Website for Pianists

[yale_music]

Hello everyone,

I'm new here at Pianostreet and would like to begin straight away by picking your brains. I have an idea for a website and would like your suggestions. The idea is more or less as follows:

I want to gradually build a site for amateur pianists that has lots of learning tools related to specific pieces of music. As a trial run, I might post "instruction modules" for the Chopin Preludes, or a smaller set of works. This module would include things like: theoretical analysis, performance suggestions, help with potential technical difficulties, etc.

So, my question is this: what features would you find useful on such a site? My dream is to eventually cover the Western canon in its entirety, and with the support of a major university behind me, I think this dream is tenable.

Thanks so much for your time and consideration.

All the best,
Andrew

[lelle]

I don't think you'll be able to accomplish that for the entire Wester repertoire by yourself. Maybe allow musicians who visit the site to give suggestions about interpretation, technical problems and solutions, analysis and so on, and then allow users to vote for which of each type of "guide" is best, displaying the ones with the most positive votes

[mcdiddy1]

That sounds great. You should do it. I would find it useful rather than sending kids to youtube and never knowing what kind of quality it will be.

[yale_music]

I don't think you'll be able to accomplish that for the entire Wester repertoire by yourself. Maybe allow musicians who visit the site to give suggestions about interpretation, technical problems and solutions, analysis and so on, and then allow users to vote for which of each type of "guide" is best, displaying the ones with the most positive votes

Absolutely. This was never intended to be a do-it-myself kind of project. In the meantime, however, I'm looking for suggestions from every-day pianists so that I can develop a prototype.

[yale_music]

That sounds great. You should do it. I would find it useful rather than sending kids to youtube and never knowing what kind of quality it will be.

Thanks! Any suggestions on the sorts of resources you'd like to see?

[brogers70]

Hello Andrew,

That's an outstanding idea! I am your target audience, absolutely. Here are some things I'd find very helpful at such a site.

1. For Bach, for example. Take the WTC fugues. Produce a score that has each voice written separately with fingering indications to show what fingers will be used when the voices are all put back together. With that, one can practice the individual voices with correct fingerings and get it all into your head before trying to put the counterpoint together. I do this myself, but it's slow, and it would be great to have pdfs of such a breakdown available quickly.

2. For Classical sonatas explanations or leading questions to help see why it is built the way it is. My guess is that most pianists who can play a Mozart or Beethoven sonata have some idea about sonata-allegro form, but there may still be questions worth exploring. For example, why does the Beethoven Opus 14/1 E major sonata have a development section largely unrelated to anything in the exposition? In the same section (the A minor bit in the development) you could have technical suggestions on how to play the rapid LH arpeggios, circular motion, and all that.

3. For the Chopin Etudes (not that I or other amateurs are likely to play them that much) you could make simplified outlines or breakdowns so that people get the structure before they tackle all the notes.

4. For many pieces a bit of history on the composer and what is known about the circumstances of the composition of the individual piece could be interesting.

5. Similarly, for many piece, explanations or leading questions about how to think of the piece as a whole, peaks of tension, pacing, that sort of thing.

6. Listing pieces that are canonical examples of specific technical challenges. Or even excerpts of famous pieces that can be used as exercises for specific techniques, the tremolo in the Pathetique, sustained trills from the Waldstein, wide leaps from any number of Scarlatti sonatas. Since these challenges may represent the hardest aspect of a well known piece, using them as exercises may open up the whole piece to people who'd otherwise be afraid to tackle it.

I'll try to think of other possibilities. I think this is a great idea.

Go Yale,

Bill '80 Timothy Dwight

[brogers70]

Another thought on this.
I'm always surprised by how many people post here asking for suggestions about what to learn next. Personally, I can always think of about 10 times more pieces that I'd like to play next than I actually have time to learn, but for some people it may be a real problem.

Therefore, you could consider posting a variety of five year plans, sets of progressively more difficult pieces. You could make different ones that progress at different rates (you know, special ones for us old folks that learn slow); you could tailor them to  likely musical goals and tastes. Something like, Plan A is for those of you who think the Goldberg Variations is the height of music, Plan B for those of you who really love the Chopin Etudes, Plan C if late Schubert and Beethoven are what you love. You'd start at several technical levels below the target repertoire and include a variety of technically and musically interesting pieces along the way, so you needn't make Plan A all baroque, etc. You'd think that this would be the teacher's job, but I think many do not develop such well-structured, long-term plans for the student. I think it requires a really wide knowledge of the literature to do this well.

Bill

[opusmusic]

Good luck on starting your website!  When you get it up and running, you can actually monetize on your website using adsense or affiliate programs.  For example, if a reader purchases a music book that you recommend on your site, you can receive a commission on the sale.  Or traditional pay per click ads.  Just an idea on how to also make money on a site that you already have a good idea on.  Hope this helps!

