Opus Clavicembalisticum

[luda888]

Yay! 2nd page!

[cziffra]

I think clavicembalisticum is the stupidest pointless piece of crap ever recorded

I can't help but respond to this...

does this mean to say you have a scale of pointless of pieces of crap?  A scale that ranges from stupid to intelligent?

Tell me, what's the most intelligent pointless piece of crap you know?

[pk]

Do you always analyse everything said or written ? I just think this is a very stupid piece of work, why spend all this time studying and recording such meaningless work, yes I have heard it, no I dont own the records.
By the way you seem to be a very stupid pointless piece of person.
Why do you pollute such a great pianists name like cziffras with your stupid statements.
author=cziffra link=board=repo;num=1094764108;start=50#53 date=10/09/04 at 17:47:46]

I can't help but respond to this...

does this mean to say you have a scale of pointless of pieces of crap?  A scale that ranges from stupid to intelligent?

Tell me, what's the most intelligent pointless piece of crap you know?
[/quote]

[DarkWind]

Just because you don't understand it you can't just call it crap. I'm tired of so many people doing that. "HAY GUYS THIS PIECE SUX RIGHT LOL AM I COOL NOW" This seems to be the general idea with Sorabji. But see, just because his music is different doesn't automatically mean it's crap. Some say Schoenberg is terrible, but he really isn't at least when you can finally build an appreciation to like his music. His music isn't as harsh to the ears as some might, compared to, say, Xenakis. Sorabji makes very cataclysmic effects by way of heavy percussive-like sounds on the piano. Think of a mix of Schoenberg and Bartok on steroids, with some light sprinkle of Xenakis thrown into the mix, and you get Sorabji. Most of you probably have never even heard any of his works besides some small insignificant piece. I will admit, his music is very hard to like, but I grew a close affinity to it right away. It's seems almost like the musical equivalent of terror, with the harshness and brutality of the dissonances found throughout. But at least, Sorabji has rythm, he has some idea of what is going on, unlike, say, Boulez. Just because you don't like music can you call it immediately worthless and craptastic. You may never like it, but you shouldn't call it crap.

[Spatula]

Mahler's music was misunderstood for so long, but I love the Symphony Number 2.

I don't recall saying that Soraji's music was crap, I just said it was "out there" for people with exotic tastes.

How about this analogy:

Beethoven is pizza
Sorabji is escagot

It's all a matter of personal taste and I think all composers have their own style.  Why follow the trends?
Thank god for revolutionarists, or else we'd still be back in the dark ages chanting neo-music is BAD~!

[Spatula]

Just because you don't understand it you can't just call it crap. I'm tired of so many people doing that. .

EXACTLY! Thanks dark man! I felt the same way of Prokie's music until I found a new perspective to look at it.  

You have to get out of the "Mozart Museum" or "Beethoven Box" and explore.  

How about looking at it this way, I'll probably say this like my last post, but Prokie and Schoenberg I still can't fully comprehend this music.  I didn't really like the Rach 3 at first either, but it just starts to grow on you if you desire to keep listening to it.  Each time you'll know what to expect and you should make your judgements then.

It's perfectly okay to say that one composer's music is not YOUR personal favourite, that's okay because not everything in the world I like.  But we should refrain from saying this "suxxors" or that "LICKS monkey bum".

Even I'm sometimes guilty of doing that...but it's just a matter of respect.

[pk]

Yeah sorry ´bout that I´ll never call any music crap again.
Who are anyone to do that really.
As a matter of fact Schoenberg is one of my favourite composers.

