How to read complex music?

[rayneval]

Hi,

I have been able to play the piano for some time, and have quite quickly taught myself a variety of pieces such as clair de lune by watching someone else play and copying their hand movements, so i memorise a finger pattern.
However, some pieces i want to learn its very difficult to do this, but i find it so slow following along music and playing, not to mention i often get lost where i am when trying to find my hand positions of notes or working out the notes.
It takes a long time to count up to the notes im at, and i get it wrong sometimes when i try, messing up the piece.

Is there anyway of increasing my music reading ability?
I usually just use the Every Good Boy Deserves Fruit, and the other FACE to find notes. Or i work from where i am currently, but with some pieces im trying to learn its really hard to jump between notes where i have to either guess each note or count, so it takes forever. not to mention where on the keyboard some keys are!

So anyone suggest a method to improve this?? I'd love to be able to read the music fast such as quick paced music Fantasie Impromptu and others like Noctournes quite quickly, without being extremely slow at each note.

Thank you,

R

[m1469]

The last thing I should be doing right now is writing a post like this on the forum, but I so badly want to put my own thoughts together on this that I am doing it anway (however, I would normally be doing a chore right now anyway, so I'll skip the chore and post instead!).

I don't personally understand my own reading ability at all.  Even though there are these small flashes in my memory of needing to count some of the notes above and below the staff, and there are times that I think I forgot how to read music, in actuality that's not entirely true and I don't even understand why I would feel that way.  And then there is this weird memory I have of learning to read Fur Elise as a little child, but I don't understand that memory either.

What I can tell you though is that I've spent a lot of time thinking about and experimenting with all things piano that I feel I can get my "hands" on.  I am not an astounding sightreader at this point in my life (though there was a point before I became aware that it was a certain ability that I used to be quite good at it).  Though in some way I've always known what I am about to say, it wasn't until fairly recently that I realized quite clearly that it's important to realize that our life at the piano involves different languages, so to speak.  Eventually we want to see it's all actually one language and principle, for exmaple music involves both rhythm and tones, but these can and probably in many cases must be broken down and dealt with separately.

So, the language of knowing the topography of the piano is in some ways its own thing, though you could say it's tied to others.  But, it's worth it to spend time (and it might take awhile) playing certain patterns while closing your eyes, and concentrating just on that, verses trying to get better at reading notes while at the same time getting better at learning the topography of the piano without looking -- even though they are definitely related when it comes to reading and sight-reading.

One of the first steps when dealing with something that seems complex is to realize that what appears to be the complexity of the situation is more like viewing a canvas of elements that can be isolated and managed in some ways completely on their own.  So, yes, practice reading notes on the staff and finding them on the piano.  Practice mentally understanding how that works.  Most of my students don't grasp it more fully simply because they have no interest in putting in the (relatively small) amount of time it requires to get over that hurdle of needing to count through the lines and spaces.  Your goal should be to outgrow the need for any mere method of doing that, and to reach a place of just knowing at sight which notes are being represented on the lines and spaces of the staff (so, without needing to count).  But, you may have to start by counting!  Just do it enough to where the counting decreases and you start to remember where each note is on its own.  Okay?

While I don't want to limit you, don't expect yourself to be capable of doing everything at once -- as in, you are not failing at life just because you can't (okay, I think I'm probably telling myself that at the time ... haha ... though if you need it, take it in ).  The motions at the piano are worth studying in and of themselves, and yes, you can learn quite a bit by watching others, but you can learn even more if you know what you are specifically looking for.  I spent a decent amount of time (a couple of years?) turning pages for international performers and local pianists, and in some ways I learned quite a bit about piano technique from that, though I learned even more specifics by studying certain things like forearm rotations and other specifics.

You can also study intervals and scales and just listening, and it's necessary.

Eventually though, it all combines into something different than just these isolated quantities.  It's not even a compilation of these quantities, but rather something of personal meaning to you, which can't accurately be quantified, I think.  For example, when I think of my name (not m1469), which I've had for my whole life and learned to read and write it ... even when I just think of it very clearly, I can hear in my mind's ear certain elements of it very clearly, I can see it written (and me writing it) on a piece of paper, I can feel what's it like to write it with a pencil, I can feel what it's like to say it ... all of this just by thinking about it.  However, the name itself while names may only mean so much, comes to mean something personal beyond those elements that I described.

Well, gotta go!

[fleetfingers]

It would take you forever to do algebra if you had to count on your fingers basic math facts, such as 5+6. That is why they spend the early elementary school years drilling those basic facts into our brains. When we get to more complex equations, we can fly through them, because we don't have to stop and calculate simple addition. And when a child cannot keep up with the class? They are sent to do remedial math, where they are the taught.....the basics.

