Different hands with different touch

[sym39]

I am a mature student with only a few years of piano study and need assistance with how to play one hand softly and the other strongly (p & f) at the same time. At the moment, I am supposed to play left hand softly and the right fairly strongly and am unable to do this.  I am trying a simple exercise given by my teacher: Left hand C to G and back to C softly, then the right hand strongly, then both together but it is just not working: The result is either both soft or both loud.  Will someone please help with possibly some exercises. Strangely enough, I can play staccato with one hand and 'whatever' with the other but that is possibly with the same pressure of touch.
sym39

[m19834]

Try "shadow playing" with the LH -- that is, make a motion with your LH as though you are actually playing, but don't actually play anything at all (don't depress the keys, even, just let your fingertips sit on top of the keys and make the motion with the rest of the apparatus as you normally would).  Once you get the hang of that, then just play the LH a little louder (depress the keys a bit more) than not playing anything at all.  Of course, let the RH go on as it normally would.

[sym39]

Thank you K for this suggestion. I spent some time on it yesterday and still find it difficult as now the RH wishes to depress lightly, however, I will persevere. sym39

[m19834]

Ok, as I am remembering now, I actually took just one note at first.  My whole life seems to be turning into a series of baby steps, lately ... haha.  Anyway, nothing wrong with baby steps .  Just take one note in the RH, and shadow play with the LH -- instead of thinking in terms of passages or whatever.  Try that and even play that one note RH alone, first, so you establish the sound you want.  At first you might need to just let the RH be "loud" and not worrying about shaping the sound or giving it any nuance or whatever.  Just get the basic structure in your body so you can start to really feel the difference (and hear a stark difference) when your hands are doing different things.  It's a strange sensation at first, and our brains try to tell us that we are doing two different things and our ears try to tell us that we are hearing two different things, but eventually it becomes one idea and it gets easier (with practice).

[dss62467]

Oh, I like that suggestion.   I've had trouble with this myself, though it is getting better.  It's a bit like rubbing your head and patting your stomach....

[sym39]

Karli, I thank you again; I think this exercise might get me somewhere.  I have tried it tonight - a lot on concentration and slowly. I am playing RH, RH, LH, LH, meaning each note twice. This is the best advice so far. More practice tomorrow. sym39

[m19834]

Yes, sure .  Of course, I am most happy if it gets results .

[rmbarbosa]

I dont know if this helps, but try left hand with your fingers a bit less curled than your right ones if you wish to play left hand less loud.
Best wishes
Rui

[brogers70]

I had this same problem. My teacher suggested similar exercises and I did not find them helpful in the least. What I did find useful was simply concentrating my attention on the line or voice that I wanted to emphasize - when I aimed for the sound, my hands figured out what to do on their own to produce it. But when I was concentrating on how to move my hands with different amounts of force and all that, I just ended up with cramped, tensed hands and a harsh, unpleasant sound. Try just relaxing and have a clear mental image of the sound you want to produce.

[m19834]

Try just relaxing and have a clear mental image of the sound you want to produce.

The 'pat' answer to all musical problems in the world --the only true method for anything pianistic and musical -- the real secret to success .

[sym39]

Thanks for all efforts (Karli, rmbarbosa and brogers70).  Today, teacher said: You will have to try harder.  And, that, I will.  I will have to wait until the neurons divide and instruct each hand to work independently - practice, practice & practice. sym39

[timothy42b]

The 'pat' answer to all musical problems in the world --the only true method for anything pianistic and musical -- the real secret to success .

Ah, the InnerGameofTennis approach.

Works superbly if you have that learning style hardwired into your brain.

Fails utterly if you do not.

And since so many teachers do have that style, they will never believe it doesn't work for you, simply accuse you of doing it wrong.   

[m19834]

Ah, the InnerGameofTennis approach.

Works superbly if you have that learning style hardwired into your brain.

Fails utterly if you do not.

And since so many teachers do have that style, they will never believe it doesn't work for you, simply accuse you of doing it wrong.    

Yes, well, the thing is that it's not actually "wrong" advice -- it's actually what everybody (who wants to play really well) should be aiming at.  And, truly the inability to comprehend what that is and to demonstrate it is somewhere along the lines of indeed doing it wrongly, actually.  But, knowing that or being accused of that doesn't necessarily help an individual do it correctly.  In a sense, we are *always* doing that whether we mean to be or not.  But, I think the more clearly the aural image becomes defined to us, the easier it is to do and the less "grey area" there is between our hands/fingers being an extension of the aural image.  

My theory though is that the "grey area" is, in a sense, something that is actually a kind of 'audible' to the individual -- it actually IS the aural image (or at least a part of it).  And, if a student is listening to the "grey area" that is actually audible to a trained listener (it will sound unfocused, unclear, unsure in a way).  And, my theory is that it can be very tough to distinguish precisely what to be making a clear image of (and how to actually even build one).  Having a clearly defined aural image is actually extremely complex in some ways and is affected by everything in our lives; what we think, what we read, what we understand about the world, about music, about ourselves; what we listen to, how much, etc. etc.  But, when you clearly hear it, it's actually a very 'simple' manifestation of all of "that" coming together to form one idea.