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Topic: Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849 (Read 6563 times)

lelle

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Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849

on: July 14, 2009, 05:08:17 PM

I recently read an analysis of this piece and it made me confused as how to perform measures 85-87 in fuge in c#minor BWV 849

According to the analysis, there is a subject entry here (that I marked with red in the first picture) but it doesn't make 100% sense, considering two voices switch place during the process.

However, according to Sviatoslav Richters famous Wohltemperirte Klavier recording there is no subject entry here (see picture 2 for differences in how he plays the voices to how the analysis thinks it is), he only brings out the secondary theme, and finishes it on an A instead of on an F# that he would've had to if he considered the notes I marked with red in the first picture a subject entry.

Either the blue and red voice cross each other and switch place in measure 86 (pic 1) or they play on without switching place, and in that case there is no subject entry (pic 2). The main subject is colored red and the secondary subject that enters later in the piece is colored blue.

How should I perform this? Alternative 1 or Alternative 2?

EDIT: Updated the pictures for (hopefully) some extra clarity in the different ways the voices would move in the two examples.

c#m_pianostreet_v1.jpg (97.51 kB, 600x294 - viewed 471 times.)

c#m_pianostreet_v2.jpg (90.78 kB, 600x294 - viewed 378 times.)

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perfect_pitch

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Re: Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849

Reply #1 on: July 15, 2009, 12:51:52 AM

Out of curiosity - where or what is the source claiming this???

I only ask since I'm not familiar with this fugue... I understand that the blue looks like an entry (a shortened one by the look of it) but seems fine... the red however...

I'm not sure.

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https://www.youtube.com/c/EpicPianoArrangements (Videos)
https://www.musicnotes.com/sheet-music/artist/epic-piano-arrangements (Sheet Music)

lelle

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Re: Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849

Reply #2 on: July 15, 2009, 06:58:14 AM

The source is a site with an extensive WTC analysis, with audio and an animated score to follow. This is the particular fugue I'm talking about https://www2.nau.edu/~tas3/wtc/i04.html#movie (you will need to have the Adobe Shockwave player installed for this site to work)
Notice how the subject is marked out at measures 85-87

The blue is fine, it is the same in both versions, except that it ends on an F# instead of an A in the first version to accomodate for a red subject entry being there, it is the red one I am unsure about (since you aren't familiar with the fugue, you should keep in mind that the subject is very short, only five notes, and in some cases four when the final "return to the tonic" note is omitted)

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faulty_damper

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Re: Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849

Reply #3 on: July 16, 2009, 03:57:02 AM

You have gotten it incorrect; the alto and tenor lines do not cross at m86. There is a leading tone in the tenor, E#, which leads to F#. However, you marked the F# as the alto voice. Reverse that and you should be fine.

The second image is the correct interpretation.

BTW, I made this same mistake some years ago in another fugue (WTCI B Minor) which lead to a similar confusion.

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lelle

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Re: Is this a subject entry or not? - Bach Fugue in c#m BWV 849

Reply #4 on: July 16, 2009, 12:32:34 PM

Note that the thought of it being in the incorrect way did not even cross my mind until I read that analysis

Thanks for clearing it up for me!

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