1917 Sherman Clay

[apmsa]

Hi all!

I have a Sherman Clay 1917 piano that I'm looking to sell. I will post pictures below, would anyone take a "rough" guess at what I should sell it for?

[silverwoodpianos]

This is not a piano from that era; more likely to be 1977 or early 70’s by the style of the cabinet. These small console uprights became popular after the Second War.

Value would depend upon local markets for used musical instruments and present mechanical condition of said piece.

[keys60]

I'm going to have to assume that was a typo. Definitely from the from the 70's. Its worth whatever someone is willing to give you for it at this point. Obscure named pianos from that era and that size don't retain much value, especially depending on condition. It its in complete working order without excessive wear to the action and felts, a few hundred to sub 1K at best.

[apmsa]

Sorry, folks. My grandmother can remember it being purchased secondhand when she was in her 20's. She's 84 now. My mother had her first lessons on this piano when she was 7 years old. She's 63 now. We called manufacturer and gave then the engraved serial number, and they gave us this info. But thanks for your replies. We'd still love to know a rough estimate of what it's worth though.

[lhommearme]

Dan or Keys,correct me if I am wrong, but consoles were a product of the 30's on. I dont think they were around in 1917. If so then we have discoverd the earliest know spinet to date. I dont think its that old mate.

[apmsa]

I will call the manufacturer one more time on Monday to confirm, but they have told us 2 xs now that it is 1917, once over the phone and the other by email. I did not provide photos however, I only provided the serial number, which is... 710 14. Thanks for the attention to this. I'm really curious about it now as well.

[keys60]

Ok. If you say so. Just that the cabinet is so out of touch with what was being produced in that era. Most pianos were more rounded and ornate in the 40's on back. Tell you what. Lift the lid and more than likely, somewhere along the top (usually on the treble end) there may be a serial no. Post it and I or someone here will look up the date of manufacture for you. sigh......not me, my Piano Atlas doesn't have Sherman Clay listed unless it is made be a parent company with that name slapped on. I'll keep up my search.

[keys60]

Ok. Found it. You stumped the panel.
As written in the Piano Atlas:  "brand name used by Sherman-Clay, (San Francisco, Ca. USA)

Brand manufactured by various companies. Numbers may conflict with other published data but matches withe series numbers used by Cable, Estey, and Haddorff. Also made by Aeolian and others but no data available"
 
Haddorff no.s (too many to list. I'll give you 1917)-71500 ending with 1923-107000
Cable Piano Co. 1935-308000 to 1942-315000
Estey Co. 1935-122000 to 1942-133000

Interesting that a console of that style may be from 1917.
Whatever year it is, its not from the 70's. Last date of manufacture is 1942.

Back to the original post, its not an antique rebuilt collectible, so ask around grand or a little more  and negotiate from there. That's about as rough a guesstimate I can provide.

[silverwoodpianos]

This is not from 1917; an instrument most likely made under contract by Aeolian; I have a 1971 Estey with the identical cabinet; the legs are fluted, square and that type of music desk with the wire sections was not popular until the late 60’s early 70’s.   The horizontal sliding fallboard was popular in the late 60’s…….

In 1917 no-one made the compressed action to fit into these small machines. Most likely a drop action……..One would have to pull the action to find the signature on the back or on the key bed if there is one.

I am not sure at this point if that is the serial number….could be model number, production line numbers or cabinet style numbers….

lhommearme;

It is the case that small console uprights were being manufactured in the late 30’s. I have come across several of them over the years. They did not gain in popularity though until after the second war, when everyone wanted something new.

By that time most of the piano makers who manufactured the tall older uprights were either bankrupt from the 30’s or had been making small arms for the war effort.

[apmsa]

Thanks all of you for the information, and Keyes, thank you for putting in so much time to look it up. I hope you at least were able to have some fun trying to solve the mystery.

I did a lot of calling around yesterday to family members, and I do know that it is at least 64 years old. So that puts us in to the 40's. And honestly, what you're saying does make a lot more sense. The only thing that confuses me is why Sherman, Clay & CO. wouldn't have given me this information. Anyone who is an actual employee of theirs ought to have known that there's no such thing as a spinet from 1917.

Oh well. I'll keep searching for an additional serial number. Thanks so much again.

[silverwoodpianos]

Try moving the piano out from the wall and look on the rear plank at the right and left top corners.

Should be a six digit number……

Caryl Draper (Sherlock Manning Piano Co. Canada) was responsible for the early development of the drop action, taking some of the ideas from an English piano called the “Minx” and some of the early ideas he had developed from the 20’s.

In approximately 1937-41 he developed an acceptable fine quality 41 inch upright for consumers. From that point on most of the other piano manufacturers responded with their own version by 1950.

[apmsa]

Hi Silverwood,

That is exactly where I found the serial number originally, on the upper left of the back. It is 710 14, and that's where all of this mess started, trying to figure out what year it was really made in. Because when we look up 710 14, it comes back with a 1917 date. And as it seems, that's not possible.

The bottom line for me is that I want to sell this piano, and I don't want to sell it for way under if it ends up being worth way more. At this point though, I'm agreeing with some of the responders that this isn't a 1917 and therefore not worth more than a thousand dollars.

[silverwoodpianos]

Ah I see...got it.

I note that the serial number supplied has a space between some of the digits. It is possible that this number has a digit missing and that could be where this confusion lies.
 
Most likely the action or keyboard has a date written somewhere when these components were installed into the frame but one would have to pay a technician to pull it apart.

In any case a 50 yr old small stencil piano would not carry much value for re-sale. Depending upon where you are located $300-$500 dollars.

To get an idea of value look at similar instruments in your area, what they are asking, and more importantly what are they selling for?  This will give you an idea of values in your neighbourhood.