Just because you don't understand it you can't just call it crap. I'm tired of so many people doing that. "HAY GUYS THIS PIECE SUX RIGHT LOL AM I COOL NOW" This seems to be the general idea with Sorabji. But see, just because his music is different doesn't automatically mean it's crap. Some say Schoenberg is terrible, but he really isn't at least when you can finally build an appreciation to like his music. His music isn't as harsh to the ears as some might, compared to, say, Xenakis. Sorabji makes very cataclysmic effects by way of heavy percussive-like sounds on the piano. Think of a mix of Schoenberg and Bartok on steroids, with some light sprinkle of Xenakis thrown into the mix, and you get Sorabji. Most of you probably have never even heard any of his works besides some small insignificant piece. I will admit, his music is very hard to like, but I grew a close affinity to it right away. It's seems almost like the musical equivalent of terror, with the harshness and brutality of the dissonances found throughout. But at least, Sorabji has rythm, he has some idea of what is going on, unlike, say, Boulez. Just because you don't like music can you call it immediately worthless and craptastic. You may never like it, but you shouldn't call it crap.

[DarkWind]

Yay! Good to hear it from you all. Also, if anything, Schoenberg sounds much better on a recording than on midi.

[luda888]

GIVE ME A RECORDING AND SHEETMUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[thierry13]

If you want a recording and sheet music so badly, why don't you buy them? Go at a local sheet music store, and at a disc shop, and buy them! Or just buy them over the internet. And it's not by saying us we're dumbasses and yelling at us that you will get sheet music. You're absolutely stupid. Especially for thinking you will be playing it. Begin by playing all etudes of chopin and liszt, then rachmaninoff 4 concertos, and after that, practice 24/24 and MAYBE will you in 20 years be able to play it.

[pseudopianist]

GIVE ME A RECORDING AND SHEETMUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have the sheet music on my comp that I download from the link while it still worked but it is over 80 MB so no way I'm hosting it.

Stop being an ass, it really won't help you. If you would have been nice I could figure out a way to give it to you but blah on you.

[.COM]

GIVE ME A RECORDING AND SHEETMUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You really want the sheet music?

Here knock yourself out.

https://us.share.geocities.com/cokoro88/SAVE0000.BMP

[Daevren]

I also have both.

But I am not going to give it to you, hahahaha!

[luda888]

You really want the sheet music?

Here knock yourself out.

https://us.share.geocities.com/cokoro88/SAVE0000.BMP

It does'nt work.

[luda888]

I also have both.

But I am not going to give it to you, hahahaha!

GIVE ME IT!!!!!!!!!!!

[Spatula]

oh my god luda its not like you're going to learn it anytime soon.  

By the way there's a plethora (yes I'm using my words properly) of other music out there for you to build up on it.

One sign of immaturity is tackling on tasks or given responsibility too great for that individual.

Another sign of immaturity is trying to be too mature

And another sign of immaturity is pretending to be a kitchen utensil (ahem cough cough) (Spatula never said he was mature!)

[Spatula]

If you want a recording and sheet music so badly, why don't you buy them? Go at a local sheet music store, and at a disc shop, and buy them! Or just buy them over the internet. And it's not by saying us we're dumbasses and yelling at us that you will get sheet music. You're absolutely stupid. Especially for thinking you will be playing it. Begin by playing all etudes of chopin and liszt, then rachmaninoff 4 concertos, and after that, practice 24/24 and MAYBE will you in 20 years be able to play it.

No kidding, spend a little money, that's what its for.  And if your local music store doesn't have it, then go on the thing called the internet...I think you must be using it if you're able to type "GIVE ME IT" all over the bloody thread.  

And if you're too scared to order over the internet then you probably don't want that piece badly anyways...just cheaping out on your available resources.  

[luda888]

No kidding, spend a little money, that's what its for.  And if your local music store doesn't have it, then go on the thing called the internet...I think you must be using it if you're able to type "GIVE ME IT" all over the bloody thread.  

And if you're too scared to order over the internet then you probably don't want that piece badly anyways...just cheaping out on your available resources.  

Spend a little money? maybe like 100USD all together!!!

