Open Piano Competition, London, 2012

[m1469]

Absolutely. That's what I find sad here. Clearly a large part of the driving force behind this is to help amateurs get the opportunity to do so. But unless they think things through properly, there are going to be a hell of a lot of extra-musical issues getting in the way.

hheeeyyyy man, I'm in the competition/school of life, mannn ... and when I look in the mirror, I see a winner, mannnnn.   

[pianowolfi]

*insert wise, granny accent*

Well, I'll tell ya, sonny, the only thing that has ever made sense to me about being a musician is making music, by gum!  

*and a granny wink and a satisfied rocking in chair, while humming quietly and looking out the window to far off lands* 

Completely off topic, but I *like* this

[asiantraveller101]

I tend to agree with Nyiregyhazi in this case, and I totally get his arguments. Just by perusing through the website, I am totally confused as to the way this competition is going to be judged. The concept of one competition suits all sounds like a great idea, thus will attract a lot of amateurs. But the actual logistic of how it is going to be judged sounds like it is heading for a lot of misunderstanding and loop holes. I personally think the repertoire list is a joke: put together haphazardly and without much thought. I would shy away from competitions where the judging system is in question. I do realize that this competition is in its embryonic stage, but the mere fact that the website is not well-organized, late postings of repertoire, undefined judging criterias, unknown organizer or patron, makes me doubt that much organization and careful planning have been taken in preparing for such a humongous task of having a international competition.

[m1469]

Completely off topic, but I *like* this

Is it funny that within a thread about music competitions, it is completely off topic that you like when I say, the only thing making sense to me about being a musician is making music?

[m1469]

I tend to agree with Nyiregyhazi in this case, and I totally get his arguments. Just by perusing through the website, I am totally confused as to the way this competition is going to be judged. The concept of one competition suits all sounds like a great idea, thus will attract a lot of amateurs. But the actual logistic of how it is going to be judged sounds like it is heading for a lot of misunderstanding and loop holes. I personally think the repertoire list is a joke: put together haphazardly and without much thought. I would shy away from competitions where the judging system is in question. I do realize that this competition is in its embryonic stage, but the mere fact that the website is not well-organized, late postings of repertoire, undefined judging criterias, unknown organizer or patron, makes me doubt that much organization and careful planning have been taken in preparing for such a humongous task of having a international competition.

I actually don't fully get it.  Sorry about it  .  Maybe I'm just not investing enough concerted energy into trying to understand it all.  All I want is to make music  .  Lots, and lots of music   ... all day ... all night ... all week ... all year ... all my life. 

[nyiregyhazi]

I actually don't fully get it.  Sorry about it  .  Maybe I'm just not investing enough concerted energy into trying to understand it all.  All I want is to make music  .  Lots, and lots of music   ... all day ... all night ... all week ... all year ... all my life.  

Except when you're too busy posting about how you don't get something? Funnily enough, I think music matters a fair bit to some of the rest of us too, even if we don't engage in such advanced hyperbole...

[m1469]

Except when you're posting about how you don't get something? Funnily enough, I think music matters to some of the rest of us too...

Never said it didn't matter to you!  And, yes, I do deserve to sit down for a moment after a really long day of work, for the moments I ate, might take a little breath, and then plan classes for tomorrow until I go to sleep.  And anyway, who said I'm not making music when I post?

And, I'm sorry, but I don't really get it.  That's that, so far.  I seemed to understand what Marco responded with and then for a moment I understood what you responded with ... but, what does it really matter whether or not I understand all the details anyway?  I don't know that it really does!

[nyiregyhazi]

Never said it didn't matter to you!  And, yes, I do deserve to sit down for a moment after a really long day of work, for the moments I ate, might take a little breath, and then plan classes for tomorrow until I go to sleep.  And anyway, who said I'm not making music when I post?

And, I'm sorry, but I don't really get it.  That's that, so far.  I seemed to understand what Marco responded with and then for a moment I understood what you responded with ... but, what does it really matter whether or not I understand all the details anyway?  I don't know that it really does!

