restore or buy new?

[deejeff442]

my neighbor across the street has an 1880-1890 chickering piano .concert size 9 foot maybe.just beautiful .all hand carved legs and such.now it needs some serious restoring.alot of the keys you have to really push down hard for them to even make a noise.the wood is pretty rough but i have a friend that is a life long wood worker and i am pretty sure he can redo the wood.now i know a restore is expensive but in reality what would it cost to restring,new keys and replace all the working parts? would it be worth the money or would i be better to just find a nice baby grand for $8000-$10,000 ?

[iumonito]

If you were to put $10k towards the action and the belly of the Chickering, in most cases you would end up with a superb instrument (assuming the person doing the restoration is knowledgeable and the piano has not suffered some irreparable damage).  $15k most likely would leave you with an instrument that could be used for pubic performance, and $20k a concert ready, recording ready superb machine.  After restoration, I would expect such an instrument would give you 20 to 30 years of piano with relatively little maintenance.

The same 10K would get you a higher-end Chinese baby grand, or a lower-end Chinese semi-concert grand (around 7 feet, perhaps marginally larger than a Steinway B).  You can't teach tall, so such a piano can never be made to perform and sound like a well-made, well-designed full grand.  I don't know why someone would, but if you were to put another 10K to 15K to soup-up the semi-concert grand, you may end up with a nice piano (think Brodmann here, which is a high-end Chinese piano, very well designed and competently made).  I would expect you would need to put another 3K to 5K every four to six years to keep the instrument adjusted.  It is unclear how it would perform 20 to 30 years from now.

I would say you will get much more piano from restoration than the same amount of money will get you buying new, particularly if you already have a suitable candidate.  The equation would not be the same if the piano for rebuild was smaller or not such a  good design, as those do not restore as nice.  There is such thing as firewood.

[deejeff442]

i am not looking to have it concert ready.just to play in my home .i am a big history buff and would by far rather have something like this old piano than a new one.i have my piano lesson tonight and will ask my mentor if she knows a restorer.then i will have him come out and look.
i talked to my wood worker friend and he said just the veneer might be a problem sanding .but he has been doing wood work for 40 years .pretty sure he will make it perfect.the piano owner also has a huge stack of very old classical music .she was going to donate somewhere.this weekend i will go back over and take a closer look.but at a glance the books are yellow in color meaning very old and i saw some beethoven .i might just bring them to my teacher for her to look through.i feel like i am on antique roadshow over there.
thanks for the input.and if i can i will try to post a picture of the wood work this weekend

[keys60]

Save the beast. Prices vary, but 10 grand should get you a pretty complete rebuild, sans the finish.
Not too many good 9 footers out there on the cheap.

[john90]

If the piano inspires you looking at the wood as it is now, stains, faded parts, lifting bits of veneer. Why not just fix the thing, rather than restore? Get any loose veneer made good, beeswax on some faded parts to protect from further decay. Replace any missing keytops with similar texture used material. Spend minimum on appearance, maximum on performance. Get whatever needs doing to the action, new strings if required, felts, etc. keys levelled.

For me, unless the case is absolutely 100% perfectly restored, I would rather see the original finish, whatever is left, nicely presented. I find a nicely cleaned and waxed old case far more alluring than a new polyester finish.

Buying new, or rather second hand, but 4 to 5 years old, again privately, might be a great deal right now. Perhaps a US built Baldwin or 20 year old Steinway. Something bigger than a baby grand. Good baby grands are expensive, going bigger can save money, certainly in Europe.

[pbryld]

Seems like a no-brainer to me. Restore.

[deejeff442]

i have talked to my piano teacher.she is from russia ,learned at an early age in the schools there .not like here in the USA. she has been playing for 30+ years and teaching for alot of those.that being said she did tell me that an old piano like this one 100+ years old would make a better piece of furniture than it would play.even after all new internal parts were replaced .she said it will not keep tune for very long .i really trust her opinion.so now i dont know which way to go?i did find a nice essex all bright white piano with a 5 year warranty for $8800 not bad

[john90]

i really trust her opinion.so now i dont know which way to go?i did find a nice essex all bright white piano with a 5 year warranty for $8800 not bad

Looks like I mis-undersood quite a bit here. I would personally go down the route of getting a nice upright for max $1000 used, that you can play now, day in day out. Baby grand wise I was thinking of a 40s Steinway for that money. Essex is not in that league.

