Which is harder? Waldstein or Appassionata?

[extremelyfatchicken]

Can someone please tell me the order of difficulty between these beethoven sonata movements?
Waldstein mov 1
Waldstein mov 3
Appassionata mov 1
Appassionata mov 3

[wert718]

1. Waldstein: III-Rondo.
2. Appasionata: III. Allegro ma non troppo
3. Waldstein: I. Allegro con brio
4. Appasionata: I. Allegro assai

In my opinion at least.

[invictious]

I think generally, adducing hearsay evidence, that,
Waldstein is technically harder, but Appasionata is musically more difficult.

I will give you my own first-hand opinion in a few years when I am done learning these pieces.

[pianist1976]

but Appasionata is musically more difficult.

Sorry but I disagree. Waldstein is, unfortunately and wrongly, very easy to be transformed into a banal finger exercise, as 80% of the students of the conservatoires around the world seem to do with it. Or, in other words, I think that it requires some maturity and hard musical work in order to obtain all the beauties and expresiveness that, of course, are into the score, without falling in the trivial finger showing and typewriting mechanicism as many people do.

So, in brief, I think that it is musically very difficult (just my opinion).

[extremelyfatchicken]

1. Waldstein: III-Rondo.
2. Appasionata: III. Allegro ma non troppo
3. Waldstein: I. Allegro con brio
4. Appasionata: I. Allegro assai

In my opinion at least.

is this going from hardest to easiest?

[precipitato]

i'll say it depends? for appassionata i feel though technically it's difficult, musically its a beast. the waldstein is the other way round, so it depends on you! i'll say they're the same difficulty.

[49410enrique]

yes they are all the most difficult

[pianoplayjl]

they are all difficult.

[philb]

Sorry but I disagree. Waldstein is, unfortunately and wrongly, very easy to be transformed into a banal finger exercise, as 80% of the students of the conservatoires around the world seem to do with it. Or, in other words, I think that it requires some maturity and hard musical work in order to obtain all the beauties and expresiveness that, of course, are into the score, without falling in the trivial finger showing and typewriting mechanicism as many people do.

So, in brief, I think that it is musically very difficult (just my opinion).

This.

Also, I wouldn't say that the rondo is harder than the 3rd of the Appassionata. There are some tricky passages, but there are a lot more awkward passages in the appassionata. Other than the trills, inversions, and the Octave Glissandi there aren't many passages that are very hard. I would say that the Appassionata is much less pianistic and is very awkward to finger. Then again, it's very subjective.

[pianoplayjl]

I say that the 3rd movement of appasionata is harder than 1st movement in terms musically and technically because you have to worry about the speed and articulation too. And there are wide arpeggios to worry about too.

[precipitato]

hmm but i have personally played appassionata before, i feel the first is more tricky then the third!

[pianoplayjl]

I'm just being speculative!

[precipitato]

nah its okay! some people find the 3rd more difficult though, but it fits into my fingers better than the first as for waldstein i'll say the 3rd > 1st, but im being speculative!

[pianoplayjl]

how are you being speculative, being that you've played it? You obviously know what you find challenging in that piece, while i'm just guessing at the difficulty?
I'm a million miles away from playing either one . anyway, I find appasionata 1st movement to be more emotional and musically challenging than 3rd mvt, where the difficulty lies in technique and developing the capability to play it. I forgot what the 2nd mvt sounds like.

[felipe717]

Appassionata is harder than Waldstein...
Hans von Bulow organized the sonatas in order by difficulty. According to him, Waldstein is the 26th most difficult sonata, and Appassionata is the 27th. A little difference, but a difference, anyway.

[complexpiano]

Opinions are opinions, I have looked over the Appassionata, had a couple friends who played it and I myself have played the Waldstein, (3rd and 1st movements) and in my opinion believe the Waldstein to be more technically demanding (those octave glissandos were actually surprisingly easy though) and  almost as musically demanding to the Appassionata, the melody of the crossed over left hand in the beginning of the Rondo and the general melody of all of the movements must be very carefully brought out and can really determine a good performance over an awful one. However, despite these comparisons, I think everyone can agree that these two sonatas are both fantastic works and great displays of technicality and musicality and will both be forever remembered as some of Beethoven's greatest sonatas.

[kalirren]

Waldstein II/III
Appassionata III
Waldstein I
Appassionata I

is this going from hardest to easiest?

I think so.  I'd have to add the Appassionata II just above the Appassionata I.

[david456103]

waldstein III is definitely the hardest.

[nanabush]

I played the Appassionata this year... the first movement took me MUCH longer to get around than the third movement.  In Movement 3, the technique is laid out in front of you by page 2.  I found the form, and the relentless ferocity of it kind of geared me up from the get go.  The first movement has so many sudden "oh crap!" moments... like the first cascading diminished passage in the right hand... it's as 'out in the open' as a little Mozart Sonata.  It's just silence, then WHOOOSH!  If you stumble there, people will hear it.  Also, in the recap, when the left hand has the triplet beat going, and the RH takes over the entire theme in octaves, it's difficult not to make that sound clunky, and execute all the trills musically, while the left hand almost makes you feel like you have to rush it.

I just found the first movement of the Appassionata was littered with these pitfalls and traps that can just snag you if you aren't relaxed or don't like your fingering.  The third movement was very difficult, but as I said, it's all laid out from the beginning.  Movement one has so many moments where it 'one ups' itself technically, and it is a very long movement..

One of my friends played the Waldstein in her second year, and she's an incredible pianist... her only description of the piece was "it's serene"... so I doubt she even noticed if it was hard haha.  Like I said in the thread about Chopin's 3rd Ballade Vs. the Barcarolle: if you can play one intelligently and with a good musical sense, you probably have a good shot at the other.