Skilled Pianist

[elbert]

Do you know anyone who having no prior training started taking piano lessons at the age of 50 and became a skilled classical pianist. The person would now probably be 65 or 70. I would be very encouraged to know someone.
thanks Elbert,

[jimbo320]

Fifteen or twenty years of training? More possible than probable....

[omar_roy]

No, I don't know any.

Is it possible? Yes, but not likely.  Even after 15-20 years of training, starting that late is a big hindrance.  I'm sure you've heard the saying "You can't teach an old dog new tricks."

Well, it's pretty much the truth.  As you get older, your ability to learn new concepts both mentally and physically gets worse.  Not to mention the fact that your dexterity starts to go downhill as well.  It's easier to retain dexterity at that age than it is to build it.

[honeywill]

Don't be discouraged by the nay-sayers. It is perfectly possible to learn to play the piano from scratch at a mature age. You just need to want to do it pretty badly and be prepared to put the hours in to practice. My teacher has several retirees who have reached high grades on the piano from scratch. I'm currently teaching a lady of 64(?) who is making very good progress. Attitude and application are everything, as at any other age.

[becky8898]

Hi - Depends what you mean by a skilled classical pianist.  If you mean you can play a Mozart sonata with a great deal of skill , or some easier pieces from the romantic period that is one thing. if you mean to play a  big time concerto , The Rach 2 as an example with a major symphony orchestra that is something else.  If you are talking about a level of achievment somewhere in between there that is again something else. 

If you wish to begin this journey , dont worry about the end result.  Just go for it without any pre conceived notions and enjoy the ride. 

OH one more thing, realistically answering someones question to the best of your ability is not being a nay sayer. Its an honest attempt to help the other person. 

Cheers, Becky

[pianist1976]

I agree with becky8898. Been realistic is not been a "nay-sayer".

I never had pupils with that age but friends of mine had (I have now my oldest pupil, she is 43 or 46, can't remember). It its true that while they can achieve some very nice goals and they can make sound the instrument (depending on the talent), it isn't realistic to think that starting at 50 someone will be a virtuoso at 70. But playing nice pieces and make sounding the piano fairly good is possible in much less time than 15-20 years, maybe some months or a few years. Just try it!

Everything is relative and it depends on what do you interpret as "skilled pianist" (as becky stated). Many great pianists stated that from 12 to 45 (aprox.) is the key age to build the basic repertoire. It's scientifically demonstrable that from a certain age the learning process is not as good as on an early age, that's a fact. But this doesn't mean that a later beginner cannot reach a nice playing status. That will depend on his/her abilities, time to practice and quality of the teacher (very important, here even more than with children because we have less margin to error and less opportunities to correct a bad basic formation as it's a lot harder to change habits when you are older).

Asking to your question, elbert, I know hundreds and hundreds of pianists form all ages and levels and I never knew a top level virtuoso who started at 50. But don't be discouraged, threre are many levels, not only the top one. If you love the music, start at your rhythm and let the learning process surprise you with what can it offer through the time, don't restrain yourself to a fixed goal.

[elbert]

Thanks all. I intend on getting to my full potential as to the point I consider myself to be a skilled pianist. I am only a 4 year student and am very pleased with my progress. So sometimes is my teacher without letting up on being tough. That is why I would really like to know someone else. I realized the challenge and considered the difficulties before I took this enormous journey but the passion seems to be much greater than the physical obstacles. I am being taught by a 1st generation Walter Hautzig teacher whom I revere highly. Mr. Hautzig is now 89 and plays beautifully youthful. I am not ready for Carnegie Hall but I am playing Scriabin, Chopin, Beethoven and more. Everyone progresses at their on level of driven desire. Those who cannot see themselves beyond their doubts, they really don't have to worry. My interest again is I would really like to know someone else who has accomplished the high level of becoming a skilled pianist from age 50. There has to be other overachieving successful pianist out there who has ridden this horse with wings into an older age of classical solo piano bliss.