-Theresa
Free music theory worksheets

[yale_music]

Thank you for the wonderful suggestions; they are greatly appreciated. Keep 'em coming!

[lostinidlewonder]

Wonderful idea, let me play the devils advocate. As a professional musician who makes a living from teaching I would feel quite reserved contributing detailed analysis of music to help people learn for free. Because of this I would not really contribute a lot of material to this project because I will make no money out of it and giving away years of experience for 0$. This raises problems of having scattergun type advice (small bits of advice from many different people on a single piece) making learning the score no less easier. I think if you invested in paying professional teachers to contribute then this project would be very strong.

Sure many professional musicians donate their time and advice on pianostreet but this forums aim is not only for helping people learn particular pieces. If it where I would be posting a great deal less because that is like work!!

[bachbrahmsschubert]

A nice idea, though this seems like a gigantic project that would not prove to be worth the effort. I know, I know, don't have anything nice to say don't say it all...blah!

I guess it all depends on the type of person reading the information on your website, but it's going to be difficult not allowing it to become a "how to" guide to performance practice. I think such things should be avoided as most interpretive ideas are subjective. Although your goal may be to compile suggestions and ideas, such places already exist and the amateur student would be better off with a professional teacher.

As far as the theoretical analysis is concerned, very very few amateur pianists will understand how to read an analysis of a piece. Now your target audience is divided; is it worth the time and resources? Like lostinidlewonder mentioned, I don't think you will find many people that would contribute to this project for free; it seems that you would need a very large team of dedicated individuals to set this in motion. Then again, the first thing that comes to mind is IMSLP. Several individuals have put forth many hours of work to get a compilation of that magnitude organized.

Through all my pessimism, I wish you the best of luck!

[je_piano]

I have a few ideas. 
First, I think when people visit websites they are looking for very specific information, and tend to ignore everything else.  If they don't find what they're looking for, they move on very quickly (you can verify this when you examine the stats for a page or a site).  So it might be a big risk to invest a huge amount of time, effort, or money into a very large website only to have the majority of its content ignored by visitors.
Second, traditional websites are becoming a thing of the past, with a move to mobile apps (including mobile web apps).  I would strongly consider focusing on creating mobile content (either as native apps or as web apps) that addresses particular needs in a focused way.  For example, I could see having one module targeting performance practices for a particular style or period, including the views of established authorities in those areas.
Third, content:  I'd like to see more readily-available info on performance practices (ornaments, articulation, dynamics, pedaling, etc).  I find myself refering back to various books and sources on this - having the info easily available on my ipad would be great!

Jon

[brogers70]

Wonderful idea, let me play the devils advocate. As a professional musician who makes a living from teaching I would feel quite reserved contributing detailed analysis of music to help people learn for free. Because of this I would not really contribute a lot of material to this project because I will make no money out of it and giving away years of experience for 0$.

You raise a fair point. There may be people unwilling to contribute on the grounds that they would be giving away knowledge that they could otherwise sell. Still, in the age of wikipedia, SETI at home, and Open Office, I'm pretty sure there would be plenty of people willing to pitch in.

[danhuyle]

If it showed you how to tackle the Godowski/Chopin Etudes... That's gonna be mind blowing. I've heard that only 10 pianists have recorded the whole set of that.

[stephenv]

PLEASE DO THIS!  There once was a magazine for muscians called The Etude, followed by Clavier, and some others.  These magazines contained articles aimed at giving amateurs information such as you will provide. However, I see your project as broader and much more useful.   

I read that Anton Rubenstein wanted to bring music to the masses.  Leschetizky specialized in only the very gifted.  One of my mentor's Guy Maier, was intent on making the art of playing the piano available to ALL who had a deep desire to learn.

I see your work as a continuation of what Mr. Maier wanted to do.  (He wrote a question and answer column in the Etude..long time ago).

CARRY ON !!!! JUST DO IT. 

[DeusExMachina]

What made Clavier so special was the articles on composers,  intimate interviews with the great pianists, research presentted by scholars in the field, reviews of new publications, reviews of new recordings, articles on pedagogy. I really miss that magazine. It did not, however, feature any questions and answers regarding performance and practice, except what was preplanned by the author. Do you think there will ever be a publication to match Clavier?

[DeusExMachina]

You seem to have support here, so I'll put forth my concerns. It seems to me there is an ethical problem with setting up a huge site that purports to teach. I am uncomfortable on the forums that exist now in answering some questions, as many students already have teachers. Many teachers don't like to have competition when they're teaching, and rightly so. Plus, I do think there should be consideration for private teachers who have spent their lives teaching one-on-one. I think most experienced teachers know that students sometimes have a tendency to find the grass greener on the other side. A site of this sort may offer an opportunity for "infidelity". How will you qualify your teachers/pianists? Will it be "buyer beware?"  Undercutting other teachers is a real concern.