[Antnee]

Luda, don't you see what's going on here?... It's obvious you don't have full confidence in yourself in playing the piece, or else you would just buy it. You want to try it for free,  just in case it really is hard and you give up or become uninterested in it. Really. I recall seeing the score once and saw nothing to scream about in it. There's just alot of black. Sight reading it is near impossible and what you would get out of it won't make sense because the thing is so damn long and complicated. Just let it go man...

[cziffra]

Do you always analyse everything said or written ? I just think this is a very stupid piece of work, why spend all this time studying and recording such meaningless work, yes I have heard it, no I dont own the records.
By the way you seem to be a very stupid pointless piece of person.
Why do you pollute such a great pianists name like cziffras with your stupid statements.

Okay...you obviously missed the part where i was joking?  I wasn't making a comment on Sorabji, i was making a joke on the ambiguity of your sentence.  There was no harm intended at all.

I will try not to a be a pointless piece of person in the future.

[Spatula]

Luda, don't you see what's going on here?... It's obvious you don't have full confidence in yourself in playing the piece, or else you would just buy it. You want to try it for free,  just in case it really is hard and you give up or become uninterested in it. Really. I recall seeing the score once and saw nothing to scream about in it. There's just alot of black. Sight reading it is near impossible and what you would get out of it won't make sense because the thing is so d**n long and complicated. Just let it go man...

Why don't you get the recording first luda....try Ebay or your library or something.  Then you'll see it's better to judge a piece by how it sounds rather than how it looks.

Just because it has a ton of black notes enough to fill my entire soup bowl and some, it'd doesn't necessarily mean it's for easy listening or interpretation etc...

I don't know how much you know about Sorabji, but his pieces are umm...

"out there"

[luda888]

Luda, don't you see what's going on here?... It's obvious you don't have full confidence in yourself in playing the piece, or else you would just buy it. You want to try it for free,  just in case it really is hard and you give up or become uninterested in it. Really. I recall seeing the score once and saw nothing to scream about in it. There's just alot of black. Sight reading it is near impossible and what you would get out of it won't make sense because the thing is so d**n long and complicated. Just let it go man...

Why don't you get the recording first luda....try Ebay or your library or something.  Then you'll see it's better to judge a piece by how it sounds rather than how it looks.

Just because it has a ton of black notes enough to fill my entire soup bowl and some, it'd doesn't necessarily mean it's for easy listening or interpretation etc...

I don't know how much you know about Sorabji, but his pieces are umm...

"out there"

I AM TRYING TO GET A RECORDING!! I TRIED THE LIBRARIES ALREADY!!!

[Daevren]

Spending 100 dollars on something that will keep you busy for at least 20 to 30 years doesn't sound that bad.

[luda888]

Spending 100 dollars on something that will keep you busy for at least 20 to 30 years doesn't sound that bad.

More like 1 to 2 years.

[DarkWind]

Spending 100 dollars on something that will keep you busy for at least 20 to 30 years doesn't sound that bad.

More like 1 to 2 years.

Please, go jump off a cliff. Now.

[pseudopianist]

GIVE ME A RECORDING AND SHEETMUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You really want the sheet music?

Here knock yourself out.

https://us.share.geocities.com/cokoro88/SAVE0000.BMP

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Spatula]

right...okay you ppl (luda) go and have fun trying to even get the 1 page done right, and then come back and say what you think...

[Ludwig Van Rachabji]

Luda,

Learn this measure...

[Spatula]

that's exactly my point.

And that's probably one of the easier bars.

[Ludwig Van Rachabji]

Hehe, no kidding. 

[DarkWind]

Actually, that's from his Sonata. Although, most of his music looks like that, none the less.

[luda888]

fine then, does ANYONE have ANY of his full works and recordings i could have?

[pseudopianist]

How about... NO

[Ludwig Van Rachabji]

Luda,

Can't you take NO for an answer. Nobody is going to give it to you. If you remember, Luda, I was "Sorabji" in the other piano forum, and, if I remember correctly, you were not this annoying. I think I was actually the one who directed you to this forum. For that, I apologize to the people here.