[campogi]

Do you know anyone . . . The person would now probably be 65 or 70

Dear Ebert,

I am 67 and retired. 6 months ago I bought a piano and, like meeting an old friend I left 35 years ago, I started to practice again. My Music Background: the only formal training I had was at age 6 no more than two months . . .  long enough to read 'Do,Re, Mi, . . ." and stopped. Maybe because I come from a musically minded family and just love for music, at 19 and after hearing Beethoven's Moonlight sonata played, I told myself, "I will play that." It took 9 months for me to play the first movement with only the training I had at age 6. Since I could not read notes and play at the same time I memorized one line at a time.  - which is what I'm doing now.After three years, using the same technique I played all three movements of Moonlight sonata then stopped again until six months ago or 35 years latter. I only play original pieces and only classical music. My current project is Beethoven's Sonata Opus 13 otherwise known as "Pathetique". Since I don't know how to read musical symbols or the beats I play based on how I heard it plus my own interpretation, I can only supply you encouragement and my experience playing without a teacher. I hated structured training and rebelled by training myself. I am writing now for I was like you once and younger then looking, every now and then, for a kind mentor to explain, and someone to encourage me on as I hated structured training and rebelled by training myself.

For now, I tell you this . . . DISCIPLINE!!!!!!. Hanon only for as long as you can in the morning! Resist the temptation of playing something else. That you do only in the afternoon or evening. Play with the correct phrasing. Do not rush. Play it slowly and perfectly with the right finger technique as well. Penalize yourself for moving faster and then make a mistake. Play it with feeling . . . slow,fast,very soft and very loud and combine it with different phrasing and finger technique for each page using your imagination to how you want it to sound. You will be surprise for it's as though you are playing a different piece each time. Beside, it was my means to get away from boredom. Honestly, I played it pretending I was in a fully packed concert hall.

Good luck,
Bibo   

[elbert]

Thank you Bibo, I appreciate you for taking the time to post your experience and encouraging interest. I started with an on line course and completed the beginners book. Realizing a part of me that felt like I belong here and was totally comfortable as though I was just waking up something that was there all along. I then began with a teacher enduring all Hanon studies at the same time loving every exercise. Now beginning my forth year with an incredible teacher. Although staying disciplined I am so excited about what is coming in the next two years. I am getting a glimpse at actually becoming the pianist I fill in my soul. I am using the Bartok studies to sight read. That's a slow disciplined area but very necessary and my teacher wouldn't have it any other way plus I started out to accomplish the real thing. It's actually coming along. I have to force myself to slow down and get all the articulations right the first time or I'm going back to relearn again. Somehow I have a special ability to memorize the music which I have to keep in check and turn off in order to sight read. It's great to here from you and to be encouraged with your talent and success. I wish you great longevity with your new found friend. There is lots to be said about beginning piano as a child. I think the child musician waits inside until you get old enough to hear it's cry and are ready to train it. If you care to.
Elbert

[jimbo320]

Elbert,
Very well said. I absolutely agree with your last line that equates us as a child in music waiting to begin. Music is from the heart using our minds and body to it's expression. The free flight of such an expression is what we strive for. Let your heart fly!

Jimbo

[roger_1948]

Hi Elbert, Let me start by saying that I wish you only the best in your efforts. I am also a senior age 62 1/2.  I will have finished four years of study in May.  So here is something I have wondered about.  We talk about child prodigys, that is children who seem to make just miraculous progress.  I suppose the closest we have to one of those on these boards is our little friend Becky8898. She is 12 and 1/2 and plays like an angel.  You can listen to her chopin etude over on the audition room.  It got me to wondering can you have an adult prodigy, or a senior prodigy . Someone who has buried inside them that same magic gift, but it was never developed early in life. Might any of us who try this journey late be one. Who can tell, but if you dont make the journey you will never know. 

