Beethoven Sonata 32 1st movt for furtwaengler

[slow_concert_pianist]

As with my other post, this recording is terrible - sounds little better than a wax disc with extreme distortion at high volume.

The objective of this post is not to "upstage" in any way but more to back up some of my comments. On balance it is not even close to your standard furtwaegler, but I am hoping this will give you some good ideas for the future in line with my comments.

https://www.box.net/shared/bo8loqckv7

[pianowolfi]

I must say, in this recording I miss everything that I found present in Furtwänglers recording: (mostly) correct rhythm, the overall concept, the fire, the spirit... it's quite strange to listen to this after having read your comments (which I found pretty interesting btw.) on the other recording,  I find that you do many of the mistakes that you criticized there, for instance lots of tempo changes in the introduction. The trills are not clear. The rhythm is not correct, for instance the eighth notes in the first bars are double dotted and followed by 32nd notes, not sixteenths. You don't do the sf's and sfp's. The runs in the Allegro are not worked out and drowning in pedal. A constant tempo in the allegro is completely missing. And many parts of the allegro sound like you were just sightreading them for the, well let's say perhaps fifth time or so (or 100th time, actually it doesn't make a difference)
Though, it's interesting to compare these two attempts, Furtwängler's and your's. Of course Furtwängler's is not "perfect" but it's Beethoven and it's definitely op. 111 and it has inspiration.And he has shown a lot of courage to present his own approach.


Whereas actually, for this I would like to just send you back to the practice bench  

And (P.S.) take care, I hear that you must be very stiff and tense in your wrist and maybe also other parts of your arms and hand. So practice bench yes, but look for a very relaxed technique!

And now you can go and search my own rec in the audition room, if you want, and shred it (or not)

 

[slow_concert_pianist]

I must say, in this recording I miss everything that I found present in Furtwänglers recording: (mostly) correct rhythm, the overall concept, the fire, the spirit... it's quite strange to listen to this after having read your comments (which I found pretty interesting btw.) on the other recording,  I find that you do many of the mistakes that you criticized there, for instance lots of tempo changes in the introduction. The trills are not clear. The rhythm is not correct, for instance the eighth notes in the first bars are double dotted and followed by 32nd notes, not sixteenths. You don't do the sf's and sfp's. The runs in the Allegro are not worked out and drowning in pedal. A constant tempo in the allegro is completely missing. And many parts of the allegro sound like you were just sightreading them for the, well let's say perhaps fifth time or so (or 100th time, actually it doesn't make a difference)
Though, it's interesting to compare these two attempts, Furtwängler's and your's. Of course Furtwängler's is not "perfect" but it's Beethoven and it's definitely op. 111 and it has inspiration.And he has shown a lot of courage to present his own approach.


Whereas actually, for this I would like to just send you back to the practice bench  

And (P.S.) take care, I hear that you must be very stiff and tense in your wrist and maybe also other parts of your arms and hand. So practice bench yes, but look for a very relaxed technique!

And now you can go and search my own rec in the audition room, if you want, and shred it (or not)

 

Your ears are better than mine & (what you said) certainly did not follow the way I felt during the performance. The recording was not meant to “upstage” in anyway. I disagree with your appraisal (except about the allegro – yes I agree), but Furtwängler may gain nothing from it so what you have said is useful.

It would be pointless tidying up the areas I feel require improvement, as the opening will not change in any way. I like what I did. If you don’t too bad lol .

[furtwaengler]

Ouch...

Thank you for your help, but you really should not have posted this recording, Steve. Your constructive comments on my thread make sense (except for the lack of interest in the last movement ?). Why discredit your words by posting this poor, unthoughtful, unstudied, sight reading? It's tempting to lose respect for your advice when it is revealed in your recording that you do not even distinguish what Beethoven has written, or rather blatantly fail to honor it. It demonstrates a lack of respect for his music, and I happen to care a great deal for this music.

It would be pointless tidying up the areas I feel require improvement, as the opening will not change in any way. I like what I did. If you don’t too bad lol .

 ! No, no, no, no, no...Please do not type such things. You are demeaning yourself. This is not what Beethoven wrote; you're playing a different piece. But these words...don't do this to yourself. Did you really mean that or was this an emotional reaction to Pianowolfi's comments? You MUST have a higher standard then this. I am weary of the thought of that big list of music you're rehearsing. On the one hand you've got a lot on your plate, and no time to put together Beethoven's last sonata, but on the other hand if this is how you treat the music your working on, you are doing a disservice to yourself and to this music. Why not rather tone it down and pick only a few pieces and really focus on them? Instead of all the ballades, choose just one ballade and so on. With hard work and patience you may get the respect you seem so eagerly seeking. Only put a big blurb list if you can back it up (think Perfect Pitch - HE can back it up!). Otherwise, you'll find the opposite of what you're seeking.  

Okay, okay, enough of that...back on 111. In my performance I did not achieve my technical goals, but for a first performance of op. 111! I played it because I had something to say about the piece, and I actually did achieve the basic dramatic goals of my conception at the time, which is a real achievement. But this came with an awful lot of concentrated thought and labor. You cannot just read through a score and post the results on Pianostreet. People will tackle you. Also, I must emphasize that there can be no understanding of the role of this movement of op. 111 without knowing and understanding (and loving!) the 2nd movement's arietta and variations. It's the reason I refused to break mine up into separate downloads but to keep it all in a single file, as it happened (warts and all ), because the two are one, indelibly linked, and it is this contrast and the extremes of each that make the piece.

Incidentally I don't know when I'll venture to play it again. It took so much out of me; it wiped me bare. I joked on my thread about starting a support group for those who've been so emotionally invested in the piece. But seriously...That Maestoso broke out with a force of adrenaline which made it seem another spirit was controlling me, and I was just along for the ride (it is *hard* to control adrenaline, and Shostakovich's Cello Sonata played prior did not help me out in this!). I got near the end of the finale so quickly, thinking "the trills are here already?" I remember after taking my bows at the end I crashed in the green room, and I sat in this chair in the dark room with this blank stare, in a total fog. I'll bet 5-10 minutes went by before I allowed anybody in the room...They had to drag me out, and then I couldn't really talk straight or form complete sentences. My mind was completely empty, blank. THIS is what it's like to play op. 111 in concert! It felt like I had fallen asleep and awakened 300 years later (hard to describe). It was all amazing, but I don't know when I can go through it again. If that time comes though, I'm sure I'll have much better control over myself (and my hands ).

(Also with the fear that my recording may have been the first time certain people have heard op. 111, horror of horrors I put forth this thread: https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php?topic=35670.0 Don't listen to my recording...listen to some of those suggestions and then mine will be in it's context )

(Sorry to respond indirectly to your comments on my thread instead on this thread. It's better that mine rest a while.)

(And really, thank you for taking an interest and posting comments. That takes courage to.)

(Enough with the ellipses)

()

 

[birba]

how can you expect anyone to take seriously what you just posted?!  i mean where did you find the courage to present this?  there's absolutely nothing good to say about it.   watch out! i think beethoven has not only rolled over in his grave, he's out to get you!

[goldentone]

That was a post of excellence, Furtwaengler.

[birba]

i agree, but i think it's like talking to the wind.