Michael Nyman - Big my secret

[presto agitato]

Do you know this composition?

This piece is so beautiful and also sad 

Here´s a video with the score

Hope you like it:

[retrouvailles]

This kind of film music (even if its a transcription) should stay where it belongs: the film, not the concert hall. Michael Nyman is really one of the least inspired concert music composers today. His film music is just ok, but still not worthy of being performed as a piece of serious music.

[quantum]

The music from the film never really was intended to sound like concert music.  The character who played it was more of a peasant, and Nyman wrote the music to fit the circumstances.

[retrouvailles]

The music from the film never really was intended to sound like concert music.  The character who played it was more of a peasant, and Nyman wrote the music to fit the circumstances.

That doesn't make it good, though. It just sounds like just any other piece from the common practice era. Any 1st year composition student, or possibly worse, could write something like that.

[pianisten1989]

it's kind of unintresting, and very cliché...

[Petter]

That doesn't make it good, though. It just sounds like just any other piece from the common practice era. Any 1st year composition student, or possibly worse, could write something like that.

So what makes music good? Care to enlighten us?

[quantum]

That doesn't make it good, though. It just sounds like just any other piece from the common practice era. Any 1st year composition student, or possibly worse, could write something like that.

Is there anything wrong with a 1st year student's compositions?  Does the lack of sophistication or compositional experience devalue a piece?  Does one have to write "great" sounding works all the time?

I find this piece quite suitable for the context of the film. 

[pokeythepenguin]

[retrouvailles]

Is there anything wrong with a 1st year student's compositions?  Does the lack of sophistication or compositional experience devalue a piece?  Does one have to write "great" sounding works all the time?

I find this piece quite suitable for the context of the film. 

For the record, I have played many first year students' works. The lack of sophistication and compositional device CAN devalue a piece, to some extent. Sure, simplicity can be a virtue, but the composer must have a point to it. I believe music should match the times in one way or another.

[presto agitato]

More opinions?

[retrouvailles]

More opinions?

No.

[imbetter]

It's not even one of the better film scores I've heard actually.

[rob_the_dude]

It's not as good as the one in the HSBC advert for us Brits  It's meant to be about sheep or something as well. link anyone??

Just mentioning Michael Nyman on here would start an argument, just like talking about the forbidden Ludovico Einaudi 

Oh, and, this is crap (in my humble opinion)

[presto agitato]

Negative opinions, however i do believe that its a very nice piece.

[nanabush]

I'd have to agree.  It is a really nice piece. 

It's such a biased argument to say that this has 'no compositional' value.  Look at Bach's C major prelude bk1... it is pretty much broken chords for two pages.  I'm sure there are many first year students who could write something with a similar effect, but simply because it is stapled to Bach's name, no one will devalue it.

I find that anything tonal written in the late 20th century gets criticized, because it has banging-on-as-many-keys-as-possible "new movement of music" crap to compete with.

Because Nyman is a film composer, so many people jump the gun on saying "his stuff has no inspiration, he's only cranking these out for a deadline, no compositional value, etc". 

[retrouvailles]

I find that anything tonal written in the late 20th century gets criticized, because it has banging-on-as-many-keys-as-possible "new movement of music" crap to compete with.

Wrong. That would have been said if this were the 1950s-early 1970s, but that isn't the case anymore. Actually, a good majority of composers, including those that are accepted as being "great" today, write using tonality (in the broad sense). And many do it well. Nyman does well at using tonality in some of his works. However, this piece is something I would just throw in the easy listening pile, and I wouldn't consider it one of the greatest works of the 20th century by ANY stretch. It is just a nice sounding piece, which is a merit in itself, but does it really do much more than sound nice? That is where the criticism lies, not in that it is tonal in days where, according to your wrongly informed judgment, tonality is forbidden. Listen to more late 20th century music to change your skewed opinion.

Because Nyman is a film composer, so many people jump the gun on saying "his stuff has no inspiration, he's only cranking these out for a deadline, no compositional value, etc".  

While that may be true about some people's criticisms, that is sometimes the truth with film composers. That isn't always a problem, mainly because of the purpose of film music. It is composed to be commercial music, not concert music, and it is meant to serve one purpose: to underscore the action of film. If it takes on a life beyond the film into people's repertoires, good for it, but that probably wasn't the initial intention of the composer. You must understand that composers only have 3-5 weeks to write a film score after getting the film from the director to write approx. 45 minutes of music, so some things need to be sacrificed to make the music functional. So yes, a lot of times, there really IS no compositional value in film music (with regards to its value in the concert music realm), and that is just the sad truth of a lot of film scores.

[nanabush]

I'm not trying to argue with people here, but no one here said that this was a great work of the 20th century.  As soon as someone says its a nice piece of music, people come from all sides and tear the piece apart.

I know my comment about the atonal stuff was a bit skewed   , but STATING that Nyman's music is pretty much worthless and demeaning to perform is also a really skewed opinion.

also: by the looks of your first two posts, you seem the type to argue to no end, other than to troll.  The original poster probably doesn't care if you deem it worthy or not, but was just saying it was a nice piece.

[retrouvailles]

I'm not trying to argue with people here, but no one here said that this was a great work of the 20th century.  As soon as someone says its a nice piece of music, people come from all sides and tear the piece apart.

Well, with my "best of the 20th century comment" I was partially being facetious. Also, just because people say it is a nice piece of music doesn't mean that other people aren't allowed to tear it apart. All music is fair game here. I would also tear up a piece by Rachmaninoff alongside a piece by Nyman if I felt it deserved it, so don't think it's just personal here.

I know my comment about the atonal stuff was a bit skewed  , but STATING that Nyman's music is pretty much worthless and demeaning to perform is also a really skewed opinion.

Well, I never explicitly said that last comment, but rather only hinted at the possibility of it being as such, for my reasons explained below. Like I said, sometimes it is a sad but true consequence.

also: by the looks of your first two posts, you seem the type to argue to no end, other than to troll.  The original poster probably doesn't care if you deem it worthy or not, but was just saying it was a nice piece.

Well, you may consider me a troll, but I just consider myself a passionate critic who stands by his convictions. If people think that is trolling (I'm sure not everyone does), well, frankly, that's their problem, and they don't have to read my posts. I just think I have something meaningful to say every now and then. And isn't that what internet forums are for, to argue?

[pianochick93]

I like it. It sounds nice. As does the music from the rest of the film

Frankly, I don't care whether it uses advanced and eloquent compositional techniques. It sounds nice, and that's what matters to me.