PLEASE HELP w/ a highly competitive teacher

[just_me]

Hi, all. I am an adult student. My teacher is highly competitive, w 2 degrees from Juilliard. When he thinks that I'm not performing my best, he throws out lines like "Oh, you're the little engine who just thinks they can..." so that I will rise to the challenge. A companion technique to this is that he ingratiates himself into your life and then uses your personal insecurities or even involvement outside of the studio (the other little projects you may have, like writing your book, even though you've already published...) saying [and sincerely meaning], "Yeah, right you're writing a book."
Here's the problem, I have a pretty severe lung condition and over the past 2 years I've been accumulating complications from other body systems (namely my heart). However, my teacher reads my decreased effort as a lack of will. When I tell him I'm having I had a bad week physically, he reads it as "I just didn't feel like practicing this week." Moreover, when I tell him some of the more outlandish medical stuff going on...there have been times when he thinks I'm making it up or when I tell him that I have a lung infection, if I don't ~look~ like I'm having a more difficult time breathing, he says "Oh, you always have those." (meaning you don't look like it so you probably didn't want to practice this week.)
Here's the thing -- I WANT to rise to the challenge, but I can't discriminate between what is "coaching" versus WHAT IS BEING A BIG F**ing A****** [alternatively, douchebag]. The piano and music in general is a HUGE part of my life. I will always play, but if I'm going to be attacked personally, the stress along with the health condition, I just can't take. My illness is progressive and my teacher knows this. However, b/c my medical therapy is always increasing and I keep that on the down-low, he actually thinks that I'm doing just fine (and, even if I'm not, I suspect he reasons, he wants me to achieve the most I can; I honestly think his motivations are good.) When I try and tell him this, he just doesn't want to hear it, meaning "I'm gonna treat you the same as all my other students." Finally, the whole reason he attacks you personally is as a way of getting your blood moving for an emotionally engaging musical experience. He is doing it so that he sees the fire in your eyes and you WANT to prove him wrong... but personally, as an adult...it seems that responding to that behavior in the way he wants...just gives him a permission slip to abuse you for X amt of time.

I've read tons of books, from Geiseking to the "The Inner Game of Music"  -- is there any book that you guys know of that is related to sports psychology that might match my teacher's "coaching" style??? Is it possible if I talk to him for him not to attack my other projects (honestly, they are what keeps me going (along WITH piano)). I would be able to handle this better if I was able to sort out what was actually personal versus what was productive criticism.

Any insight in this matter is ~greatly~ appreciated!

[lostinidlewonder]

The best teachers in my experience are usually the most likeable people. They all catch the flies with honey, no vinegar in them. They know how to motivate, how to disipline and how to teach in a soft way which produces the biggest results.

Unfortunately some teachers, especially those with a lot of high pressure training, where driven into music in unnatural ways. This can effect their ability to teach when seeing lesser output from their students. Many top class pianists forget that not everyone is at their level or should strive to attain it. Everyone has their own personal musical journey and a great teacher can hone into your musical journey. Those that try to rip you aside and work in a manner that reflects their own model of a perfect student are not good teachers (although this may motivate some students).

With my adult students I never ask them why they haven't practice or even care about their lack of practice. With younger students however you have to because they are learning about what discipline is about. However some adults will need guidance in discipline as well, but the teacher should not feel it their duty to instill this into an adult unless the adult is open to it. And when teaching an adult discipline you simply cannot take the ham fisted authoritive approach that you might take with a young child now and then. Young children need to be directed and bad habits should be highlighted to them and corrected, an adult will feel like a fool if you do the same to them.

Tell your teacher you do not benefit from his brute force motivation style. If a teacher is good, they do not have talk talk talk, in the lesson they will reveal what you need to learn in your music and you will feel motivated to achieve it.

If you have not an efficient discipline to your approach to studying music then you should reveal this to your teacher and not put up a facade that you practice as much as you can. I always tell off my little students who start talking trying to convince me with their words that they have practiced as much as they can. I just say in my head, I am a music teacher, I am here to teach music so lets work with what music we have no need worrying about their inability to find time to practice.

If I notice that the student is constantly not practicing near their efficient rate, then lessons become tougher for them as I force them through practice routines (what they should be doing on their own). The student who practices half-heartedly then understands what it means to practice efficiently at their level with the teacher guiding them through it, a good teacher then will ask the student to practice the next part on their own, the teacher will observe how the student practiced and directs attention to what is most failing. You can do this with adult students who do not practice as well. The lesson becomes more about how to practice and going through it with them. Doing 10 lessons which are always like this start to make the student who doesn't practice effectively realize, maybe I should practice before the next lesson so it wont be such a difficult lesson

If your health prevents you from practicing a lot, then at least during a lesson the teacher should try to train your practice stamina at the keyboard. I have students with disabilities (missing parts of their fingers, mental etc) and must work with what they have. We should encourage the student to work with their disability not become upset that it limits them. We cannot ignore it, or treat all students the same, someone with a disability needs to be nurtured to understand how to work with it. Some problems require rest, people with nerve problems in their arm for instance should immediately stop playing no matter what! Other health problems call for the same action. Often a music teacher has no idea what a student suffers! So how rude is it of us to be annoyed with students who learn at a low efficiency rate because of their challenges!

