Which audition pieces?

[dahmin]

Hello,

We're preparing audition for our daughter who is age 8. I teach her at home informally for about a year now and she yet to take any exams. But we think it can be a good experience for her to try on the auditions for RCM junior department, and junior Guildhall whether she makes it or not.  And she's keen on the idea as well.

We're thinking the two contrast pieces can be Bach's Prelude in C Major and Burgmuller's Arabesque.

What do you think?
Will Prelude be too long for audition?
And what other pieces you think can be good for audition?

Thank you in advance.

[avguste]

I would have to hear her and see her level to be program specific.
However to answer your questions

1. I like the idea of those two pieces

2. the prelude shouldn't be too long, although that really depends on the max time allowed per person. At worst case, the judges may just stop her and ask her to play the 2nd piece.

3. As I wrote at the beginning, to give repertoire advice, I would really have to hear her and see her play.

[dahmin]

Thank you very much for your reply, avguste.

I'll make recordings and post them up this week for you to see.

[avguste]

Although recordings would work,the best would be live on Skype.
Also, I am leaving in 2 days for 2 weeks of concerts, masterclass and adjudication.

If it is posted by Tuesday, I would be able to listen, otherwise it would have to be after March 7th

[dahmin]

Skype is an innovative idea of teaching piano!... though we may have a time different issue here.  We're in London while you're in Texas.

Anyway, we made the videos:

They're not perfect and my daughter is still in need of more practice

Please provide some feedback in your convenience.
Thank you very much.

[lostinidlewonder]

Thank you for those videos, by watching your daughter play I can see she enjoys it very much which is good to see! A few things that came to my attention. Firstly, I think your daughter is stilling too low at the piano and a little too close. The knees should be just under the keyboard, she should be sitting on the edge of the seat and the arms should be parallel to the ground when the hands rest on the keys.

For the Bach I suggest practicing with a metronome to ensure that you play everything evenly and in time, there are microscopic pauses in the playing which are probably from the sight reading but they do disservice to the music, practice them away or memorize the parts that cause that to happen and it will improve the sound a lot more. Be careful also not to cause a break in sound and maintain the legato effect you are playing with when you start a new bar, sometimes I hear slight breaks in sound. Also notice how when you play octaves the sound is reinforced and naturally rises in volume, try to use that in your expression.

The Burgmuller when you play the RH in the opening (and that same pattern throughout) try to treat them as one group, one drop of the hand. Not so much single finger movements, try to control it with one placement of your hand, drop your hand into the first note and push off at the end (with a staccato touch) so it feels like one movement. The Lh opening chord should be more staccato it will interact with the RH more interestingly then. When the LH takes over the RH pattern from the start, the RH legato line now has to be more stable, it is a little rushed when it plays the faster notes.

The Burgmuller is a grade 1 piece under the AMEB , the Bach is I think around grade 3 someone correct me if I am wrong. I would try to audition with something more advanced than the Burgmuller, the Bach is an ok choice even though it is a very very well known piece so she will have to play it with great confidence and control. Try some children Bartok to contrast it with, it will be a much greater contrast and interest the adjudicators a lot more.

https://imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/1/1a/IMSLP42557-PMLP03084-Bartok-Sz042v1.pdf

[dahmin]

Thank you very much for your reply lostinidlewonder

I appreciate your feedback and agree with everything!
The tempo of the Bach piece isn't stable and there's little hiccupts in between bars.  And LH on the Burgmuller piece needs to be lighter more staccato etc.

Thank you for the pdf though I'm a little scared to have her start a new piece as the audition will be happening in April.

I'll have a look at the pdf with her though

And yea, she enjoys learning the piano and having fun with it is the most important part.

[dahmin]

Thank you for those videos, by watching your daughter play I can see she enjoys it very much which is good to see! A few things that came to my attention. Firstly, I think your daughter is stilling too low at the piano and a little too close. The knees should be just under the keyboard, she should be sitting on the edge of the seat and the arms should be parallel to the ground when the hands rest on the keys.

Oh I have a question about sitting.
I agree with the above that she should sit higher.  But then her feet wouldn't be able to reach the pedal... 
What would you do in that situation?

[lostinidlewonder]

Thank you for the pdf though I'm a little scared to have her start a new piece as the audition will be happening in April.

I'll have a look at the pdf with her though

And yea, she enjoys learning the piano and having fun with it is the most important part.

The Bartok will be something really different to play and it really develops the fingers to play different note qualities which is good. Yes, it is most important that she enjoys it, that's why we learn music isn't it!

I agree with the above that she should sit higher.  But then her feet wouldn't be able to reach the pedal... 
What would you do in that situation?

There is no real solution but letting them grow But I would sacrifice comfortable pedal usage with correct seating posture for the arms and hands. I can still remember as a child myself my legs stretching as far as they could to reach the pedals even standing up to get the pedals sometimes!

