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Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress) (Read 7650 times)

Offline perfect_pitch

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Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
« on: April 07, 2010, 12:27:23 PM »
Okay... It's been two months since I uploaded my video playing the Stravinsky Petrushka... now here's a recording of it on a not so nice Kawai - it's decently in tune, but a B!TCH to play on.

I feel this is about 90% of tempo I'm hoping to get it to by Late September, so it is a 'little' bit slower than the proper tempo - but if you've played it before then you'll know how hard this piece really is.

I've got a masterclass with Dr Dorian Leljak who's coming to Perth in a months time - so any help you could give me would be more than appreciated... I'll actually pay attention to it   :)

Any help... any at all.



PS - I would just like to add - the distortion is unfortunately due in part from converting the damn MOV file to a WAV file and then having to convert it to a 128kbps MP3 file so that all 3 movements would fit under the 20Mb attachment limit.

Sheet music to download and print: Three Movements from Petrushka by Stravinsky



Offline lostinidlewonder

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #1 on: April 07, 2010, 01:22:00 PM »
Kawaii can be pretty resistant to play, and to play a pieces with touch requirements like the Trois Movements from Petruska makes it especially challenging. Playing on something with a lighter action like Yamaha can make things heaps easier, especially with pieces you are trying to develop. The recording also is very stingy with the reverb or sustained sound in the room, it makes pedal effects less obvious. Overall you do a fine job a lot of work has been put into this and your playing is to be very commended.

Here is some ideas for the first 2 movements.
1st movement: The main thing is legato ties and your phrasing (especially in the LH from 1:00 onward), it has to be more crisp, they do not sound formed enough things blend into each other you have to be more melodramatic with your ties. You have the notes very accurate which gives you great basis for touch development. There is a need for more lightness I feel, things seem a bit heavy at the moment overall.

2nd movement: Your touch here is much more appropriate overall compared to the 1st movement and many good effects. The opening you need to make a clear difference between the accent > and tenuto _ . With the crescendo part from 0:54, at 1:02 too much energy is lost, it should sustain high intensity. The furioso part the weakness of the > is much more obvious here, it doesn't have that "stabbing" effect especially the last quaver triplet needs intensity.  Adagietto part nice touch. Start of the Andantino part the fill ins needs more body to them and direction to the main note. 2:14 the LH is phrasing is unorthodoxed you must act against playing the LH phrased in couples.2:14-3:12 generate a lighter feel overall as well Lh gets a little heavy. This makes the entry of 3:12 Allegro a little less effective. Cadenza is missing character,
I like how you play the accelerando and rapido passages but make your end of the legato ties more abrupt its too blending (eg: like when Bh plays 11 and the Vivo stringendo) this carries on through to the end just needs more highlighting to the phrasing.

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Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #2 on: April 08, 2010, 11:48:25 PM »
Hey Man... Thanks for the advice so far, good thing is that it's stuff I need to know.

Sometimes when I try to do a pretend performance, I forget about some of the minor areas of detail and sometimes get carried away with the speed.

I think some of the heaviness comes from the fact that the Kawaii that I was playing was ESPECIALLY heavy to play... after the first day I had sore wrists (which is something I haven't had in a while). It's a (really small) baby grand piano and stiff as nails.

I'm hoping to get a better recording on a Shigeru Kawaii which is much, MUCH nicer to play.

Offline dtao12

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #3 on: April 12, 2010, 03:49:50 AM »
Congrats on your ambition to play this great piece. I don't have much to add to the previous commenter -- notes good, but it sounds "heavy" (and it may be that piano). I know the feeling -- something that feels great on one piano seems bogged in molasses on another. Interestingly, I have just today thought I'd like to give the Danse Russe a try. I just read through it and am not sure I can do it justice, but I am at least very familiar with how it "should" sound. Heard Pollini's recording, the speed of which is beyond anything I could ever get my wrists to endure. But basically, my main comment is that even you don't get to the ideal speed, I recommend you strive for a more staccato, lighter, and more whimsical touch, especially in the middle (non-octave) section with the 32nd notes, which (in the orchestral version) reminds me of kids playfully teasing each other. And again in the last page. Try to get as much contrast between the percussive/forte octave chord sections and the soft/light arpeggiated sections. But considering the difficulty, I commend you on posting your progress and wish you the best as you advance toward your goal.
Post-recital -- looking at whole new program
Currently learning:
Schubert: Sonata in A minor, D784
Barber: Excursions
Considering new Bach Preludes & Fugues
& Chopin Sonata #3

Offline scottmcc

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #4 on: April 12, 2010, 10:52:37 AM »
I apologize in advance that I only got to listen to the first few minutes of it.  anyway, I like what you've done so far, and while I recognize that you have some work to do still, especially on the lightness of touch that has been mentioned above, I want to congratulate you on what you have done so far.  keep working, and ignore the trolls who try to distract you elsewhere.

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #5 on: April 12, 2010, 11:49:52 AM »
Well... hopefully, this will prove to people that I am committed to bettering myself...

Got a better recording, with a better microphone - A Zoom H2, although the room was huge and there was a bit of reverb and a small bit of feedback, but the video of Movements 1 & 2 is below...