If the student however is with me because they are studying piano as a career, then we have to be honest what the student wants. If they want to be a performer then there is no soft kindness to their lack of practice, if they want that dream they have to suffer for it. But if the student is learning music so they can enjoy it themselves, perhaps a peformance here and there etc, then there is simply no need to put them in a pressure cooker when they fall behind.

[quantum]

At MTNA 2007 Dr. Randall Faber gave a very compelling talk on motivational teaching.  You may wish to read on some of his research in this field. 

[m19834]

There's a lot about the whole teacher/student interaction and relationship that I, frankly, just don't understand (though I think I am learning).  There are things about past interactions that I have had with individuals where it seemed very twisted and unclear and, even though I improved whilst I was a student, the basic result as far as I was concerned was that I became very twisted up and unclear regarding piano and everything else.  Eventually, that resulted in an absolute halt in my progress in some ways.  I will admit, I would've liked for somebody to sit down and explain it to me, just for my peace of mind and to aid in the ability to move forward in my life.  I think the real killer, above everything else, is that I believed that this individual actually had my best interest in mind (who knows ?), so I kept trying to understand it, learn from it and make some kind of sense out of it.  There are probably some things I will just never understand about that, and if there is some secret code to understanding it, I simply have no idea what it is nor if I will ever make that particular club.

Now, there are things that I think teachers must do to get the most out of their students, but there are lines, and what those are depend on the particular interaction and relationship between student and teacher.  For me personally, if I can't trust my teacher then we may as well part ways.  So, even though I can tell that I don't have all the information that I sense is actually 'there' to be had, I have to trust that my teacher knows what he's doing with me and is sensitive to what's actually occurring for us and for me.  In that regard, on some level their knowledge of who you are simply *has* to be personal, I believe, because otherwise they don't actually know how their actions are effecting you.  I believe that teachers somehow have to see inside of you in a way that is very unique to that particular interaction and they must somehow know how to 'handle' the most fragile to the toughest aspects of your being (it's a learning experience, of course).  

If the interaction is right, world after world can open up, it seems, and more and more freedom is found in that (hopefully that will happen in some way for both individuals).  I think that these worlds can open up and these freedoms can be found under even pretty strange circumstances ... for example, I will take a raving lunatic (which, just for the record, my current teacher is NOT) who tells me everything on their mind like they are selling it for gold over the twisty turny, incredibly shady experiences of my past.  I can handle people being hard on me because to me, it shows me that they believe in me.  I would much, much prefer that over somebody just not caring and just put time in because it's their job.  

I think what it comes down to though is whether it's actually opening things up for you or whether it's closing things down, and that can be tricky to discern sometimes if you are really still gaining experience with that.  A teacher may try to open you up emotionally and that might actually be necessary, but anymore, in my opinion, it doesn't count towards something positive unless they are ALSO making sure you have the tools to deal with those things that get opened up (and aside from the mental and emotional capacity, I am meaning, specifically, pianistic and musical technique at the instrument).  That is part of why it takes a teacher with a compatible soul, they somehow have to empathize with you (whether they show it or not).

I don't know if your situation is the right one for you, but obviously you can't let it kill you  .

[go12_3]

If I was in your situation, I'd change teachers if this is emotionally and physically bothering you.
We have the power to change things in our lives and not let something take control over us and making us miserable. 

[avguste]

change teachers.
Where are you located?I may be able to recommend a teacher

[go12_3]

...

[gremlokes]

Honestly, he sounds like a complete A-hole. We've all known teachers like that, there is a time and a place for them and that is for uni students who are aiming for a career in professional teaching. I would very strongly advise you to CHANGE TEACHERS!! A  lesson should leave you feeling good about yourself and motivated to do what you can to improve, not guilty or resentful. There are lots of fab teachers out there, they all have a slightly different style and some of them will or won't suit. Please don't let one idiot wreck your journey.

Josie

[fernando57]

There is nothing easy about piano.

First ask yourself a question , why do you play piano? and what is you spectasion.

Enjoy it every second.

If you want to get better, you need some who knows more than you and is better, and that will be honest enough to tell you about your lows, and that you are open to listen to the critical comment.