Just BUY it. I assume you aren't poor and you have $100 somewhere around. Why don't you just bite the bullet and buy it?

Being annoying isn't going to get you anywhere. You are probably never going to learn it, and if you just want to study it, then I'm sure you can afford to pay for it.

- Ludwig Van Rachabji

[steinwaymodeld]

judging from what I have heard.

I actually like Sorabji's misc work and sonata more than the Opus Clavi.

[Ludwig Van Rachabji]

Hmm... I wonder if Luda left...

[comme_le_vent]

i concur with jeff, i have the score and madge's rec of the opclav

and im like what

but i do love some of his shorter works

luda - check out dre's composer-pianists cd - my fave work of his in on there - played immaculately

[Spatula]

People like Luda have got to realize that theres more food out there than just giant slice pizza, figuratively speaking.

Just because its huge doesn't mean its the only thing we should get obsessed to hunt down.  We'll be missing the whole world if everyone was like that.

[comme_le_vent]

luda is cool

he just wants some extremely long things with extreme hardness

[Spatula]

Okay then, I'm not stopping them.

[luda888]

Hmm... I wonder if Luda left...

Luda,

Learn this measure...

no, i didnt leave, i was practicing the sonata u gave me. im good so far.

[thracozaag]

Hmm... I wonder if Luda left...

Luda,

Learn this measure...

no, i didnt leave, i was practicing the sonata u gave me. im good so far.

  *chuckle*

koji (STSD)

[Ludwig Van Rachabji]

Hehe, OK, it is obvious that Luda is simply trying to be annoying and funny, in his twisted little way.

Luda, you will NOT learn the OC! It simply will NOT happen. I know you are just pulling our legs, but if you possibly think you will learn this...... then I have a nice big white jacket that you can borrow.

But seriously folks, if you can actually learn this, then why haven't I heard of you? You must be famous. You must be on tour across the world, playing Rach 3. Oh wait! On the other forum, you said you had never even HEARD Rach 3. It is obvious that you don't really know much of anything. Might I go back to what you said? (Note: I was "Sorabji" on the forum):






Luda:

where can I get the Opus clavicembalisticum ? can someone give me a link? I really want to listen to it!!!
 
or Rachmaninov Piano Concerto No.2
 
 
or the many hard pieces in the world








Sorabji (me):
 
 
Hehe, well you can try PAYING for it!

 




 
Luda:
 
where? no one has a download to the whole song?

 




Sorabji:
   
Hmm... there used to be a recording of it available at Amazon. I was just looking, and apparently the link was removed. I don`t know what to tell you. You could try going to Barnes and Noble, and asking them to do a search for it. How odd...

But it sounds like all other 20th century music. Dissonant, wierd, atonal...

When you`re talking about the Rach 2, I assume you mean Rach 3, which is many times harder. I bought the music, and I have my work cut out for me, since I am planning to learn it. The Rach 3 is my favorite piece in the world...

I don`t know what to tell you about the OC though. Sorry.






Luda:

 
oh yeah, rach 3

   
anyone have a download or a link?

 
 i already tried amazon

 





Sorabji:
 
Do you mean the Rach 3, or the OC? I don`t think the OC is in public domain, so you need to buy it in order to get the music/CD. However, for the Rach 3, you can get the sheet music at www.sheetmusicarchive.net, and a free recording at www.classicalmusicarchives.com.






Luda:


no one has the OC?

 
 
----------------------------------------------------------

Now, I apologize to EVERYONE in this forum. If you are easily upset and will flame me, PLEASE, do NOT read on. Thankyou...

----------------------------------------------------------
































































 

























Still here? OK, here is what I said next.








Sorabji:

 
Go to www.pianoforum.net. Ask here, because there were several people willing to email it if you want it.

 

(I am SO sorry!)



 

 
Luda:
 

really? the OC?

