Any idea on how to train perfect/relative pitch?

[jiaweitheone]

Hi guys, I have come across this forum just a few days ago, and so far I have gained lots of useful information around here.

 I have been learning piano for about two years. My teacher says that there are two ways which a person can develop perfect pitch. One is you are born with it, and the other comes from diligent practice when you are young (about 5 or 6 years old?). Well, I started learning piano quite late (around at the age of 16). Thus, I would like to ask if is there any way to train up in order to have a relative or perfect pitch?

[Derek]

I started piano (in a serious way) around age 17/18. I have no basis for comparison against professionals or professors, but I am pretty sure I have darn good relative pitch (as an unintended by product of improvising obsessively for about 10 years now). One time I had perfect pitch on a certain e-flat, because it sounded funny or out of tune on a piano I had at home and I listened to a recording of it one too many times. For a little while, I could figure out any pitch I heard because I knew what that e-flat sounded like (I used perfect pitch on the e-flat, then relative pitch to figure out the pitch).   I don't think that perfect pitch memory was useful, but relative pitch is definitely useful for picking out melodies, and to some degree I think it is useful for improvisation. Make sure you're clear on why you want to develop these skills before spending time on it.

[jiaweitheone]

I want to train on relative pitch for improvisation, and I was told that those who had relative or perfect pitch could play the piece/song after they listened to it. Is it just intensive practice, or there are some particular techniques for development of relative pitch?

[jimbo320]

I know someone with perfect pitch. By playing the violin a lot he gained the ability. I'm guessing here but maybe because of listening close to his ear like that and feeling it through his chin and head had something to do with it. Place your hand on top of your piano and feel that music....

[Derek]

I want to train on relative pitch for improvisation, and I was told that those who had relative or perfect pitch could play the piece/song after they listened to it. Is it just intensive practice, or there are some particular techniques for development of relative pitch?

I can say from experience it is not necessary for learning improvisation, but it may become a skill as a by product of improvising depending on how much you dig in to how music works, I think. Besides, improvisation is way more fun than dry exercises for any musical skill!

[fleetfingers]

As far as I understand, relative pitch is recognizing intervals and relations between pitches.

I accompanied one of my high school's choirs, and every day in class the choir director would start out by having everyone think about A - the one above middle C. They would think for a few seconds, he would direct them to sing it, they would all blend together and eventually agree on one note. Then, he would direct me to play A on the piano to see how accurate it was. Doing that everyday, they did get better (and so did I) at coming up with the correct pitch. They rarely got it spot on, but they would get pretty close, like A flat or B flat. Not bad. I suppose you could practice something similar on your own and see if you can familiarize yourself with a single pitch from which to find other pitches.

Speaking of the violin, I have learned to tune one and used to play the pitches of each string on the piano, then tune each string separately to match the note I was playing. Well, I've become so familiar with the intervals between the four strings that I only have to play A on the piano. The other strings I can tune with my ear, relative to the A. So, as I was saying before, learn what the intervals sound like and you can develop a good relative pitch. I don't think you can develop perfect pitch, though.

[jimbo320]

We're not sure if Ray was born with perfect pitch or not. It just became noticeable when he picked up the violin. When I was playing in one of my bands he ran the sound system and while we were all playing he could pick out the one who was out of tune or missed a note. If he said you were out of tune, missed a note or out of time, believe it......

[fleetfingers]

Your friend very well could have had perfect pitch since birth but didn't realize it until he began to play an instrument. And some people just have a very keen ear, especially violinists. I've only known one person with perfect pitch and it was unmistakable. When someone has it, they really have it.

[m1469]

This is something I have thought about a lot.

Something that I am doing recently is really trying to listen to my inward self.  I will get a kind of "welling" inside which I have recently been aiming to define in pitch, vs. allowing it to stay as only a welling within.  This is not always easy.  Once I can find that, though, I find it on the piano.  There are, in fact, particular characteristics which would help you know what it is, but right now I am not always finding a starting pitch at a first try.  And, this is different for me right now than worrying about if I were able to name a random pitch in the air while other people are watching.  This is personal.

Today, I listened to myself and sat down to play what I heard and out came music from within me in a defined way.  Just about half and hour ago, I once again heard music within me which also felt like a welling, and I sat at the piano trying to hear this and find it on the piano.  Now, this may not seem like much, but something that I think is very interesting is that, what came out of me this evening started off being quite mysterious to me.  I couldn't quite hear all of it, but then I started to hear more and more, and do you know what happened?  A piece that I had started composing about 4 months ago, but never recorded or wrote down and had basically forgotten about altogether, came right out of me, in the same key (I remember now) as what I had orginally been composing it in.  So, it started as a welling, I listened for the definition, and aside from having stumbled again upon the text --which, if there wasn't something specific to the sound, could have been anywhere-- I found it in the exact right key by "accident" (no fishing). 