I also started to wonder what are some of the biggest differences between studying the piano when one is a child.  and when one is an adult , especially a senior. The one huge difference I came up with , is one that most people dont seem to ever Mention.  Take Becky .  She plays not just for herself.  She plays for her parents, her teachers, for her recital audiences, for recognition.  If she is to be a professional she must compete.  But we as seniors play mostly for ourselves, for our love of music, the passion of accomplishment, the shear joy of making a wonderful sound.  If we play a piece by Chopin , the jury of how well we did is in our mind.  We are our own judges.  Now perhaps others will hear us, but our future, making a living or a career is not dependant on how we play.

Perhaps we never get to the upper echelons of pianistic skill, but perhaps we achieve far more joy from what we do accomplish than those younger than us who must answer to so many other masters in pursuit of there musical journey.

With all the best on your music making  , revel in each sweet note you make,  Hoping you achieve all your dreams. 

Semper Fi, Roger

[dbmusic]

The oldest student I have taken on as a beginner was 84. What a darling. She took a 20 minute bus ride to get to me, I picked her up at the bus stop, we went to my studio, had a cup of tea to revive after the journey and then began to share music together.

When I asked her if she had ever had lessons before she she said, "Oh no dear, no. We were far too poor to afford a piano. I used to draw a piano on a piece of cardboard and sit out on the verandah and pretend to play. Even now I do my best practice at night in bed!" This lady bought herself a piano and began lessons planning to be the best she could be - and she did achieve an amazing standard. OK, so she didn't get to play the Rach 3 but she did play well enough to sound fantastic and derive much pleasure from her music.

I believe you can do anything you want to do, even though it may take longer than you originally thought! So adult beginners - go for it.

[nanabush]

I have an older lady taking lessons (mid fifties).  She practices, comes to the lesson with questions, and we just have great discussions about her pieces, other pieces, etc.

She's progressing very well! I'm sure she has friends/relatives who say "you're too old to start", but they may be the people who are too lazy to actually go out and try something.

[stephenv]

As I read the replies to the original post I felt support for the most part.  The key to anyone at any age studying piano or any other instrument is found in this self assessing question:  DO I REALLY WITH ALL MY HEART WANT TO LEARN THIS INSTRUMENT?

If the answer is Yes...then go for it.  I will only add this:  its healthy to keep realistic goals in mind, yet strive to surpass some of them a little.

I don't know about some repetoire.  If you are inclined and have the facility to approach a piece such as Chopin's Etude Op. 10 #1 then, lets do it, however if you realize that it would take all of your practice time from now until eternity to learn it...then try something a little less forboding and still beautiful..such as one of his Waltzes or Nocturnes.  A good teacher is essential in helping you to find a piece that you might enjoy.  A piece that you Can learn completely and play in a finished manner...Once you do that your self confidence will soar and you can take on another and go from there.   

I think it can be fun to take a small section of an advanced work and see what we can do to learn it and thats ok, you can gain facility by doing that and also test yourself on your ability and where you are technically.  If the task is overwhelming..thats a cue to let it go for now.
 
Do keep practicing and know that you are doing what you love to do.   Studying is a lifelong process.
 

[asiantraveller101]

The oldest student I have taken on as a beginner was 84. What a darling. She took a 20 minute bus ride to get to me, I picked her up at the bus stop, we went to my studio, had a cup of tea to revive after the journey and then began to share music together.

When I asked her if she had ever had lessons before she she said, "Oh no dear, no. We were far too poor to afford a piano. I used to draw a piano on a piece of cardboard and sit out on the verandah and pretend to play. Even now I do my best practice at night in bed!" This lady bought herself a piano and began lessons planning to be the best she could be - and she did achieve an amazing standard. OK, so she didn't get to play the Rach 3 but she did play well enough to sound fantastic and derive much pleasure from her music.

I believe you can do anything you want to do, even though it may take longer than you originally thought! So adult beginners - go for it.

Thanks for sharing such a heart-warming story. Best wishes to you all adult beginners!