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Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro (Read 14808 times)

Offline anafressari

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piano sheet music of Nocturne


Offline faa2010

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I think it was very, very slow. Maybe because I am used to listen it in a non lento way I am going to say it, but it wasn't very pleasant to listen the Nocturne at that speed.

Of course, he was right about not to go so fast also.

Offline birba

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That is HYSTERICAL!!!  You have to give him credit.  He IS entertaining.   ;D

Offline ramseytheii

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What I think is ridiculous about people like this (he's far from the only one) is not the playing.  If you listen objectively, you'll find little to complain about as regards phrasing or touch, for instance.  Yes it is in slow motion, but at a basic level, it's not against the music per se.

The ridiculous element is that people like this think they invented the phrasing.  They think they are the most refined and original, but actually they lack the most important thing: a sensitive ear.  

This is how I know it: this person thinks that "everyone else" plays the nocturne as he describes the way it shouldn't be done.  He can't actually hear what anyone else is doing.  He can't tell that they might be also creating a beautiful phrasing, with a beautiful touch, and an expressive rhythm.  He, and people like him, can only hear things that are spelled out so much you'd have to be a complete idiot not to get it.

In short what is lacking here is refinement.  Making the most out of the least is an artistic feat beyond people like this; and also, the power of listening is unfortunately denied to them.  It is unfortunate, because were they able to listen, they would be able to create music beautifully, but with a subtlety that would be ravishing.

Walter Ramsey



Offline stevebob

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I think it's the combination of Dunning-Kruger effect and attention-seeking behavior—"Look at ME, pay attention to ME, you're all wrong and I'm right!"—that's most ridiculous.

Suggesting that someone devoid of both artistry and craftsmanship (but thoroughly imbued with narcissism and infallibility) has the latent capacity to make beautiful music is, in my opinion, beyond generous.
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline ramseytheii

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Well, I'm optimistic to a fault.

What is Dunning-Kruger effect?

Walter Ramsey



Offline stevebob

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Here's Wikipedia's article about it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning-kruger_effect

Of course, Ana isn't the most vivid example I've encountered ... even in this forum.  :)
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline tds

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i wonder if he carries a camera with him everywhere across mmm, russia? europe? he seems to be playing at different places and on different pianos/keyboards. fine with me. quite interesting, as matter of fact ;D. now let's walk this further. say he continues to indulge in doing this piano video project thingy for rest of his life, chances are that he'd be sitting on the piano stool at some of pianostreet member's house producing his oeurves, right? - assuming that he lives a long time, of course, which i hope he does.

anyway, the question is now: what if, mmm i repeat, what if one day he knocks at your door??
dignity, love and joy.

Offline birba

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I won't be at home.

Offline pianist1976

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@ramseytheii, very well expressed. I completely agree with you so I cant add many more thoughts to this subject :)

I pity people like ana who aren't able to appreciate and enjoy the good things that exist in other persons interpretations. I agree that his ears are so closed that he wasn't able to reproduce what he thinks is what we, the teachers, generally teach to our pupils. That's the problem of generalizations. But also no good teacher would encourage or approve a fake and capricious approaching as the first one.

"Virtue is in the middle"  ;)

Offline stevebob

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #10 on: October 30, 2010, 12:16:23 PM »
what if one day he knocks at your door??

I'd think it was the Avon Lady, and I wouldn't answer.
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline tds

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #11 on: October 30, 2010, 01:33:05 PM »
anyway, the question is now: what if, mmm i repeat, what if one day he knocks at your door??

i'd ask if he could teach me the piano.
dignity, love and joy.

Offline birba

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #12 on: October 30, 2010, 03:18:10 PM »
I'd think it was the Avon Lady, and I wouldn't answer.
Dummy!  The avon lady rings the door bell, didn't you know that?!

Offline tds

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #13 on: October 30, 2010, 03:30:17 PM »
I won't be at home.