[dahmin]

The Bartok will be something really different to play and it really develops the fingers to play different note qualities which is good. Yes, it is most important that she enjoys it, that's why we learn music isn't it!
There is no real solution but letting them grow But I would sacrifice comfortable pedal usage with correct seating posture for the arms and hands. I can still remember as a child myself my legs stretching as far as they could to reach the pedals even standing up to get the pedals sometimes!

We'll give Bartok a go

Haha, yea nothing we can do right now except let her legs grow  

For the Bach prelude piece, she needs to press the pedal, so I'll need to look into how she should sit and reach the pedal at the same time... hmm...

[avguste]

Skype is an innovative idea of teaching piano!... though we may have a time different issue here.  We're in London while you're in Texas.

Anyway, we made the videos:

They're not perfect and my daughter is still in need of more practice

Please provide some feedback in your convenience.
Thank you very much.

The time difference will not be a problem at all for me. I used to live in France so I have an idea of the overall time.
I am usually free in the evenings your time, and during the week of March 15th, I will be free at almost anytime.

Now onto the videos:

To begin let me say that for her age and the amount of time she has been studying she plays very well.
This said a few comments/suggestions if I may:

1. her fingers should be a bit more curved.
2. I would tend to agree with lostinidlewonder about the sitting.
As a recording suggestion, next time would you possibly be able to record her from the side?

3. The Bach does need metronome work. If you have a sophisticated metronome that allows for different rhythms, I would put the sixteenth, otherwise the quarter will do. Just working with the metronome on a daily basis will improve her and the piece quite a bit.

4.Concerning the Arabesque, the first item to deal with will be again the metronome. The sixteenth need to be equal. Also, she should think them as leading toward the eight note. I would tend to agree with lostinidlewonder that is not so much finger work(although finger articulation is important), but more like a small phrase , going from the 1st sixteenth to the eighth.
The next thing is dynamics. Personally I could use more difference between soft, loud, if at all possible.

Personally, living in the USA, I have no idea about the AMEB levels, however as a teacher I would rather for my student to play pieces they have worked on and feel comfortable playing, instead of starting to work on a new pieces within a few month of the competition/concert.
Obviously this also depends on when the competition is.
In addition, for me, giving her level, I find the two pieces chosen to be appropriate.
We want for her to enjoy doing this competition and have a good experience.

Hope this helps, and let me know about the Skype.
I am leaving tomorrow and I will be back on March 7th.
 

[dahmin]

Thank you very much for your reply avguste.  Your feedback is very helpful too.

We'll definitely work on the pieces with metronome on.  And her fingers... mostly definitely need to be more curved This is something I'm quite firm on her but her excuse was she cut her nails too close that day and it's painful to play on the tip parts of the fingers  I said OK

It's not a competition per se but audition to get into one of the saturday courses from those two schools I mentioned above.  They're looking for children with potentials.  So we thought to give it a try.  Well, it'll be an experience for us.  I already told her that it doesn't matter if she gets in or not, just enjoy yourself and learn from the event

We'll consider Skype.  We'll have to figure a proper time.  I'll keep you informed.

Thank you.

[avguste]

any updates?

[dahmin]

Thank you for your interest on the updates

My daughter's audition for the RCM saturday school will be on 31st of March.
She has been practicing with the metronome (not always though) and I'd also like her to focus on the dynamics.
I bought couple books on sight-reading and she's been reading them too.
Hopefully I'll be able to video her playing and upload them this week and get some feedback!

I work in the day during the week and we're rather busy on grocery shopping, house cleaning and such on the weekends.  It's tough but I'm relying on her self-discipline on piano practice.

Will keep you informed

[avguste]

Ok. Looking forward to it.

I am currently back in town and in spring break, so let me know if interested in Skype

[dahmin]

New uploads 

Far from perfect but she has been practicing.
There's still things to be worked on.

[avguste]

well done!!!

-I would get her to sit a bit further. From my point of view, she is a bit too close to the piano.
-is she counting when practicing?
Even if the metronome is on, I believe it is important to count.

[dahmin]

well done!!!

-I would get her to sit a bit further. From my point of view, she is a bit too close to the piano.
-is she counting when practicing?
Even if the metronome is on, I believe it is important to count.

Thank you.

Yea, sometimes we count together and I'd tell her to count in her head when she plays.  She's getting better, but needs to beware of not carrying away when playing in a faster tempo.

Sitting has been an issue.  We put paddings on the stool to raise the level but she's slipping down from it, especially when she uses the paddle for the Bach's prelude piece.  I'm still trying to figure out a way...

[avguste]

I meant counting aloud

[dahmin]

I meant counting aloud

Thanks for the tip.
We've done so and it does help.

[dahmin]

Updates 

My daughter had her audition at the Royal College of Music yesterday.

It was a cold day over here and we were outside trying to pay this parking ticket for a good while.  Her hands didn't get to warm up completely before the audition. 

Anyway, she has done it!  Whether she passes it or not, we are happy that she has experienced it and now knows what it's like to be in an audition and what is required of her in advancing herself in her music study. 

If she passes it, there will be a second audition...
The process is rather long.

Thanks everyone for commenting on this thread.