Piano Forum

Topic: Accidentals, dotted barlines, and different clefs  (Read 1806 times)

Offline shivasage

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 2
Accidentals, dotted barlines, and different clefs
on: January 11, 2010, 10:30:10 PM
Hello,

I'm learning Debussy's Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir and a part of it (m. 28, to be exact) has raised the following questions:

(This one I'm pretty sure I know the answer to, but I have to make sure)
1) Do dotted barlines reset accidentals, like normal barlines? I'm pretty sure the answer to this question is NO.

2) If a note is repeated, but written in a different clef, do accidentals carry over?
Here's the details: To start off, the key signature is 4 flats (i.e. B, E, A, D). In m. 28, the B-flat above middle C is double-flatted in the right hand. Then, in the same measure (although it's after a dotted barline, which is why I asked the first question, though I think it shouldn't matter), the left hand comes up into the treble clef and plays that same B above middle C. Is it a B-flat or a B-double-flat? I've always played it as a B-double-flat, but after watching a youtube video of Michelangi playing it, I'm pretty sure he's playing a B-flat.

In the same measure, when the left hand is still in the bass clef, the B-flat BELOW middle C is double-flatted in the left hand. Then, after the left hand goes into the treble clef, it plays that same note. Again, I've always played it as a B-double-flat, but now I'm not so sure, and I can't see what Michelangi plays. In the first chord, in the bass clef, the G above middle C was flatted, and then in the second chord, in the treble clef, that G has a natural sign next to it. This makes me come to the tentative conclusion that if a note is repeated in a different clef, accidentals carry over as long as it's in the same hand. Of course, the only problem is, if I'm right, the second chord has a B-double-flat as the lowest note and a B-flat as the highest note, but I guess that's not so bad...Anyway, this is all based on Michelangi playing that B-flat. If he's wrong, then I would say accidentals carry over to different clefs regardless of hand, and then we have two B-double-flats.

Here's the score: https://imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/c/c0/IMSLP00509-Debussy_-_Preludes__Book_1.pdf. Go to page 14, and m. 28 is the one where it says "En animant."

Thank you,
Sasha

Offline prongated

  • PS Silver Member
  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 817
Re: Accidentals, dotted barlines, and different clefs
Reply #1 on: January 11, 2010, 11:52:03 PM
I'm learning Debussy's Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir and a part of it (m. 28, to be exact) has raised the following questions:

(This one I'm pretty sure I know the answer to, but I have to make sure)
1) Do dotted barlines reset accidentals, like normal barlines? I'm pretty sure the answer to this question is NO.

Wow...I just checked my Alfred audition (edited by the controversial Maurice Hinson) and he actually put in a solid barline there - not dotted barlines! So weird...makes it easier to understand though ^^

Offline shivasage

  • PS Silver Member
  • Newbie
  • ***
  • Posts: 2
Re: Accidentals, dotted barlines, and different clefs
Reply #2 on: January 12, 2010, 03:33:21 AM
Wow...I just checked my Alfred audition (edited by the controversial Maurice Hinson) and he actually put in a solid barline there - not dotted barlines! So weird...makes it easier to understand though ^^

Well, it would make my following questions obsolete. But to go from a dotted bar line to a solid bar line is a drastic change indeed, since, by my understanding, dotted bar lines are just used as guidance and don't have any tangible effect...sort of like courtesy accidentals, which, I might add, I despise. Screw it...I just hate key signatures.
 

Logo light pianostreet.com - the website for classical pianists, piano teachers, students and piano music enthusiasts.

Subscribe for unlimited access

Sign up

Follow us

Piano Street Digicert