Piano Exercises: use them or Lose them?

[sergioral]

Hello dear friends!

My name is Sérgio and i´m a portuguese pianist.
At this moment i´m doing my master degree in performance and i need to do a theorical work, a thesis.
This work is about the piano exercises. All we know there are some people saying the exercises are very important to make the fingers strong, to improve stamina and strenght and to short cut some passages in big works from Beethoven, and others, because the pianist is working some patterns!
Other side, other people says the exercises is dangerous, can cause injury, make the pianist stupid because he is not working the music (the principal purposes....art), the difficult is cerebral (neurology) and not by the finger-work.

I would like to know if somebody knows good books or articles speaking about this. I need people in the both sides: pros and the cons.

Help please!

Kindest regards to all from Portugal!

[becky8898]

Hi Serg. There is a really great book by Harriette Brower etitled "Piano Mastery Talks with Master Pianists and Teachers" It covers the period  of the first quarter of the twentieth century. IN it she interviews all kinds of great concert pianists , and respected teachers.  Included in the interviews are Padweriski, Schonberg, etc.  They all talk about how to become a great pianist.  The book is avaliable from Amazon and can be purchased online. 

Hope that helps

Cheers, Becky

[ted]

I am the only player I know who regularly uses a silent Virgil Practice Clavier for technique. I have used it for over forty years so if you want to know anything about it feel free to ask. As far as I know the only professional in modern times to use one consistently was Arrau, and he kept his methods to himself, although he often extolled its virtues.

[sergioral]

Thanks for answer!

Of course all help is welcome!

I will do a list with some of the books i have:

1-"The Visible and Invisible in Pianoforte Technique - being a digest of the author's technical teachings up to date".....T. Matthay

2-"The Science Of Pianoforte Technique".....T. Fielden

3-"The Physical Basis of Piano Touch and Tone "....T. Orttoman

4-"The Groundwork of the Leschetizky Method"....M. Bree

5-"Great Pianists on Piano Playing".....F. Cooke

6-"On Piano Teaching and Performance"...F. Waterman

7-"Mastering Piano Technique"....S. Fink

8-"Abby Whiteside on Piano Playing: Indispensables of Piano Playing - Mastering the Chopin Etudes and Other Essays".... A. Whiteside

9-"Piano Playing: With Piano Questions Answered"....J. Hoffman

10-"Artistic Piano Playing as Taught by Ludwig Deppe, Part 1 (1903) "....E. Caland

11-"Art of Practicing". M. Bruser

12-"Basic Principles in Pianoforte Playing "....J. Lhévinne

13-"The Art of Piano Playing"....H. Neuhaus

14-"Art of Piano Playing "...G. Kochevitsky

15-"Great Pianists and Pedagogues "....C. Grindea

16-"Famous Pianists and Their Technique"....R.R. Gerig

17-"Fundamentals of piano practice"...Chuan C. Chang

I know there are a good amount of books but, i trying to find the max. Information i can.
Sorry to torture you with my work but, I´ll appreciate all help.
Thanks one more time.

Cheers






 

[lostinidlewonder]

If you are writing a thesis on exercises then I would think you need to consider the application of exercises carefully, i.e how it relates to all levels of piano learning and how their use changes over time.

What is useful for the beginner becomes obsolete as one progresses. How the advanced develops exercises through the pieces they learn to act as a catalyst in mastering passages is also used in beginner stages but with simplification. The process of creating exercises out of pieces you learn (mostly via using the notes or part of the notes of the composition itself) is quite an involved procedure and one could write a lot on this for all levels of piano practice.

The dangers of using exercises incorrectly is also an interesting investigation, this can also be applied to over practicing pieces and the dangers of brute force repetitions. There are many examples of musicians past and present who damaged their body due to overexerted practice.

[sergioral]

Yes, i think in the same way!
Like Abby whiteside said: "Use scales like an exercise and to streght the fingers is to avoid". We all know, the very large schools use scales like exercises. For sure, we only can learn scales after learn some motor skils: torso, arm, forearm, wrist and fingers. The problem is that the students easily can do scales only using the fingers! It´s wrong!

