Should I go back and learn 'beginner' pieces?

[larapool]

Hello,

My background in piano is a little strange.  No classical training until the beginning of 2010 when I began college (transferring to a university next month actually!  can't wait) and after my professor said my technique was already wonderful and my theory knowledge was great, we began working on some simple Bach.

Well, as of last semester, after three semesters with him, I've learned the following:

Bach - Inventions 1, 2, 4, 8, 10, 13; Sinfonia 15
Beethoven - Sonata 20 (Op. 49 No. 2) first movement
Mozart - K545 second movement
Chopin - Preludes 7, 20

I know those are relatively easy compositions for those composers except maybe Sinfonia 15, which is very fun to play, but after consulting my upcoming piano instructor at my new school, he wants me to learn the following for the first week of school:

Beethoven - Sonata 19 (Op. 49 No. 1) first movement
Chopin - Preludes 11, 23

I've been feverishly practicing these and they're incredibly fun, especially Prelude 23.  However, I know that because of my late start in classical study and my lack of repertoire that I'm missing quite a bit of beginner stuff (since we pretty much started my lessons with Bach's Invention No. 1 and moved on from there).

I went to the music shop yesterday and looked at some books I've heard were for young/beginner musicians - Magdalena Bach's book, and Schumann's Album for the Young, for example.  I'm wondering if I should pick these up and play through them despite the harder pieces I'm learning now.  Would they be good for sight reading?  My sight reading is horrendous and I imagine beginner pieces would be a good exercise for this.

Thanks for any help!  I apologize if this seems long-winded - I like to give plenty of background and explanation as to avoid confusion 

[john90]

First off, very well done. To your question I would say no.

My advice, to help sight reading practice ledger line notes on flash cards. Then try sight reading things like Fur Elise, Moonlight Sonata, the National Anthem, Christmas carols, Hymns. Things you know already by ear, things that will make you feel like you are enlarging and filling in the missing bits. You can usually get this type of music for free or second hand.

[countrymath]

What style did you play before classical?

[larapool]

@john: Thanks a lot for your advice!

@countrymath:  I sat around as a kid just playing around with toy keyboards, usually just learning by ear music from video games like Super Mario Bros. and The Legend of Zelda.  Eventually I began just putting hands together and playing my own arrangements of songs, and somehow trained myself to use both of them well, and somehow just got a lot of skill through that.  I also came across neoclassical keyboard playing in metal music (which is the biggest influence in my musical life) and I suppose that had a huge influence in me learning to play fast and complex stuff.

[countrymath]

@john: Thanks a lot for your advice!

@countrymath:  I sat around as a kid just playing around with toy keyboards, usually just learning by ear music from video games like Super Mario Bros. and The Legend of Zelda.  Eventually I began just putting hands together and playing my own arrangements of songs, and somehow trained myself to use both of them well, and somehow just got a lot of skill through that.  I also came across neoclassical keyboard playing in metal music (which is the biggest influence in my musical life) and I suppose that had a huge influence in me learning to play fast and complex stuff.

Very interesting

I love neoclassical metal. How did you learn it? Do you have recordings of you playing?

[larapool]

Very interesting

I love neoclassical metal. How did you learn it? Do you have recordings of you playing?

I remember hearing piano/harpsichord/string/etc. sounds in metal way back when I was about 10, and that blew my mind, because I never thought metal music could still sound heavy with those instruments.  I dug a little deeper and found the song Black Diamond by Stratovarius, with a simple harpsichord intro, and that was the first piece I learned.  Granted, to this day I still can't perform some of the solos by those keyboardists, but I have learned interesting techniques on synthesizers from them - such as using two hands to tap the same note very fast, like a guitarist.  Basically, I started off with the goal of becoming a fast player - and somehow I was lucky enough to learn good technique in the process!  I just started off slowly and worked on parts that were manageable.  Since neoclassical metal uses lots of string chords on keyboards, I got very familiar with chords and progressions that way.  There really wasn't any pattern of organization... it just all came together, thankfully!

I don't have any recordings right now.  Nothing of decent quality, anyway.  I can play a few solos by the band Sonata Arctica; if you're familiar with the songs Full Moon, Victoria's Secret, and My Selene, I can play those pretty solidly.

[gerryjay]

Dear Larapool,
to answer your question, I must ask you something: are you satisfied with the results you achieved so far? Is your teacher satisfied as well? If both answers are yes - and I'll assume they are - you are just fine. Then, the idea of going back is not for you.

Nevertheless, the repertoire is wide, and the pieces you want to play have many different levels of complexity (in other words, some are easy now, some are impossible). The coolest idea is to make a list of what you really want to play, and then - with some help by your teacher - organize that to have a well balanced choice of works.