Thanks everyone for the kind words, and also for the advice. Believe me - I'm doing everything I can to perfect this great piece.

Offline slow_concert_pianist

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #6 on: April 12, 2010, 12:03:31 PM »
If I ever played like you it would be time to give up. Your technique & touch is about where I expected...just like your big mouth. Lower your sights old son and leave the big works for the professionals :o
Currently rehearsing:

Chopin Ballades (all)
Rachmaninov prelude in Bb Op 23 No 2
Mozart A minor sonata K310
Prokofiev 2nd sonata
Bach WTCII no 6
Busoni tr Bach toccata in D minor

Offline mistermoe

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #7 on: April 12, 2010, 12:37:52 PM »
If I ever played like you it would be time to give up. Your technique & touch is about where I expected...just like your big mouth. Lower your sights old son and leave the big works for the professionals :o

people like u make me really angry! you can't imagine. i'm following the discussions on this forum for a while, so i had to listened to your recordings and read your comments. you are not and you will never be on the same level as perfect_pitch.

to perfect_pitch:
i listened to your performance and i liked it. i won't comment on it now as i dont know this piece well.
just please don't let some random guy discourage you! i know art is a very delicate thing and it's really easy to hurt people. so don't listen to this a**.

(haha, strange first post on this forum. so hi everybody here! and hi perfect_pitch ;D)

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #8 on: April 12, 2010, 12:51:02 PM »
just please don't let some random guy discourage you! i know art is a very delicate thing and it's really easy to hurt people. so don't listen to this a**.

HAAA... Don't worry - I don't let wankers like that get to me, in fact - very little EVER gets to me. What that prick needs to understand is that the people on this forum don't come here to get ranked and to say who's better or who's worse - they come here because we're all musicians and pianists and we seek to hear others opinions and learn from others to better ourselves.

This guy obviously doesn't realise that, so I couldn't give a crap what he thinks of me - I really couldn't!

Good to meet you Mistermoe.   

Offline stevebob

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #9 on: April 12, 2010, 01:19:42 PM »
If I ever played like you it would be time to give up. Your technique & touch is about where I expected...just like your big mouth. Lower your sights old son and leave the big works for the professionals :o

Your sadly predictable critique is exactly what I expected.  I now think your pathology goes far beyond Dunning-Kruger Effect; in addition to grossly overestimating yourself, you express malice and spite toward people with ability that exceeds your own.  It reminds me of a blind man railing against those who can see.
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline prongated

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #10 on: April 12, 2010, 04:13:34 PM »
in addition to grossly overestimating yourself, you express malice and spite toward people with ability that exceeds your own.

How about, "...you express malice and spite toward people with ability that FAR exceeds your own."?

Offline furtwaengler

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #11 on: April 12, 2010, 05:33:28 PM »
I admire your detailed precision, perfect_pitch, which I agree is a good focus for this stage of the process. Difficult pianos are difficult to practice on, and really it is good to be able to put in some good practice on a great instrument. My experience is one of very limited involvement with the best pianos, and it has usually been certain concerts on which I've played the best instruments, and this is a pity. As you know, a better instrument has so many more possibilities of color and expression, but such power and control cannot be adequately handled on a whim...I hope you can have a week's experience (or even a couple days) on the piano you'll play for the masterclass.

All this is to say, I wish the people commenting on your lightness of touch took into account the impossibility of surviving these pieces without a lightness of touch(!)...and your are by no means struggling with the endurance (that I can see).  No, I think you are on the right track in mastering an epic program.

Did you ever tract down the orchestral score of Petrushka you were seeking? How has that research affected your work?
Don't let anyone know where you tie your goat.

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #12 on: April 12, 2010, 10:34:21 PM »
and your are by no means struggling with the endurance (that I can see)

Oh good... then I'm hiding it well then   :D

I will hopefully get to play on my teachers Fazioli piano for the masterclass which is just beautiful and I did managed to get hold of the orchestral score - mainly used it to try and work out hidden harmonies between the instruments of the orchestra and focusing on which instruments play the themes to see how well I can imitate their sound on the piano as best as I can... or at least to capture their playing of the melodies.

Offline furtwaengler

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #13 on: April 13, 2010, 06:16:35 AM »
Oh good... then I'm hiding it well then   :D

You know, I sometimes play wearing elbow supports? They give me a sort of confidence boost, take a load off my mind, but I think they actually help physically as well. I've been doing this since a year ago March. For *me* it would be a no brainer in the Stravinsky. It might just be silly.

I'd love to hear you on the Fazioli.

Hopefully I'll find some time for some musical comments. I've also not meant to neglect your Brahms posted some time ago. It deserves more responses. For now, just keep doing what you're doing - Your hard word is paying off.
Don't let anyone know where you tie your goat.

Offline perfect_pitch

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Re: Stravinsky - 3 Movements from Petrushka (Work in Progress)
«Reply #14 on: April 16, 2010, 12:33:58 PM »
Okay... here it is - the third movement of Stravinsky.

Let me FIRST SAY, that I am not proud of this video... but I put it up so that I can ask for help on the parts which are (how shall we put it) suffering worse than the rest...



Plus - I won't get a decent chance to video my pieces until July now that the first term holidays are over. Hopefully by then they are all up to a much, MUCH better standard.