The warm up exercises can be made without the piano, like doing some stratching.
The athletes always make the stretching before the competition.

I agree. We can learm some skills at beggining in easily way.

Thanks for you opinion and ideia, lostinidlewonder!

[okoie]

 I suggest to add to your list this book: "On piano playing" by Gyorgy Sandor. The author blasts
piano exercises as useless -harmful and fully explains why. Good job

[sergioral]

Hello Okoie

I thanks for your suggestion!
I purchased, today, 2 new books:

1-"The Craft of Piano Playing"....A. Fraser
2-"On piano playing"... G. Sandor

Thanks

[romulo]

Olá, já que és português vou me dar a liberdade, 

I would recomend you a book written on portuguese called "A Ténica Pianítica: Uma Abordagem Científica" by Claudio Richerme, a little text on the book.

A Ténica Pianítica: Uma Abordagem Científica
(Claudio Richerme)

A estatísca de pessoas que se tornaram grandes pianistas depois de muito investimento de tempo de estudo é de 1 em cada 150 mil.Essa atividade ainda é de difícil acesso para muitos por se tratar de uma atividade de extrema complexidade.
     Existem vários aspestos do conhecimento musical que pecisam ser dominados para uma melhor fluência do expressar artísco, que é um dos objetivos maiores a seram alcançados na execução do instrumento.
    O domínio dos movimentos necessários para a obtenção da sonoridade, textura, velocidade desejada é um desses aspectos de extrama importância. Chamamos o estudo desses movimentos de técnica pianistica.
    Existem três tipos de pianistas, os empíricos que são pianistas que constoem sua técnica com base em suas intuições, os analíticos que se baseiam no raciocínio da física fisiológica. O último e mas ideal é o pianista que encontra um equilíbrio entre os dois raciocínios.
   É importante destacar que o som não deve estar em função da técnica, mas a técnica em função do som desejado. Por isso antes de tudo, o mais importante é aprender a ouvir. desenvolver um capacidade de construir em sua mente como a peça deveria soar. Aí sim devem ser procuradas maneiras que tornem a ideia sonora virtual em real.
   Conhecer o próprio corpo, sua fisiologia e funcionamento, deve ser o mais conciente possível. Ter conciencia de seus musculos, estrutura óssea, articulações e nervos , facilita a percepção de seus sentidos sinestésicos.
   Uma percepção sinétésica apurada será de extrema importancia para aprender sobre relaxamento e tensão. Uma boa técnica é formada por saber onde e como são aplicados o relaçamente e a tensão muscular. O domímio dessas de forças oposta que resultam em movimento, ultiliza o sistema nervoso através da coordenação motora para funcionar.
   Não podemos dizer que exista a técnica padrão, mas existem princípios básicos que regem qualquer técnica criada por cada pianista. Entre estes princípios estão as questões de movimento contra peso, quanto mais notas e veloz, mais leve deve ser o peso de toque, posições das mão, conciência de como se realiza as passagens e muitos outros.

https://www.livrariacultura.com.br/scripts/cultura/resenha/resenha.asp?isbn=8586877018&sid=71072061313215825923285746

[rmbarbosa]

Rómulo,
Tentei adquirir o livro via net mas não consegui. Sabe se está à venda em alguma livraria portuguesa, de preferência em Lisboa?

[romulo]

Como eu sou brasileiro não tive maiores problemas para comprar o livro mas uma imagem elucidativa dos valores e como colocar frete internacional talvez ajude, por volta de 53 dólares;

[sergioral]

Hello again!

I appreciate the suggestion!
Please, tell me....this book is only about piano execises in general or, the author put in conflict the both sides: use! or, not use! ?

I wrote in english because is the official language of the forum.

O preço para portugal com despesas de envio fica pelos 100 reais! Ainda é um pouco dispendioso! preciso mesmo de ter a certeza que é bom

Obrigado, thanks