If the teaches is not part of your spectasion, then change something.
good luck
Fernando

[jeff_clef]

I found it personally pretty hard to hear your description of what it's like with your teacher, just_me.  You got some good and thoughtful answers, although it sounds to me like you answered your own question.

You have enough problems without getting beat up at your piano lesson.  If it were me, I would change teachers.  It may help you to do a little writing project, while it's fresh in your mind: make a list of things you're looking for in a teacher, and list another of things you DON'T want (I would include browbeating and hurtful personal remarks on that side of the list).

It may be a good time to also write about your personal goals as a musician.  This might be a good thing to share with your prospective teachers.

While you're at it, why not make a concise list of questions to guide you when you're interviewing teaching candidates?  They may tell you the information without your asking, but it would help you to make sure you know, and they know, where you are and where you want to go with music.

Good luck with this!

[CC]

Look here; you are an ADULT, so react like one.  There are any number of solutions to such problems; if you think the problem is caused by your teacher, solve it!  Why let it bother you?  Beat him at his own game!  If it is YOUR fault (reacting negatively to good advice), you will need to solve it yourself -- the teacher is not to blame. Solutions?  like what??
(1) separate out the teaching from the beating.  Is the teaching worth the beating?  If it is, take the beating (there are easy ways to ignore it) and benefit from the teaching -- you will be happy that you are getting your money's worth.
(2) if there is abusive beating going on that is negatively affecting you, find ways to shut it off:
  (a) openly discuss the abuse with other students or even the teacher himself about the abuse; ask if the method is doing any good. make sure the teacher knows that you are discussing with others (Sir, I discussed what you told me yesterday with John and he says he gets the same treatment and doesn't like it -- or, I notice you beat me up mercilessly just to motivate me -- do you think it is working, and do you think that students enjoy and get motivated by such methods? What are the best ways to beat up a student?  I eventually want to teach, so I would like to know the answers --  etc.), because that's the whole point; let him know that the subject is now open for free discussions by everybody. Sunshine and transparency can do wonders whereas hiding abuse is the surest way to keep it going forever.
  (b) if you are negatively affected, SHOW it; can't play nicely anymore -- go on strike! look sad, unmotivated.  let out a huge sigh; let him know how you feel.  learn some acting and have fun practicing the art of communicating via motions and facial expressions. Perk up and play well only when the abuse stops.  Try to condition the teacher to react like a Pavlov dog that does what it was conditioned to do.
(3) Empower yourself; as an adult, you need to control your environment, not the other way round, especially because you have health problems and you need to protect yourself. Look, an abusive anybody is below your cultural level -- why lower yourself and be affected by it?
(4) Unfortunately, abusive teaching often means less than optimum teaching; thus if you think that the abuse is materially affecting the quality of teaching, it might be time to change teachers.  In any case, YOU are in control; if you are not psychologically in control, all kinds of terrible things can happen.

Good Luck.

[m19834]

Greetings ,

I am somehow convinced that somewhere, maybe here in this world but perhaps at least in some other, it is possible and even desirable for student and teacher, individual and individual, to come together in the name of Music alone.  I am convinced that there is enough about life, there is enough about living, there is enough about music, there is enough about the instrument itself, and there is enough about Soul, for two people to have an infinitely substantial connection and purpose together based and rooted in some common goal within that, and that this can be unadulterated for an entire human lifetime.  It is my impression that if the interaction becomes 'about' psychological games and whom can trick whom into what, the main goal is either not shared (has never been truly shared) or has sadly become lost or seemingly polluted.  

[orangesodaking]

Plain and simple: change teachers (if there is another good teacher around).

If there isn't, then I don't know what to tell you. How come your medical treatments are on the down-low?

[peterjmathis]

Definitely change teachers. None of this is helping you, piano-wise or health-wise. I know it might be difficult to go out and find a new teacher if you're having health problems, but it would be better to put your effort into finding a new teacher than trying to please this one, who sounds like he just wants to be abusive.

You shouldn't have to put up with derogatory comments about your life or your health.

[666666]

Sadly, many performers just aren't cut out to be teachers.  The number of degrees a performer has, and the ability to communicate what the performer knows are completely different.  Plenty of teachers get away with mediocre lessons because of the piece of paper on the wall.

My suggestion is, choose a teacher based on their TEACHING ability, instead of their PERFORMANCE ability and/or highest level of education.  All fields of teaching require a degree in teaching, except music.  In music one can either earn performance OR pedagogy.  Rarely both.  Let's look at it this way, Lady Ga Ga is a great performer, also excepted into Julliard at a young age, would you expect her to be a great teacher?  It's all a show, and sadly, you've bought into this guy's gimmick.  Perhaps, he wishes he was off performing with Lang Lang instead of stuck teaching the likes of you?