an great effect on me and regretfully, he was not one of them. I do slightly recall his 1st piano concerto being of a romantic nature, but i cannot be sure.
2. I do not know how many concertos he wrote, but i do have scores to four of them, none of which came from that overpriced little site who's link you spammed in your initial post.
3. Not wishing to blow my own trumpet, but it is just possible that i have studied more romantic concertos than you have spots on your butt, but I am prepared to admit that i might be wrong.
4. It was not me that accused you of "crass commercialism" but the next poster.

If you have come here to discuss neglected composers, especially those that have written piano concerti, I for one welcome you with open arms.

If you have come here to try and promote a website, the sooner you are gone the better.

Regards

Thal

[allthumbs]

You, banjo boy, blame me of "crass commercialism" while I speak of music. What to say if someone tries to use piano street's Music Dictionary - he has to pay for single translation. Is this also a "crass commercialism"!?? I wouldn't say so, because we all know that's the way the world moves around. And - fortunately - I don't need any translations.

Vox

https://www.editionelm.eu

Hey, hey, hey.... I deserve all the credit for the 'crass commercialization' alliteration (it even rhymes ).

Thal already gets enough credit around here, so share a little.

Cheers,

allthumbs

[thalbergmad]

Hey, hey, hey.... I deserve all the credit for the 'crass commercialization' alliteration (it even rhymes ).

Thal already gets enough credit around here, so share a little.

Cheers,

allthumbs

HAHA, i did try to get you the credit for that in my point numbered 4 old chap.

You deserve it.

Thal

[allthumbs]

HAHA, i did try to get you the credit for that in my point numbered 4 old chap.

You deserve it.

Thal

Already noted, even gave you a 'brownie point'.

[indutrial]

While I'm not in support of the way the initial poster is conducting himself, I am a big fan of Vladigerov's work and it's good for young pianists to become aware of the rich classical atmospheres boasted by places like Bulgaria and other East European/Post-USSR territories. For most of the sprigs who mill around on this site b.s.ing about Beethoven-this and Liszt-that, the city of Sofia might as well be the tower of Barad-Dur.

Messing with Thal about concertos is indeed dangerous, but I would say that twentieth century music is a general weak spot in his armor (by choice, of course).

[thalbergmad]

You are correct, it is my weak spot, but i have made it my task to rectify this in 2009.

January has not yet finished and i have already visited the concerti of Bowen, Ogdon, Valen, Rubbra & Bloch.

I have to admit that the Concerto Symphonique by Bloch is one of the most stunning pieces of music i have ever heard, so there is hope for me yet.

Any further suggestions to ease me gently into the middle/latter part of the 20th Century would be much appreciated.

Thal

[indutrial]

You are correct, it is my weak spot, but i have made it my task to rectify this in 2009.

January has not yet finished and i have already visited the concerti of Bowen, Ogdon, Valen, Rubbra & Bloch.

I have to admit that the Concerto Symphonique by Bloch is one of the most stunning pieces of music i have ever heard, so there is hope for me yet.

Any further suggestions to ease me gently into the middle/latter part of the 20th Century would be much appreciated.

Thal

None are latter 20th century works, but I've been thoroughly enjoying several concertos from 1920s-1950s French composers (Poulenc, Milhaud) and the L'Ecole de Paris composers who hailed from other countries (Martinu, Tansman).

Just now, I'm revisiting a recording of Milhaud's first concerto and loving the unusual opening to the second 'Barcarolle' movement, which is initially scored for soprano clarinet, clarinet, and bass clarinet. I'll always think it a shame that some proponents of twentieth century music often thumb their nose at guys like Milhaud and Poulenc, when the truth is that they were simply excellent composers who preferred a bit more grace and elegance in their work.

On a completely different note, I've also been listening to Jolivet's sole piano concerto, which bristles with primeval energy and sometimes even shares qualities with Goldsmith's soundtrack for Planet of the Apes. The recording I have is fairly old, so the latter observation is even more potent. The quiet section embedded in the second movement is very striking.