'Police, if you have a crown of humanity, 'Police dont do that...its terrible
dignity, love and joy.

Offline stevebob

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #14 on: October 30, 2010, 03:37:10 PM »
Dummy!  The avon lady rings the door bell, didn't you know that?!

Whether knocking on the door or ringing the bell, it's Ana's voice that sounds like the Avon Lady.
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline tds

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #15 on: October 30, 2010, 03:42:57 PM »
Whether knocking on the door or ringing the bell, it's Ana's voice that sounds like the Avon Lady.


what if he modifies his voice? you'd open the door for him, n let him use ur piano?
dignity, love and joy.

Offline stevebob

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #16 on: October 30, 2010, 05:25:33 PM »
Naw, there would be neither reason nor purpose for doing so.
What passes you ain't for you.

Offline sashaco

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #17 on: October 30, 2010, 07:48:50 PM »
The Dunning-Kruger effect has been adduced in several editorial pieces recently, since it so well describes the minds of many of the folks who brought us the financial crisis and the current political situation.

I remember when I was a teenager and learning to play the piano a little.  It could be said of me then that I was a recidivistic Dunning-Kreugerite. Each time I started to learn a piece it would sound awful (of course) and then, after some work, start to sound remarkably good.  Soon afterwards it would sound worse than ever.  What was happening?  A bit of work would allow me to give a rough approximation of the piece, and to my crude ear that would sound brilliant.  As I got to know the piece better I would realize that what I had thought sounded lovely was, well, just what it was.  For a couple of years, though, I'd go through the same damn cycle with the next piece, living, with almost deliberate perversity, in a serially constructed  fool's paradise.
I'm afraid I never acquired what Walter R. calls "refinement", although now at least I recognize I don't have it.  I'm perhaps like that character in "The Irish R.M." who's a shade less awful than the rest of his family because he KNOWS he's awful. 

Offline rmbarbosa

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #18 on: November 02, 2010, 10:33:31 PM »
Oh yes! I see... first we must play the first bar. Then, we must stop, smoke a cigarret, read the newspaper and, only after all theese things, we play the trill. But, my fellows, attention, please! the trill must be very, very, very slow... as all trills must be. In this peculiar case, F sharp - five minutes - G-five minutes- F sharp and so on along <> 30 minutes. Then, a pause, a cup of coffee for inspiration, and go to the Church to pray for Chopin eternal rest. After this, the next 2 bars, and so on. And Anafressari will be happy... why cant we all have piano lessons with him? He is so expressive, so unique, so amazing!!! pause of 30 minutes, then 1 F sharp, then 11 !!!!!!!.....
Thanks a lot Anafressari. Since my grand father death I didnt laugh so much. Congratulations!
Rui

Offline dss62467

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #19 on: December 18, 2010, 03:45:40 PM »
It's humorous, but seriously... WAY too slow!  I could've brewed a pot of coffee by the time he got through the intro.  I'll take Barenboim's interpretation as my model of how to play this piece, thank you very much.
Currently learning:
Chopin Prelude Op. 28, no. 15
Schubert Sonata in A Major, D.959: Allegretto

Offline lelle

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #20 on: January 03, 2011, 11:30:39 PM »
I have seen that guy's channel before! I remember laughing quite a lot as well.

This guy believes himself to be God's gift to the piano and has videos titled such as "when you have not talent, you need to imitate it" or "Metronome: the best friend of the untalented musician."  and displays his unsurpassed talent in many videos:





Either he is the worlds biggest troll or... well I don't even know

Offline stevetrug

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #21 on: January 04, 2011, 12:11:52 AM »
There are those that 'Know',
Those that 'Don't Know',
and those that 'Don't Know they Don't know'.
 ;)

Offline birba

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Re: Chopin, Nocturne in C-sharp minor. How to play and NOT play the Intro
«Reply #22 on: January 04, 2011, 06:25:38 AM »
And those that THINK they know...