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Feux Follets (Read 6959 times)

Offline Chris

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Feux Follets
« on: January 07, 2002, 06:51:52 PM »
One of my biggest technical problems are scales in double notes,that means particularly thirds and sixts. So I can play for example the whole "Feux Follets" Study of Liszt in Concert tempo except the second and third pages. Is there anybody,who knows how I could master this problem for reaching the goal?

Offline robert_henry

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #1 on: January 08, 2002, 06:02:16 AM »
uh...practice scales in thirds and sixths?   ;)

Offline Chris

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #2 on: January 08, 2002, 09:15:38 PM »
Hallo Robert,
I think we have misanderstood us in some way. Of course I know that I could practice thirds and sixths, but I won't believe that it would help something in this special case. The thirds and sixths in "Feux follets " are composed in a particular awkward manner,so  that it needs a special solution.

Offline ted

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #3 on: April 05, 2002, 11:12:00 AM »
I found a few things helped.

1. Play the lot staccato - lightly and relaxed of course.

2. Play them in legato pairs. i.e. join double notes 1 and 2, 3 and 4 etc lifting the hand slightly between 2 and 3, between 4 and 5 etc.

3. Sometimes use bent fingers and sometimes fairly flat ones - vary it from time to time ,but this depends on your hand of course.

"When I was young they said, 'Ah, wait until you are old, then you'll see.' Well, now I am old, and I have seen nothing." - Erik Satie

Offline MikeThePianist

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #4 on: August 02, 2002, 04:44:46 AM »
Some of Ted's suggestions seem to have merit.  However, I would not try bending your hands out of shape.  For me, that would just cause unnecessary tension (besides, why would you play like that in performance anyway - just a though).  I do agree with someone who said practice scales in sixths and thirds.  I don't know the piece, but you say that they are composed differently than in typical scale.  My advice:

1.  Practice them like normal anyway.  At least you'll be trying.

2.  Create some type of scale exercise that is similar to that passage.  Try it in different keys.  Experiment with being your own Czerny or Hanon.
Michael Fauver is pursuing his bachelors degree in piano performance at the University of Michigan-Ann Arbor.

Offline Diabolos

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #5 on: August 02, 2002, 07:15:12 PM »
As much as I do agree with the other posts, it is a fact that common methods do not work with this piece, since the passages you got problems with are no scales but rather some harmonically changing, but technically constant motifs.

I'd suggest working strongly with different hand positions here. It is impossible connect the different beats by a legato, so you should practice every single group that makes one beat alone, then learn how to move your hand to the next appropriate position; it's obvious that you have to find a comfortable fingering for every motif (or group of 4 1/32 notes).
I know that this might sound a little odd, but it is a easier way than trying to learn the complete legato. Once you got these single groups and the necessary quick hand movement to the next position, you may bind them using the pedal, which won't be a problem since you do the pedaling in accordance to the left hand.

I don't know if it helps you, but give it a try. I learned this passages that way and struggled a little at first, but once you figured them out it starts looking like a piece of cake. 8)

Offline ted

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #6 on: August 06, 2002, 12:55:59 AM »

Diabolos:

Yes, that's the trick all right - split it into fragments. Once you can play all the notes you can concentrate on trying to get the light, fluffy effect. I think many pianists play this one too heavily with too much pedal; I like Cziffra's version best of the ones I've heard.
"When I was young they said, 'Ah, wait until you are old, then you'll see.' Well, now I am old, and I have seen nothing." - Erik Satie

Offline patrickj

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #7 on: November 24, 2002, 10:47:06 AM »
A good Feux Follets starter is to play the upper r.h. voice legato, and the lower staccato. Practice forte with no pedal. When this feels comfortable continue in piano to mezzoforte
rhythmizicing the groupings. Finally, start playing the indicated musical phrasings, first slowly then faster and faster. Add an "economical" pedal. Donīt forget that the "main engine" is the l.h. bass line... Still, good playing is characterized by itīs musical values. These general advises have worked splendidly for my students.

Offline vodovoz

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Re: Feux Follets
«Reply #8 on: December 12, 2002, 06:00:55 PM »
One of the best things I can recommend is actually cheating and playing something that resembles the sound one is supposed to create but in a different way than the one chosen by composer. With scales in thirds etc.... deviding them between hands can be very helpful also.