I'd like very much to hear concertos composed by pianists of the post-Scriabin ilk, for instance Russia's Alexander Mosolov (who wrote one or two), but also Lithuania's Vytautas Bacevicius (who wrote four).

Maybe check out these works, Thal...

[retrouvailles]

January has not yet finished and i have already visited the concerti of Bowen, Ogdon, Valen, Rubbra & Bloch.

How is the Valen concerto? I have had trouble finding a recording of it. I would very much like to hear it, for I enjoyed his piano music quite a bit, especially the Variations.

[thalbergmad]

I have not got a recording old chap, i was just playing around with bits of it and exercising me sight reading non abilities.

Thal

[thalbergmad]

Just now, I'm revisiting a recording of Milhaud's first concerto and loving the unusual opening to the second 'Barcarolle' movement, which is initially scored for soprano clarinet, clarinet, and bass clarinet. I'll always think it a shame that some proponents of twentieth century music often thumb their nose at guys like Milhaud and Poulenc, when the truth is that they were simply excellent composers who preferred a bit more grace and elegance in their work.

Thanks old chap, i think Milhaud is totally unknown to me so i will give him a go.

Back to the 19th century, i have spent a rather delightful hour listening to the Malling & Schytte concertos again, the latter of which is truly "immense".

Thal

[argerichfan]

January has not yet finished and i have already visited the concerti of ...  Ogdon ... Rubbra

Ogdon is one of my pianistic idols, and I very much love the Rubbra symphonies.  How are their concertos? 

[thalbergmad]

Out of the two, the Ogdon is more pleasing to my romantically tuned ears, as it is more like the demonic crowd pleaser concerti that i love. I don't know how anyone could play it, as it is obscenely difficult. I struggled with the first chord.

I am advised that the Rubbra symphonies are far superior than his concerti, so perhaps i should listen to those instead.

Thal

[argerichfan]

Odgon recorded his concerto and I'd give my left you-know-what to locate that recording.  Was on EMI I believe, long OOP.

The Rubbra symphonies are profoundly magnificent.  Methinks you would love them.  Unlike some of my church music buddies, I've never cared for his Ab setting of the Anglican canticles, composed before his conversion to Catholicism. 

[richard black]

Odgon recorded his concerto and I'd give my left you-know-what to locate that recording.  Was on EMI I believe, long OOP.

It's not actually all that rare. I've got a copy somewhere. I think it's coupled with Shostakovich 2, so they did manage to sell a few copies! I have a feeling Mark Gasser performed it a few years ago, or maybe he was going to and it fell through - anyone remember?

[retrouvailles]

On topic, Ludmil Angelov will be releasing a set of the complete Vladigerov piano concertos very soon. I believe it will be coming out on the Toccata label, but I could be wrong. It would be best to check his website. I just wish the sheetmusic for these gems (I've heard [almost] three of them) was easier to acquire.

[thalbergmad]

That is interesting, i knew he had performed some of them but was not aware he had recorded them.

Look forward to that.

Thal

[voxgabrieli]

Well, well, well... it seems there will be no banjo lessons!?... Pity!..

Seriously now - Thal, I'm speaking of music indeed. Please do not call my initial post "commerce" or something. If someone is trying to make money out of Vladigueroff's works he has to be a ghost - nothing perishable in his "business". 

For those that required more about Panthco Vladigueroff here are some links:

— His life in brief and his Herder Prize:
https://www.editionelm.eu/pantcho_e.htm

— Longer bio with some of his works like piano concerti, opera etc.:
https://www.tsanoff-classic.com/TheGreatestBulgarians/PanchoVladigeroff/

— "The Intellectual Legacy of Pancho Vladigerov" Foundation and his House-museum
https://www.vladigerov.org/

— and lots about him and his works in Wikipedia: (different texts for each language! 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Vladigerov
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Vladiguerov
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantscho_Wladigerow
https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Vladigerov
https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pancho_Vladigerov
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Владигеров,_Панчо
https://bg.wikipedia.org/wiki/Панчо_Владигеров

PS My sources!? Google!