It's the same with reading music. If you are still reading note by note, having to count lines and spaces, I would suggest you go back to the basics. Get yourself a nice set of flashcards - or make your own - and drill yourself. You should be able to look at a note and know exactly what it is, just as you know that 2+2 is 4 without even thinking. The next step would be to get to the point where playing the note on the piano is instinctive.

I like the way m1469 described playing the piano as a language. If you've ever studied another language for long enough, you know that you eventually get to a point at which you no longer have to translate to and from your native tongue. You listen and speak in the new language, and you simply understand the meaning of what's being said. It's the same when playing the piano. The more you read music, the easier it will be, and one day you'll notice that you're not even thinking about the letter names of the notes anymore. However, it sounds like you need to go back to the beginning and really get the basics down.

Also, you need to get pieces that are easier for you to read. You should still learn the more difficult ones that you want to learn, but when it comes to sightreading it would help if you worked on simpler music.

[rayneval]

Thanks so much for your long responses!
I will read it again more carefully later, when i'm not say tired

I decided to buy online Chopin Sheet Music For Piano and the Beethoven one, which has a range of pieces from easy to advanced. I guess i'll start easy and work my way through?
Are there any techniques that will aid me in learning to read the pieces, or just do what i've been doing and i'll get better over time?
this is going to take a long time ! haha

is it worth training my ears to be somewhat 'perfect pitched'? I know it's possible, but will this help with sight-reading? If so, how?

Thanks again peoples.

[scottmcc]

if you want to improve your sight reading skills, there are a number of other threads on this board that should be of use to you, all easily found by hitting the search tab (two buttons to the right of the "forum home" tab at the top)

to truly be sight reading, you need to find exceptionally easy music, that you can play without having to stop and figure out each note/chord/etc.   there are a number of sources of this, such as simplified song books ("easy piano"), beginner method books, or a hymnal from the church of your choice.  it helps if it's a song that you already know the basic sound of as well.  and the rest is just time and effort!  you'll get to the point where you can read harder and harder music later, although even the best sight readers get to a limit.  my mom can sight read better than most anyone I know, and can even do a bunch of the fugues from the well-tempered klavier, but show her anything more recent such as debussy and she can't do it.

[rayneval]

Thanks again,
oh really so something far easier.. Rather then that waltz you suggested, perhaps a few levels lower that look so easy? And then work my way up?

[justin_]

Hi,

I taught piano to young kids while at university and I read about a couple of approaches to sight reading and have my own thoughts in the mix as well.   Briefly my philosophy to sight reading is that its there to get a good understanding and appreciation of the piece quickly and not to spend too much time on it.

Summary:
1) Know your notes
2) Learn your intervals
3) Know your Key
4) Know your Chords
5) If you already know the Piece
6) Music Notation on the page
7) Sight Reading for Performance


1.0) Know your notes
Flash Cards (Already Mentioned) - This is bread and butter. Good online website is pianotheory.net

2.0) Learn your intervals
2.1- Melodically -
Learn to read by interval / step.   This is particularly useful when playing well outside of the register. Once you know you're starting note its all relative positioning from there - just think "step up / step down; skip a note; leap a fourth etc".

2.2 – Harmonically
It’s important to recgonise at speed what a 2nd, 3rd, 4th look like etc.  This will lead into Point 4.

3) Know your Key
We generally think in 'keys' when playing and just makes it easier to know which are the black notes and which are the white 'avoid' notes (in your standard Maj/Min keys... sight reading music with lots of accidentals is probably best left til later).

4) Know your Chords
4.1 – Chord Shapes
Learn to Recognise your harmonies / chords.   This builds on point 2.   Once you know all your individual notes and then your intervals its important to recognise chord shapes and on the page and what that translates to onto the keyboard.   Best to start doing this with simple chord inversions (root, 1st, 2nd).   It’s also much easier to ‘see’ a chord when its written out harmonically as opposed to melodically (or as an arpeggio).

Also, it’s important to know what key you're in here because then you'll know (consciously or subconsciously)if its a major or minor chord right away.   For example if I see a f-d-a Chord in C major I always think “D minor” first inversion as opposed to say in keys G, D, A where I think “D Major First Inversion”.

4.1 – Chord Patterns
It’s important to know common chord patterns and recognise them as you play (eg circle of fifths, standard cadences).
You may also start to notice different styles of chords in the different periods of music, and heading towards the Romantic period, how the chord changes can become less predictable.  Nonetheless having a foundation from say baroque music (and at the least a knowledge of cadences) will be very helpful.


5) If you already know the Piece

5.1 - If you already know the melody.
We usually play a song we’ve heard before so in this case you know the melody so you can anticipate it without necessarily reading ‘note for note’ from the page.   This requires some aural transfer skills.

5.2 - If you already know the harmonic structure
Again as you develop your aural skills you can also apply them to anticipation of the harmonic structure of the piece. A simple example would be the 12 bar blues (in say C).   We all know, or better still, can ‘hear’, that bar 5 moves to chord IV (or F).   Knowing this helps our sight reading because we would anticipate that the LH would move to an F Major Chord or arpeggio (ie F,A or C).   More complex music may say place a tritone substitution in there. Now the more you understand about where the harmonics are going, the better you can anticipate (from a glance at the page) where to place your hands and which chords will be coming up.