 




Sorabji:
 
 
Yup.




 
 
Luda:

 
well, i just made an account on pianoforum.net. im waiting now

 



 
Sorabji:
 
 
OK, hope you find it.

 
------------------------------------------------------------

Then, he said something I don't understand...

-------------------------------------------------------------




Luda:
 

i got the oc on sheetmusic!!!!

 
now i could play it

 
-------------------------------------------------------------


What the hell?



Anyway, I apologize once again to all the good people here. I didn't know that this is what it would become...
 


 
 
 

 
 
 

[steinwaymodeld]

Don't want to start a flame-war

But I had a very high expection on the OC before, after spending hours to find it, and finally get to hear it... Spent me these many hours to listen.

Except the first 20 mins I was surised that someone can play these many notes and in a such a random rhythm at the same time, i don't feel much.

After this feeling wear off, I have to keep myself concentrated on score so I won't be lost, and I am starting to feel numb of these completely black sheet of music. It's just not fun or interesting or anything anymore. It's just plain annoying.

In my opinion, I don't think it's a good piece. Because for these many notes and these many hours of concentration on this music, I feel it has awfully little thing or musical ideas to offer me, it's pretty blatant, and not very creative (except all these condensed bunch of notes.) It feels like Sorabji just randomly splashed those notes onto the sheet and ask other people to play it. I am quite curious what was the response and how many right notes the composer hitted when he gave the first debut recital of this piece. And quite frankly, I don't think he cared about how many right notes he hitted, because it's impossible and pointless to hit the 'right' notes, as they were never intended to be play 'correctly'. It was just intended to increase the reputation of the composer because he has composed the most impossible piece of piano work in the human history. Bravo Sorabji! (He said similar things in his letter to his friend)

I would rather listen to his other stuff like Rhapsody Espanganol or Bach chromatic fantasy transcription or his sonata or anything by the composer. I have heard much better Sorabji than this huge pointless piece of work. Wasted my time and concentration. I have already deleted the recording.

[Daevren]

I don't know if OC is random. But I wonder if that is actually the case.  I don't have the time and barely have the skill to analyse the whole score. And I am not really that interested. It sounds like a waste of time. But I wouldn't be suprised if the music is actually very well structured and organised.

[Rob47]

I've never heard opus clavicebistumboombap or whatever it is called, I've heard of it and there is this whole thread dedicated to it,  BUt has anyone ever played the entire Liszt transcription of Beethoven 9 in one sitting at speed? Not necessarily anyone here, just anyone in general? I was looking at the score today and it would require immense stamina also I think.  LIkely nowhere near as much as Opus C but still I've never heard a recording of this transcrition. Anyone know of any?

your friend
Rob

[thracozaag]

I've never heard opus clavicebistumboombap or whatever it is called, I've heard of it and there is this whole thread dedicated to it,  BUt has anyone ever played the entire Liszt transcription of Beethoven 9 in one sitting at speed? Not necessarily anyone here, just anyone in general? I was looking at the score today and it would require immense stamina also I think.  LIkely nowhere near as much as Opus C but still I've never heard a recording of this transcrition. Anyone know of any?

your friend
Rob

  Cyprien's recorded all of them.

koji (STSD)

[Rob47]

  Cyprien's recorded all of them.

koji (STSD)

Cool, I'll search for them at the library tommorow.  Any other notable performances of, say, just the 9th transcription? (Being that it is the greatest symphony I have ever witnessed)

your friend
Rob

[thracozaag]

  Cyprien's recorded all of them.

koji (STSD)

Cool, I'll search for them at the library tommorow.  Any other notable performances of, say, just the 9th transcription? (Being that it is the greatest symphony I have ever witnessed)

your friend
Rob

  I'm afraid my meagre knowledge has reached its limit, anyone?

koji (STSD)

[Daevren]

I am not sure I Gould recorded all of them but he did record a few.