High level buying advice

[sunnyboy]

I have been researching the topic of buying an upright piano for a while. The piano will be used by two young children to begin with and I expect to own the instrument for the next 10yrs at least and suspect that at least of the children will progress a long way down the levels of play.

We are looking at a 2-4k budget and I understand that in and around this price range the options include a Japanese used instrument like a U3/k3 or a old german like a bechstein or schimmel (probably reconditioned to some degree) or even petrof. The shops I have visited universally recommend the Japanese option, while the qualified musician friends we have, including the Japanese, say that they would never buy Japanese as these are not comparable in feel and sound to the Germans/Europeans.

The other issue is private ( supported by a technical evaluation) or trade sale. It disturbs me that a used instrument bought from trade is estimated to be trading back in at 50% of cost immediately after the sale. This suggests to me that a private sale route is much better financially and should be reasonably safe if done in the right way and within certain parameters (like used cars)

I am prepared to invest effort in sourcing the right option and was wondering if the members could suggest the best options in terms of pianos and the best way of sourcing them.

Many thanks

[johnmar78]

hi SUNNYBOY, the best way is to see the piano youself. Do you play piano well?? if you do, go and try play teh piano you want and thatwise you know if its good or not. The best approach is buy thru private if not a reputable dealer, it is more expensive, at least they give you free tunnings.

[49410enrique]

either option japan vs europe is probably fine, they both make fine instruments. are there some very very nice things you find on the germans at the highest end of the price range? sure, are they differences your little ones are likely to notice in the first years of playing? probably not.

pianos are not investments. i don't know where people started telling folks that but i wish it would stop.  we con't consider trade in value or what something will sell for if we buy a washing machine,  or a computer printer, or etc etc.  purchase what you want most among the options that will fulfill your needs for as little as possible.

i agree you can get a bargain private sale/used route and i would explore those avenues first before looking at a new instrument, that way i see it, brank spanking new should be an option for weatlhy people who don' care what something costs, that is, you have enough money to blow that you can realistic absorb the 'depreciation'/profit margin consts of new and not really worry about it (i.e. take a 20 thousand dollar cash pile and tell yourself, i'm going to burn 10 thousand dollars, does this bother me, yes? then you probably should just go used).

now for the most practical part of my reply, in general i very  much like kawai pianos, i think if you get used and buy at the top end of their line/range you'll be very happy.

just don't get the cheapest/most inexpensive instrument any mfg makes, in general it's a very bad idea to get a brands/company's entry into a particular price point.

[john90]

Assuming you can't play properly. You still need to play it. So learn in a showroom on a grand or baby grand. Size doesn't matter at this point. One hand is enough. Play it so gently that it doesn't make a sound. See how consistent it is. Try the pedal. Listen to to how clear the notes sound. Play more than one note together. Play it loud, soft. Is it pleasant to play? Try this on a new Steinway, or Schimmel. Something good quality and expensive, as it is more likely to have been set up nicely by the shop. Then try the same on cheaper pianos in the store. You will feel the quality drop off as you go to cheaper and cheaper pianos. At this point, if you want to buy a new Steinway, Grotian Steinweg or Schimmel and have the cash, go for it. Otherwise leave the shop. Don't buy anything else, just keep the memory of the feel and sound in your mind.

When I go up to a piano, I can play 4 or 5 notes, and immediately categorize the piano as a no (easy), or very possibly a yes. It helps not to look at the make. That is it. It just has to feel right and sound right. And the first 5 to 10 notes you play will answer it 80% of the time.

When it feels like a top make, and costs little privately. get your tuner in. If you do it right you are going to need to see circa 20 pianos before you call the tuner on average.

It takes some serious abuse/many years to make a superb piano feel and sound bad. If it feels or sounds bad you are not interested. You might end up with a Petrof, Yamaha, Something German. At all costs avoid the dealer who sells you Quality brand X, a "good" brand, and says he will fix the sloppy action, adjust/tune when it is delivered. it will never happen, and you have a useless 500kg lump in your lounge, and no money for a lawyer. The free tune you expect from a dealer is to put right the effect of transport, not rebuild the piano in your lounge.