Welcome advice re LH stamina in Revolutionary Etude?

[dtao12]

Hi,

Looking for tips on how to increase stamina of the LH of the Revolutionary Etude.

I've recently (last 3 months) resumed practicing seriously and have an opportunity to "ease back" into performing, perhaps on the way to a full-length recital in the winter, with a mini-performance at the end of August. I had in mind a "left-right punch" of Chopin's Revolutionary Etude followed by Winter Wind. The Revolutionary comes more quickly, and I feel is the less difficult of the two: certainly it has fewer notes! But after making some rapid progress on both, Revolutionary seems to have plateaued whereas Winter Wind is still getting better. The problem isn't the notes but fatigue in the LH toward the end which then hurts fluidity and accuracy, even though passages earlier in the piece which I think are more difficult aren't a problem. I don't have similar stamina problems in the RH of Winter Wind. Obviously being right handed, the RH is stronger.

"Relaxing" is always recommended, but that's easier to say than to do. Perhaps if I just keep playing the Revolutionary over and over, it will get easier, but I'm starting to feel "stuck."  I welcome any advice that has helped others who have played this piece.

My fallback, if this doesn't improve by August, is to perform the Winter Wind plus the op. 25#12, which I can play better than the Revolutionary at this point. But I hoped to do the Revolutionary and Winter Wind pairing for greater variety.

Thanks.

David

[liordavid]

don't tense yourself up. dont breathe heavily or do anything to exaust yourself. I know you mentioned that relaxing techniques don't really work for you but I would strongly recomend these suggestions.

[birba]

You've got some repertoire you're learning at the moment.  the revolutionary etude should be a breeze compared to some of that stuff.  But any advice I could give would be useless if you're playing with tension in the hand and arm.  Tension, here, is only in the finger tips.  You're risking a tendonitis if you insist in this.   Leave it for the moment and play another etude.  Maybe contrasting the winter wind.  Like no. 7 from op. 25.

[stevebob]

What they said.   

Sometimes it seems like tension is a convenient and predictable target when we look for the source of so many issues and afflictions, but it's as likely a culprit here as anywhere else.  As I was reading your original post, I was already thinking to myself that stamina should be of no concern unless you're practicing and playing with unnecessary tension.

[ramseytheii]

Play it in waves!

Walter Ramsey

[dtao12]

Thanks to those who have answered up till now. The advice has been helpful. I didn't mean to imply that "relax" was something that doesn't work for me. I just meant I haven't being "doing" the relaxing very effectively, but it is improving a bit. I can relax more if I focus on how great the piece is, rather than thinking too hard about making mistakes or getting tense. The LH passages where tension is most evident are those where the fingers are close together like the chromatic ascending passage in measures 17-18, or the similar one 10-11 measures before the end. Octaves and arpeggios are much easier for me. Maybe, in the Revolutionary, it's because my hand is "stretched" most of the time and has trouble adjusting to being unstretched, if that makes any sense.

[birba]

Maybe, in the Revolutionary, it's because my hand is "stretched" most of the time and has trouble adjusting to being unstretched, if that makes any sense.

You've got it, baby!  It's the tensing and RELEASING of each finger that is at the basis of "relaxation".  I think since you've got the general idea, you can put it to work by slow practising.  But I still would choose another etude for your concert.

[benjaminpiano]

post a video of you playing winter wind please

[dtao12]

benjaminpiano --
Thanks for the challenge re a video of Winter Wind. I'm not ready to try a video yet (too many mistakes), but I could see doing it in a few weeks.

There are plenty of Youtube renditions, most of which are probably better than mine would be anyway! I liked this one from 2005 Chopin Competition finalist

and this one by a 75-yr old Richter

I appreciate the remind about "slow practicing," which takes patience and discipline (since it's more "fun" to play them fast). One technique that I've tried (and am interested if others have found it helpful) in slow practicing is to change even notes into dotted rhythms in groups of 2 or 4 -- e.g., dotted 8th 16th etc., or dotted 8th 16th 16th 16th, and then the opposite way 16th dotted 8th. Definitely helped in Op. 25#12 since that has such a repetitive pattern, though the jury's still out on how helpful it is for Winter Wind and Revolutionary.

[slow_concert_pianist]

Dtao you are approaching these etudes in the wrong way. Neither are about dexerity or fast notes (though both incorporate dexterity and fast notes as part of their stamina). Your focus should be on how to seemlessly integrate all the part play (in the case of the Revolutionary, also produce meaningful cross rythms). What usually happens (sadly even with some of the "best" professionals) is one hand plays 2nd fiddle to the other and, though brilliant, the offering hardly explores the musicality of Chopin.

A similar case in point is the Rachmaninov prelude in Bb Op23 No2. Muical integrity is usually sacraficed in some way to induce a "brilliant" performance. This is why I am working on this currently to present the forum an unorthodox, but better interpretation for overall consideration.

[iratior]

It IS hard to avoid left-hand fatigue when doing the revolutionary etude, even if one is left-handed.  My suggestion would be to minimize the extent to which fingerings reguire you to make sudden changes in the stretch of your hand.  At measure 9, for example, finger the left hand 5143214323412341.

[nearenough]

For some strange reason I can play it without any fatigue at all, also op 10 #1, but never #2.

I augment the bottom notes in the L hand on the lower half of the development section page 2 with octaves, and I think this might help relaxation by opening up the hand to "slap" the octaves, adding a bit of accent and emphasis. Hoffman and Cortot used to add to the score in this manner.