I think that's interesting.

[seanramon]

Perfect pitch is something you are born with or perhaps acquire at very young age. Relative pitch is also best to learn at young age, but can also be learned later. You can ask a friend to play some chords and try to recognize intervals. You can also look for some ear-training software that tests relative pitch perception, you can find some on the internet.

[raisinbrahms]

I'm one of those weirdos who has perfect pitch  Trust me, it's both a blessing and a curse because you can't "turn it off". 

I actually did a pretty extensive research paper on it in college.  There seems to be a genetic basis for the trait - in other words, if you have the gene and are exposed to musical training at an early age, that seems to be the winning cocktail.  I don't know of anyone who was able to "learn" perfect pitch, though I know some people who can get pretty close.  Most of us who have it will rarely, if ever, identify the wrong note.  For me, it's like seeing a color.  If it's yellow, it's yellow. 

Developing good relative pitch is an essential skill though.  I have always had perfect pitch, but had to work on developing relative pitch (quickly identifying an interval as opposed to saying "that's C and that's F#").

[raintree]

Has anyone tried the following perfect pitch course?


https://www.discount.perfectpitch.com/chapter1.htm

[thinkgreenlovepiano]

I wonder if learning at a young age or learning solfege has anything to do with it.
My sister started music lessons way younger than me, and her lessons were more focused on solfege and singing and ear training, and she has perfect pitch. She says that when a note is being played she just hears "do", or "re" or whatever the note is... And most of the other kids in her class could do it too.
If its genetics, no one else in my family has it. My pitch is horrible...!!!

For those who have perfect pitch, how do you identify intervals? I memorized the sounds of different intervals, but my sister who has perfect pitch, listens to the notes individually and figures out the interval like that. Which seems a lot trickier =/

[ted]

I diligently used one of those computer ear training programmes - relative pitch, chord and interval recognition and so on - every day for a few months last year just to see what happened. What happened was that I became very good at the programme itself but found it completely irrelevant to what I actually do at the instrument. In other words, my personal musical objectives do not require the particular skills honed by the software.

Of course I might just be too old for it to have made any difference, but it reached the stage where I thought, "Why am I spending all this time at acquiring an isolated ability of dubious value (to me) when I could be creating real music ?" To take an analogy, it seemed to me rather like working at mental arithmetic in order to understand differential equations - not necessary.   

[raisinbrahms]

For those who have perfect pitch, how do you identify intervals? I memorized the sounds of different intervals, but my sister who has perfect pitch, listens to the notes individually and figures out the interval like that. Which seems a lot trickier =/

I do what your sister does....like, my first instinct when I hear a major sixth is to think or say "C and A" (assuming those are the two actual notes) as opposed to "major sixth".  It seems like it would be harder, but I usually find it easier to pick out the notes as opposed to immediately identifying an interval or chord quality.  I don't know if that's because of the perfect pitch or if it's just because my brain is wired backwards 

[kelly_kelly]

I think really good relative pitch is as good as perfect pitch in practical terms - in fact, one of my good friends who has perfect pitch says that she finds it annoying... though I'm not sure she would give it up if she had the choice, especially being a string player As for relative pitch, it can be learned... but to be honest I've never found any reason to? So I have terrible ears... nobody can tell while I'm playing

[pianoplayjl]

From my point of view one can not be trained to have perfect/relative pitch. I think it is a gift to people. My sister has perfect pitch though.

[theodore]

At one outdoor concert where I played in the 1st violin section there was an oboist who performed the Allesandro Marcello Oboe Concerto.  It was quite humid and the oboe was slowly getting sharper. During the second movement the harpsichord player stopped playing because he realized that his instrument could not adjust to the solo oboe.

The rest of the string section rose in pitch and was perfectly in tune with the oboist. Fixed pitch instruments such as the piano an organ are unable to adjust to the tiniest variances in pitch.  The concerto was applauded with a standing ovation.  Over the course of the concerto the pitch had risen almost half a tone.

[pianoplayjl]

wow. The other day my teacher pointed out to me that humidity can affect the piano profoundly.

[thinkgreenlovepiano]

From my point of view one can not be trained to have perfect/relative pitch. I think it is a gift to people. My sister has perfect pitch though.

I've been thinking about this...
If perfect pitch is innate, where does it come from... what makes people with perfect pitch different? If notes can be learned, why can't perfect pitch? 

Yeah I'm just really curious about this type of stuff

[pianoplayjl]

Maybe most people can recognize individual notes when played on the piano but some cannot recognise chords, me for example.

[mike_lang]

Short answers:

Perfect pitch: You're not going to learn it after a critical age of, say, 3 or 4.
Relative pitch: Can be developed to an enormous degree; practice it in everything you do.  It is not limited solely to interval recognition, so expand your definition a bit . . .

Best,
Mike