You don't get that we don't get how the hell this competition could possibly work? Wanting to make music doesn't stop me seeing just how many holes are involved. One more thing I noticed is that the 1st round is assigned 5 days. Well, 60 ten minute entries takes 10 hours before breaks. The final is down to last 6 hours before breaks. Seeing as the final is more than half the length, why are they listing 5 days for round 1 and only 1 for the final?

Additionally the first round narrows 60 to 18. Whereas the next narrows 18 to 12- eliminating just 2 out of 6 competitors per category? Why even bother having round two, if that's all the trimming that's going to take place? A huge decision rests on the 7-10 minutes of round one (after the equally huge and indeed competition-defining decision of assigning categories is done on a mere three minute recording!) but then when they finally get to hear the performers play for 20 minutes, the only purpose is to eliminate two competitors? Whether by intention or not, the result of such a silly system makes it close to the reality TV concept of making the minority who don't go through come out as "losers" where the rest are merely survivors- rather than a select group of "winners" who shone through. To eliminate any less than half is just plain stupid. No other way I can put that, I'm afraid.

Scarcely a single element of this seems to have actually been thought out. And the above refers to the most basic competition fundamentals- without even going into the problems with the category system. It's like somebody spent about 5 minutes looking at the most superficial features of how competitions are typically done- but completely missed the logic that runs behind it and actually makes them work. I ought to be charging a consultation fee for this- and they ought to have already paid one to someone of experience before even contemplating going public with a shambolic sketch for a supposedly professional event.

[pianowolfi]

Is it funny that within a thread about music competitions, it is completely off topic that you like when I say, the only thing making sense to me about being a musician is making music?

Yeah actually you're right

[phillip21]

I have found it interesting to read about this competition.  I guess its gravitas will only become clear when the names of the jury are announced - if I were the organizer I would get a big name signed up and announced on the website soon!  The £125 fee may seem high at first sight, but it will discourage 'casual' applicants, and the £3,000 first prize should attract some good players (but beware the stated possibility of prize reduction if there are not enough entrants).  I'm sure there is a good reason for it, but I think it a shame that, per the application instructions, 'Applicant must not have won or been a finalist in a previous professional piano competition'.  Given the number of finalists in most competitions that would exclude a lot of people who could give performances worthy of £3k.

[nyiregyhazi]

I have found it interesting to read about this competition.  I guess its gravitas will only become clear when the names of the jury are announced - if I were the organizer I would get a big name signed up and announced on the website soon!  The £125 fee may seem high at first sight, but it will discourage 'casual' applicants, and the £3,000 first prize should attract some good players (but beware the stated possibility of prize reduction if there are not enough entrants).  I'm sure there is a good reason for it, but I think it a shame that, per the application instructions, 'Applicant must not have won or been a finalist in a previous professional piano competition'.  Given the number of finalists in most competitions that would exclude a lot of people who could give performances worthy of £3k.

Yet another good point! How ironic that competition finalists are specifically banned from the elite category, whereas there's not a single clause to do something as obvious as banning serious students from competing against the amateurs in the lower category! Why on earth would they want to take steps to reduce the standard of the elite prize, given that there are three categories anyway? Just about every aspect of this is completely inexplicable.

Consider also how many applicants it would require to fund those prizes alone- without paying for adjudicators or venues. Even with one lone adjudicator, we'd talking serious money for a 6 hour final! Judging from the overall levels of organisation and planning, I think we can safely say that each of those prizes basically reflects a randomly selected number that has no bearing on any probable reality. I don't believe for a second that they've actually weighed up the costs or the likely funds available.

[phillip21]

This competition has stimulated a lot of discussion.  I note from the following webpage https://www.rhinegold.co.uk/recruitment/default.asp?cat=6&id=528 that a voluntary artistic director is being recruited.  That would be an interesting job, and the incumbent could no doubt take note of some of the points made in this forum.

[phillip21]

Update - this interesting competition seems to be alive, and was advertised in the latest issue of Classical Music magazine.  There is some news on the competition on https://www.openpianocompetition.com/news

[m1469]

Cool, thanks for the update!

[nyiregyhazi]

Update - this interesting competition seems to be alive, and was advertised in the latest issue of Classical Music magazine.  There is some news on the competition on https://www.openpianocompetition.com/news

Glad to see that they've taken significant steps to sort out the mess it had started as.