For instance, after the sonatas you played, it is time to tackle a first movement in sonata form with greater dimensions. Let's say, Beethoven's opus 02 number 1. But let me suppose you love the first sonatina by Beethoven, in G major. It is becoming quite easy to you by now: why not playing it as well?

Another example is Bach. From the point you are, there are many possibilities, but a simpler fugue from WTC could be nice, or a couple of dances from a suite (an allemande-courante pair, for instance). In the same fashion, the minuets from Anna Magdalena's Notebook are piece of cake. Why don't you play a pair of them?

Notice that a teacher's help is mandatory to guide your choices, but a hint may be useful: a challenge (this Beethoven's first movement, or Bach's fugue) will take months to be proper done, will have passages that you will strugle with. The idea, btw, is that: the piece must have aspects to push you further. These other pieces (the easy ones) are something that will be done after a week or ten days. That is, they will not present major problems - or no problem at all - but are nice repertoire to play.

Finally, a balanced repertoire is usually made of easy and more challenging works, pieces that you play for years and pieces that you are just trying, and so on.

Best regards,
Jay.

[countrymath]

I remember hearing piano/harpsichord/string/etc. sounds in metal way back when I was about 10, and that blew my mind, because I never thought metal music could still sound heavy with those instruments.  I dug a little deeper and found the song Black Diamond by Stratovarius, with a simple harpsichord intro, and that was the first piece I learned.  Granted, to this day I still can't perform some of the solos by those keyboardists, but I have learned interesting techniques on synthesizers from them - such as using two hands to tap the same note very fast, like a guitarist.  Basically, I started off with the goal of becoming a fast player - and somehow I was lucky enough to learn good technique in the process!  I just started off slowly and worked on parts that were manageable.  Since neoclassical metal uses lots of string chords on keyboards, I got very familiar with chords and progressions that way.  There really wasn't any pattern of organization... it just all came together, thankfully!

I don't have any recordings right now.  Nothing of decent quality, anyway.  I can play a few solos by the band Sonata Arctica; if you're familiar with the songs Full Moon, Victoria's Secret, and My Selene, I can play those pretty solidly.

Yeah, i'm familiar with them. But can you improvise solos?

[larapool]

I can improvise but I'm no virtuoso.  I focus more on right hand playing than left hand (due to my lack of classical training), but I'll play chords and vary up the rhythm in my left hand, sometimes cross hands for really fast sweeps up and down the keyboard if I feel like it.  I'm generally best at using typical I, IV, and V chords, though I'll throw in secondary dominants and modulate as well.  Not so familiar with comping on chords like III, VI, and VII, which is probably something I should work on.

But I'm also not a fan of improvising, which is why I'm not a big jazz fan at all

[countrymath]

I can improvise but I'm no virtuoso.  I focus more on right hand playing than left hand (due to my lack of classical training), but I'll play chords and vary up the rhythm in my left hand, sometimes cross hands for really fast sweeps up and down the keyboard if I feel like it.  I'm generally best at using typical I, IV, and V chords, though I'll throw in secondary dominants and modulate as well.  Not so familiar with comping on chords like III, VI, and VII, which is probably something I should work on.

But I'm also not a fan of improvising, which is why I'm not a big jazz fan at all

No, i mean,  can you improvise neoclassical solos?

[larapool]

I'm afraid I'm not sure what you mean by that - that question sounds a little vague to me.  If not, pardon my ignorance!  What exactly do you consider a neoclassical solo?

[countrymath]

[Bob]

After reading just the first post...

Yes, sure, go back and learn as much easier material as you want.  It will help your reading, expand the styles you know of, etc.  Nothing wrong with that.  It's not going to take a huge investment in time.  Just sprinkle some easier pieces in with harder stuff.

[thompson_321]

Hello,

My background in piano is a little strange.  No classical training until the beginning of 2010 when I began college (transferring to a university next month actually!  can't wait) and after my professor said my technique was already wonderful and my theory knowledge was great, we began working on some simple Bach.

Well, as of last semester, after three semesters with him, I've learned the following:

Bach - Inventions 1, 2, 4, 8, 10, 13; Sinfonia 15
Beethoven - Sonata 20 (Op. 49 No. 2) first movement
Mozart - K545 second movement
Chopin - Preludes 7, 20

Hi Larapool

I am in the same situation as you. I am going back to the beginning, and the pieces you mention seem good to start with. Do you think I should start with these pieces also? I have been learning for years, but never took it seriously until now. I'm not telling you my age, but I am under 30! Thanks.