Trills and Wrist Rotation

[djealnla]

While this topic has been discussed many times, I have never been able to grasp the answer to it, probably because my knowledge of the English related to human anatomy is rather poor.

Whenever someone asks about trills (especially 3-4 and 4-5), people say that is is necessary to "move the wrist" or "rotate the wrist". However, what does this mean? I looked its definition up, sat in front of my piano and used this technique, but concluded that I'm either stupid or can't speak English. Firstly, moving the wrist from side to side made trilling even more uncomfortable, since the fingers' direction and striking of the keys were being altered constantly; second, the constant moving of the wrist got my hand even more exhausted than a trill executed without some obsessive wrist rotation.

Perhaps someone could post a YouTube video, just to give me an idea as to why this technique is supposed to be helpful? I would appreciate that very much.

Thanks in advance.

[stevebob]

I think you're experiencing (1) a combination of an inaccurate description ("move the wrist"), and (2) an incorrect interpretation of a slightly better description ("rotate the wrist").

If I'm not mistaken, what is actually called for is best expressed as forearm rotation; the forearm is where the movement is initiated, and the wrist and hand rotate as a natural consequence.

There needn't be (and almost certainly shouldn't be) any side-to-side movement of the wrist on the lateral plane.

[djealnla]

I think you're experiencing (1) a combination of an inaccurate description ("move the wrist"), and (2) an incorrect interpretation of a slightly better description ("rotate the wrist").

If I'm not mistaken, what is actually called for is best expressed as forearm rotation; the forearm is where the movement is initiated, and the wrist and hand rotate as a natural consequence.

There needn't be (and almost certainly shouldn't be) any side-to-side movement of the wrist on the lateral plane.

I'm sorry, but I understood merely the first third of your post.

[stevebob]

I can't understand (nor do you indicate) what was unclear.  I'm sorry I couldn't help you.

[becky8898]

Hi: this is complicated. Can you let us know what language is  your main language. Maybe I can use a translation program so you can understand better.

Cheers, Becky

[ongaku_oniko]

Actually this is a great question!

I am a native English speaker and I still don't understand it. I mean I know the motion you guys are saying, but when I try it with a 4-5 trill, the fingers get mushed up and they start playing at the same time.

I mean it's easy when you're playing an octave like in pathetique, but when you're doing a 4-5 trill, the fingers are on the same side, so how would rotation help? :S

[jimbo320]

Actually the answer is very simple. Except for rocking #1 and #5 fingers between octaves you don't rotate the wrist. Keep your hand level with the keys and rely on your fingers. Some trilling is easier with straight fingers but always keeping the hand level. Faster trills come from faster fingers.
That's my take on the subject........

Jimbo

[pianowolfi]

have a look here at 6:41:

Hope this helps.

[pianowolfi]

Another very interesting example. Go to 3:23. Particularly interesting: the double trill movement starting at 3:57

[jimbo320]

Thanks Pianowolfi for the visual aid to what I was trying to say....

[pianowolfi]

Well all I can say is that I always use some sort of forearm rotation for trills, even if it's only a very small movement. I don't believe in isolated finger movements, they're possible but I rather consider them to be harmful.