Prokofiev's Suggestion diabolique: HELP!!!!

[costicina]

I’m madly in love with this piece: I’d sell my soul to the devil   to be able to play it, no matter how long it’ill take, the amount of patience and determination it’ll require….
At first what scared me were the  nineths (having small hands, I can’t reach most of them),  but perhaps rolling them very quickly (playing the bass note as a kind of grace note) this problem could be somehow overcame.  The real HELL (  ) for me is  the first  section (after the introduction) with the fast repeted chords. I’m experimenting every approach I can think of:  rebouncing  them as relaxed as possible, using  one impulse for every 4 chords (I don’t know if you understand what I mean…),  trying different fingerings. But nothing seems to work:  as I try to speed up,  it’s a  mess: wrong notes, ghost notes, etc. … I’m desperate!!!  

If any of you experts, teachers, students can give me  some tips, advices, suggestions (diabolique or not), I’ll be insanely happy.

P.S. So far the most demandig pieces I’ve managed to learn are: Beethoven Tempest (III mv), Schumann Intermezzo op 26, Chopin op 10 n 12 and 25 n 1, Rachmaninov Prelude op 32 n 12, Etude op 33 n 8/7 (I posted the latter ones in the audition room, if it can give you an idea of   my level).
Many thanks in advance
Margherita

[49410enrique]

op 4 no 4 is a beast of piece to initially. learn, as pase as it might sound, slow practice on this makes fast progress.  my approach on something like this (and this assumes it doesn't go against any instruction from a piano teacher if you have one) is to play it as musically and focused as you can a very slow tempos. use a metronome if you have to to keep you from rushing beats (you'll want to start slower than you can actually play it), incrementally increase the tempo say 1 click per minute on the quarter, etc. if that doesn't work go a click per min on the eight, etc. you should be able to slowly get it up to speed.  also prokofiev is a bugger to memorize this repitition should help.  get it memorized asap it will help with learning/polish later.

so example, set your metrnome at 40 bpm, play the section, go to 42 bpm (or 41 if you model lets you), perfect? good, go to 44 bpm, etc. 

i'd say be able to play the section without errors 8-10 times before moving up a notch in the tempo. also, if you are playing 8 times, lets say you play it 6 times without mistake then mess up ? guess what, start over at one again until you get 8 in a row without error.

that's how i'd tackle this at first.

[costicina]

Thank you so much for your kind advice!!!
I'm convinced, too, that in this case practicing very slow is the only way to see the light!!!

I'll try to divide this section in tiny fragments (very few bars, even only one if necessary), trying to master them at a slow tempo, and then increasing gradually the speed.
Being a bad sight-reader  , I'm almos forced to memorize my pieces. When they are fast and technically s demanding like this, I couldn't do otherwise.
Thank again, I'll perseverate using this approacch: I don't want to give up!!!

[moose61]

First off, calm down, relax- break the piece down into small sections- then play hands apart. Try playing the right hand while "ghosting" the left and vica versa.  Many technical issues  get solved by being able to play each hand separately- do this slowly, until you can play hands apart from memory.

[jollisg]

I'm learning that piece too. My best tip is to practice slow and aim for no wrong notes. If any section seems impossible, think about having economical movements and being close to the keys.