Beginner's Question on Fingering

[tanarif]

Hello, I'm starting out with piano and cannot afford a teacher, know a bit of the basics but am slightly confused over what the standard thought for fingering is and some other stuff in general. I would much appreciate your thoughts as I often help out a few of my younger siblings, and obviously want to direct them in the best manner possible. I'll try to number it since my questions are bit scattered.

1) Am I to take it, that the standard fingering is for right hand, the thumb on C (as position 1), and for the left hand the little finger on C (as position 1)? Just for clarification purposes, does this hold true for all pieces, or is this only when the scale is in C? (I do not know much about scales either, but I assume a similar scale of say G, would have the same finger positions but starting at G? Or have I just made that up?) 
2) Now a bit I don't understand, I've seen all sorts of ideas on how to play keys that are outside the reach say C to G for the right hand. One place says to play C,D,E using fingers 1,2,3 and then to move the finger 1 to F and play F,G,A,B,C as 1,2,3,4,5. So essentially playing C to C as 1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5. Is this a correct method?

3) My reason for asking is essentially this. I was looking at a basic piece of music. It goes GGEG, AGEB for the beginning. Now, how would people play this using there fingering? The first part can be played using the thumb at C for the right hand, but for the second part, does the little finger have to play G, A and B?

4) Similar to the above, another piece goes: CCFEG. Do I play that using 1 on C (the thumb) and G as position 5? All in all I'm really looking for an understanding on what the standard thought for finger positions are, and if there are any conventions generally followed as I believe going further without understanding this will waste time later on. Again any help much appreciated!

[leonbloy]

1) Am I to take it, that the standard fingering is for right hand, the thumb on C (as position 1), and for the left hand the little finger on C (as position 1)?

There are no fixed fingerings. In many scales the thumb (finger 1) plays the "first note" (the tonic, that what gives its name to the scale/key) - but that's not at all a rule, and it would apply only to a full scale (and even not to all scales). Another "rule" (very loose) is try to prefer fingers 234 for black keys.

2) Now a bit I don't understand, I've seen all sorts of ideas on how to play keys that are outside the reach say C to G for the right hand. One place says to play C,D,E using fingers 1,2,3 and then to move the finger 1 to F and play F,G,A,B,C as 1,2,3,4,5. So essentially playing C to C as 1,2,3,1,2,3,4,5. Is this a correct method?

Yes, that is a standard fingering for some scales. But instead of asking here and trying to deduce rules, you 'd much better find somewhere any elementary book with the scales fully fingered. That's a must.

3) My reason for asking is essentially this. I was looking at a basic piece of music. It goes GGEG, AGEB for the beginning. Now, how would people play this using there fingering? The first part can be played using the thumb at C for the right hand, but for the second part, does the little finger have to play G, A and B?

I'm another self-teaching student, and I highly recommend you: begin by learning ONLY pieces that are heavily fingered.
Don't try to deduce rules too early, you must follow first the common used fingering till they fell natural to you. Rules will come later -as also the freedom to make your own little changes.

[nystul]

A teacher would help tremendously because fingering and technique go hand in hand.  But anyways:

1)  There is no such thing as a standard hand position.  Your hand position needs to be wherever the notes you need to play are.  More on this later.

2)  Going from C to C on the white keys (this is the C major scale), 12312345 is a very good fingering.  This involves a technique you must learn, crossing or passing the thumb.  The thumb becomes a pivot point to change the position of your hand without breaking up the phrase you are playing.  Usually when you need to do this, it involves the thumb with either the 3 or 4.

3)  OK, as I said before there is no standard hand position.  So it doesn't matter if this piece is in C or not.  You aren't playing the note C in this phrase, so you don't need to worry about whether your thumb is on it!  If there is a comfortable hand position that allows you to put a finger on each note you must play in the phrase, then that is probably a good solution.  In this case you can put your thumb on E, 3 on G, 4 on A, and 5 on B.  Second finger will natural rest on F even though you won't be playing it.

4)  So this time putting your thumb on C will work really well.  Not because that is the "standard position" but because it allows you fingers to naturally fall on each of the keys you must play without having to ever change hand positions or make your hand go into an unnatural shape.

These are kind of the basics.  There is no fingering rule that involves *always* or *never*.  It's about being able to play the music well and easily and with a relaxed hand.  Say in case 3 that you kept your thumb on the C and played G, A, and B all with the 5.  The biggest problem with that is that you are asking yourself to play 2 consecutive notes on different keys with the same finger.  It's not impossible to do, but very hard to do well and in this case there is absolutely no need for it. The second problem is that you are stretching your hand to reach the B.  Unless you have really small hands, this isn't a hard reach, but it is not the natural position of your hand and you have no need for that low C in this example.

Now if you did need to reach from C to B within a phrase, then you have to consider a few options.  In some cases, the best thing might be to stretch your hand and play the notes with the nearest fingers.  In other cases, the best thing might be to change hand positions by passing the thumb.  And when you start to use the black keys, you need to pay attention to how they change the shape of your hand.  It's a lot easy to change hand positions with the long finger on a black key and the thumb on a white key than it is if the thumb is on the black key.