Get the Chickering in, let it settle, clean it out, see how it holds tune, observe it for 6 months while practising on the upright. Take it really slowly, forget restoring the case, love it for what it is now. If it looks like it will never be your dream piano, let it move on. New strings and an action overhaul might be all it needs best case.

[keys60]

i have talked to my piano teacher.she is from russia ,learned at an early age in the schools there .not like here in the USA. she has been playing for 30+ years and teaching for alot of those.that being said she did tell me that an old piano like this one 100+ years old would make a better piece of furniture than it would play.even after all new internal parts were replaced .she said it will not keep tune for very long .i really trust her opinion.so now i dont know which way to go?i did find a nice essex all bright white piano with a 5 year warranty for $8800 not bad

Hmmmmmmm...... She a technician?

[deejeff442]

i dont think she is a tech.but she has gone through the inside workings of a piano with me and i was plenty impressed.if i knew that this old piano would be perfect for 10k-12k retore.i would do it but i get mixed opinions and in no way am i willing to spend that kind of cash and it dont keep tune or something else.i am not saying the piano wouldnt come out right but for that kind of money i dont think i want to take the chance.i would be stuck with a 12,000 dollar piece of furniture.i have been playing my digital right along but want to go baby grand.no hurry .i have seen new kawaii babys for $18000.really i could put half down and finance for 5 years .but i would like to have someting acoustic by early next spring.so time will tell i guess.oh i was thinking of getting a piano tech. to look at the piano.but i hate wasting peoples time so maybe if i called him up and got an opinion first?like i said if i was confident the piano would hold up i will do it.very risky situation.but i do love the fact it is so old and 9 foot long.maybe this week i will call a tech.thanks everyone for your opinions and comments.

[keys60]

1880-1890 is certainly old. Through the evolution of the piano's design, albeit not a lot since pianos pretty much have an "if it aint broke, don't fix it" approach, you may be happier with something more modern. Chickering was at the top of the game in that era. Its a 9 footer. Some new strings and a totally restored action, and you'll have quite an axe there. Not much out there for even 20K will compare. A Steinway O could be had but not with a recent restoration. You would be up near 30K and beyond.  I can see your teachers concern. Many folks just don't think an older design nor the  $$$ invested is worth it. I'd be more inclined to seek the advice of a highly qualified tech myself, however, I'm not the one playing this instrument. The ultimate decision is yours of course.
I don't mean to diss your teacher, but as a technician (still relatively novice, but know many more advanced than myself) I find even the highly capable musician doesn't know as much about instruments as they think they do.

[pbryld]

Get a tech to look it over.

You have the chance to get a 9-footer of a good brand, but is considering tiny Kawaiis? nonono.

[deejeff442]

so kawaii is no good? i was looking around for newer pianos in the mean time.i would like to get at least a 5 foot baby.yamaha and kawaii i see the most.

[john90]

Think Chrysler Neon, Nissan Micra, Vintage Bentley. What is the resale value of the first two going to be in 5 years compared to the 3rd? You could buy the big one, tune it, if it doesn't hold tune, sell it for almost what you paid. Key is not to spend on the big one until you are sure. Get a SH runabout upright for now. All your teacher wants is something small and reliable 100%  from day one for you. Who knows, you may give up piano in 6 months like most starting out.

[pbryld]

so kawaii is no good? i was looking around for newer pianos in the mean time.i would like to get at least a 5 foot baby.yamaha and kawaii i see the most.

I like larger Kawaiis, however, even Steinway baby grands do not have a really good sound, let a alone a Kawaii.

In any case, I'd buy used.

[keys60]

Kawai, Yamaha, Steinway....even the small ones are manufactured with quality, but they are small and lack quality sound. The short strings just don't resonate much under 5'8". Some folks can't stand anything under 6 feet, but the reality for most of us is that space is an issue. If you have room for a 9 footer, whether you get it or not, I'd do some serious shopping around and forget about a 5 footer. You can find some decent deals out there on larger pianos for around the same or a little more than a shorty.

[deejeff442]

thanks for  the input everyone.i have just started building a house and the piano room is going to be 10 foot by 14 foot so it can fit about anything.i will look around for a closer to 6 footer.