Piano "schools" of thought

[Bob]

Like one of the preceding posts, I've always wondered what the "Russian" school of piano thinking is.

What are the different philsophies or schools of thought on piano playing?

[bernhard]

In the past, with incredible obstacles to swift communication, isolation led not only to local practices becoming the rule in a certain place as well as practices becoming more and more differentiated between different places. A bit like island ecology and evolution, where isolation produces bizarre plants and animals (think Australia and marsupials).

So up to 50 years ago, you could differentiate between a German school of piano playing, a French school of piano playing, an English school of piano playing and a Russian school of piano playing. They emphasised different approaches to piano technique and different areas of strength in the repertory. (more about that in a moment). Why only these four schools? Why not a Japanese school? Mostly because there was no tradition of piano playing in Japan, and Japanese pianists to be ended up studying with a teacher that paid allegiance to one of the four schools.

However, in the past 20 years (and even before that) as communication bloomed, and as information became widely available, such distinctions pretty much ceased to exist with pianists over the world synthesising all the information and arriving at personal ways of playing that take the best from each school.

As far as I am concerned there is no such a thing as a “national school” of piano playing, and mostly people will use this sort of labelling as a marketing device. “Have lessons with Bernhardovsky, a legitimate representative of the Russian School”.

Have a look here where there was some discussion on this subject:

https://www.pianoforum.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=perf;action=display;num=1070796095

https://www.pianoforum.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=teac;action=display;num=1080170595

Now for the national stereotypes:

Leschetizky (1830 – 1915) claimed he could tell the nationality of a player by just listening to him/her. Here are his conclusions:

English – Good musicians, good workers, bad executants.
Americans – the most spontaneous of the lot.
Russians – The best. Prodigious technique, passion, dramatic power, elemental force and extraordinary vitality.
Polish – Leans more to the poetical side of the music. Originality, refinement, exquisite tenderness, instinctive tenderness.
French – Birds of passage, fly high in the clouds impervious to what lies below. Dainty, crisp and clear-cut in their playing, they phrase supremely well.
Germans – Command respect for their earnestness, patient devotion to detail, orderliness and intense and humble love of their art. But they can be a bit grey.
Swedes – Gentle, talented and sympathetic.
Italians – Italians “love” because they are Italians. But as a rule they cannot play the piano in the very least.


Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[kulahola]

Of course schools are still there. You notice it when you listen to kids playing. I can personally guess the nationality of the kids when i see and hear them playing without making too much mistake. Hearing them is not enough though I need to see the way they articulate, take the chords and so on, which is at the end not always related to the sound produced.... which repertoire they chose as well tells a lot.
A Chinese teacher will teach kids almost only with Beyer.
An American teacher will use Alfred. A Russian will use Nikolaieva. This obviously doesnt produce the same results and you see it in entrance exams.

[Bob]

Ah... interesting ideas.

Kulohola, what are the characteristics of each nationality though?  What do you see being produced, good and bad, with each approach?  What are these approaches -- the pedagogy behind it?

Thanks!

Code: [Select]

Second attempt at those little bottom notes.

[Saturn]

Second attempt at those little bottom notes.

What little bottom notes?  If you're talking about the small text that's contained under some people's forum posts, that's called a "Signature" and can be set by clicking the "Profile" link at the top.

- Saturn

[hans]

Hello,

...
Have a look here where there was some discussion on this subject:

https://www.pianoforum.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=perf;action=display;num=1070796095

https://www.pianoforum.net/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=teac;action=display;num=1080170595

...

I've found this old thread and it is not possible to go to the links Bernhard had given. Anybody knows how to get there?

Greetings
Hans

[pianistimo]

i think the trend is to take the best from all the schools - as bernhard was saying.  a sort of 'international' school.  especially when you have really good students flying here and there - they experience and take home the flavors of every place they go (possibly studying with different teachers).   

i was curious about this when i studied at west chester.  it seems that you can create your own 'school' by serious thought and what works for you.  heavy playing makes the audience tired after a short time.  what impressed audiences in the late 19th century and early 20th no longer works.  just as with cars, you want to see some speed, some flexibility, some gas mileage (stamina), and no jerks when your car switches gears.  (? did i say this) 

[Bob]

Hello,

I've found this old thread and it is not possible to go to the links Bernhard had given. Anybody knows how to get there?

Greetings
Hans

I think those kind of links are lost forever.  Very unfortunate.  That's why it can help to include titles with the links if you want to put that much effort into it.   Someone started making an index, the original index attempt I think, and all that work went down the tubes when the system changed.

A long time ago...
Piano Street was Piano Forum and used those YaBB links.  The forum was updated and the system changed.  All the YaBB links were lost (and still are).  Then Piano Forum became Piano Street, but this time the links were able to convert so their original destination was still in tact.

[alwaystheangel]

A Chinese teacher will teach kids almost only with Beyer.
An American teacher will use Alfred. A Russian will use Nikolaieva. This obviously doesnt produce the same results and you see it in entrance exams.

I'm sorry but what is Beyer? and Nikolaieva?  I have been taught by Suzuki, a chines piano teacher (the best so far) and and american method.  I don't see the difference (well Suzuki because I couldn't read music for 4 years)  Could someone possibly explain them in more detail?

[hans]

@ Bob,

thanks for your reply. What a pity that the links are lost. But with the help of  the search function I've  found some more threads to this subject.

Greetings
Hans

[alwaystheangel]

My appologies for my impatience and probably my ignorance but could someone please explain bayer etc and my previous question? I'ms just boosting the post up so maybe someone can answer the question .
Thanks!
Christina

[bernhard]

@ Bob,

thanks for your reply. What a pity that the links are lost. But with the help of  the search function I've  found some more threads to this subject.

Greetings
Hans

The threads you want are these:

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,1775.msg13699.html#msg13699
(Russian Piano School –  Rachmaninoff’s opinion).
   
https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3366.msg29913.html#msg29913
(Russians x Asians in competition –  “real”martial artists. Different technical and teaching approachs depending on race)
https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,1775.msg40053.html#msg40053
(Russian piano method)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,4340.msg40869.html#msg40869
(Intonatsia – Russian method)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,2602.msg22430.html#msg22430
(Russian teaching method – reading x memorising).

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,3466.msg30666.html#msg30666
(Russian methods - what is a real teacher - definitions of communicator)

https://pianoforum.net/smf/index.php/topic,4002.msg46084.html#msg46084
(m1469 describes the philosophy of a Russian teacher – the pragmatic method and doing wrist locks on students)

I hope this helps.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[bernhard]

I'm sorry but what is Beyer? and Nikolaieva?  I have been taught by Suzuki, a chines piano teacher (the best so far) and and american method.  I don't see the difference (well Suzuki because I couldn't read music for 4 years)  Could someone possibly explain them in more detail?

Susuki was actually a Japanese violinist, who created a most worthwhile teaching method later extended for the piano.

Nikolaieva is the author of a piano method - nothing to tell home about if you ask me - "The Russian School of Piano Playing vols. 1 & 2 - Boosey and Hawkes.

Beyer is the author of a series of books with technical exercises of the most dull kind. Just another monstrosity on the lines of Hanon and Pischna. To be avoided.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[alwaystheangel]

Thank you.  Sounds like a wild party all around eh?

[hans]

Hi Bernhard,

thanks for the links. Great!

Greetings
Hans

[bernhard]

You are both welcome.