5.3 – Even if you don't know the piece
Listen as you sight read- most music generally has repeated motifs or melodies or themes.   Make sure you listen hard and think hard the first time round so the second time through a motif/melody you know what’s coming up (but also be prepared for a variation on the theme).


6) Music Notation on the page
This is all about knowing what you can and can’t achieve in a single sight reading.   If there’s too much fluff on the page (articulation markings, style markings, dynamics etc) it all gets very confusing.  I often think best to just get the notes and rhythm right (the foundations) when sight reading.   Also if it is pop music (or figured bass) and there are chord notations… can be fun sometimes to just shortcut with them!

7.0) Sight Reading for Performance

7.1 - If you’re Sight Reading for Performance ie friends / a gig (Not for examination)
Always count and hold the rhythm steady.   I think that people in general have a very good sense of rhythm and if that starts to go they’ll detect it.   The melody / harmony on the other hands you can usually get a way with or fudge a bit without people noticing.

7.2 If you’re Sight Reading for an examination
In my opinion it is better to play slow and accurate rather than fast and inaccurate (even if the temp marking is allegro).   I also believe it is better to let a mistake go and move on rather than hold up the flow and rhythm of the piece.   Stop / starting is very jerky and best to be avoided.   Also the basics for any examination:
-   Know your Key.
-   Know your Time Signature
-   Mentally Isolate the accidentals so you’re prepared for them when they come.
-   Count
-   Don’t Stop Play.
-   Finish Well.
-   Fake it till you make it (Look Confident!). Posture here is soo important! And Smile!

7.3 If you’re sight reading with other instrumentalists
I don’t have much experience here but a couple of weeks ago I was at a mates grandmothers funeral.   He was on drums, I was on piano and Scotty was on Bass.   Third turnaround through the hymn I did a fancy cadenza and lost my spot.  I knew that every chord in the piece worked with two notes in the right hand.  So I played a rhythmic arpeggio pattern on these notes and let Scott do the bass work for me.   Wasn’t ideal but the positive was we came back in on the chorus even bigger cause we’d effectively cut back.   The point is… play on what you can.   Bash out the melody if that’s all you’ve got and let others help out.

Here endeth the essay.

[rayneval]

Wow Justin, thank you so much for that

[lostinidlewonder]

That is a well written and organized post by justin, probably the best first post of anyone here, I hope to see you share more knowledge!

I think to fluently read complicated music you have never heard or read and do it on first attempt is simply dreaming, even playing something that you know the sound of very well does not give you enough tools to control your initial reading attempts at a high standard. I think this is incorrect thinking when approaching complicated music, it is by definition something that you can't do service merely sighting and it should not be our aim. How we read it and fluently learn from it every reading attempt is what is important however, what we take away from it every time we play, how we solve our difficulties and control what is asked of us.
 
One thing I find paramount to good sight reading is good fingering and a clear sense of what your hand is doing. If we use substandard fingerings then what we must play is more difficult and it does not help us with muscular memory if our sight reading repetitions contain bad fingering. When initially learning a piece I will not correct a bad note if I feel controlled with my fingering, but if I hit the right notes but with wrong fingers I will often repeat. Fingering is king.

If you always use the right fingers you can't go wrong, but this solution is not as simple as it seems, because even if you know the right fingers if you do not understand them they become merely a jumble of commands which are inefficiently being understood, it makes your brain feel too busy and simply locks you up technically and musically. While you play use commands and observations that you marked out on the sheet music which act as conscious thought prompts aiding to control your fingers and understanding of the fingering groups, the rest of what you read should be controlled with an automated response based on your past knowledge.

You need to be sure that you can mark the music with commands which allow you to solve your difficulties faster. Use color to define trouble sections and make it easier and more readily understood (leaving the sheet music just black and white notes in my opinion does not increase the rate of learning). If the entire page ends up filled with marks then perhaps the piece is too difficult for you for now. There is nothing wrong with condensing many of your commands into far reaching concepts which controls the piece in many areas not just in the single instance.

Fingering must always be top notch, mistakes in this merely sets you up for repair work in the future. Drawing from past knowledge of pieces often can encourage us to use the right fingers and make us feel confident that what we are doing is the best solution for our hands.
A single phrase can be played with many fingering solutions and the more complicated a piece gets the more fingering opportunities arise. If you stick to a small set of your own fingering solution you may never increase your ability to fluently learn complicated music. Throughout my own learning I have come across fingering which did not occur natural to me and my solution felt naturally better, but once you abandon your comfort tools and begin expand your fingering horizons then you will be able to move into more complicated music which may expose you to even more strange fingering ideas.