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Topic: Slightly altering a piece?  (Read 1383 times)

Offline andrewd084

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Slightly altering a piece?
on: April 17, 2012, 09:51:13 PM
First, I'd like to apologize for the way this post is written. I'm sure there are more concise terms for most of what I will describe here, but I'm coming back to music after a six year hiatus. I used to be wiz with musical notation and terminology, but I've forgotten most of it.

I am in the middle of learning Josef Weiss's arrangement of Bach's Passacaglia in C minor ( https://conquest.imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/f/f2/IMSLP29820-PMLP04326-Bach_J.S._-_Passacaglia_c_BWV_582__2H_Weiss_.pdf ), but I'm running into some trouble that I don't think any amount of practice will really fix.

My hands are a little too small to play a few bits of the piece as written. Specifically, the fourteenth measure on the second page ends with a couple chords a few steps wider than an octave. I can handle these in some forms, like C to Eb, but in others my hands are stretched flat enough that I have to depress the keys from the edge rather than the top of the key. I can still play these parts, but the technique I have to use wreaks havoc on the dynamics and hits a couple wrong notes 90% of the time.

Having never studied formally, I am not aware of a "correct" answer to this problem. I almost want to just play a few different notes, but that feels like cheating. Does anyone have any advice on this?

Offline j_menz

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Re: Slightly altering a piece?
Reply #1 on: April 17, 2012, 11:56:02 PM
It looks like a pretty ordinary arrangement, and not very pianistic. I'd get the original and, using that as a reference, feel free to change away as you see fit.
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Offline quantum

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Re: Slightly altering a piece?
Reply #2 on: April 18, 2012, 12:03:35 AM
There is no need to exert undue stretch in your hand.  You can break the notes you are unable to stretch.  Because of the polyphonic nature of the music, create the breaks with the horizontal line of the music in mind.  

One possibility is:
BG-D, D-F, CG-Eb.

Remember that this is a transcription of an organ piece.  On the organ there is the possibility of choosing registration.  For example, the bass is only a single note played in the pedals, but typically would sound in octaves.  This has been translated for the piano into physically playing the octaves, as the piano does not have alternate registrational abilities.  
Made a Liszt. Need new Handel's for Soler panel & Alkan foil. Will Faure Stein on the way to pick up Mendels' sohn. Josquin get Wolfgangs Schu with Clara. Gone Chopin, I'll be Bach

Offline jayeckz

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Re: Slightly altering a piece?
Reply #3 on: April 18, 2012, 12:26:58 AM
Learn something else :D.

In all seriousness, what possessed you to learn this piece?

First, I'd like to apologize for the way this post is written. I'm sure there are more concise terms for most of what I will describe here, but I'm coming back to music after a six year hiatus. I used to be wiz with musical notation and terminology, but I've forgotten most of it.

Have you looked at the entire piece?  There's a 4 octave jump that starts on an acciaccatura octave in the lower register and crosses over the right hand.  There are double trills.  There are tons of octaves and jumps (although the tempo is relatively slow).

This is a terrible piece to come back to in my opinion.  I read through the entire piece and to effectively play this without appropriate sized hands requires exceptional pedaling and really good voicing skills. I think you're really underestimating the difficulty of this piece.


My hands are a little too small to play a few bits of the piece as written. Specifically, the fourteenth measure on the second page ends with a couple chords a few steps wider than an octave. I can handle these in some forms, like C to Eb, but in others my hands are stretched flat enough that I have to depress the keys from the edge rather than the top of the key.
...
Having never studied formally, I am not aware of a "correct" answer to this problem. I almost want to just play a few different notes, but that feels like cheating. Does anyone have any advice on this?

There are world class musicians with hands smaller than yours that play music with 10ths; if you can't play exactly what's written it's acceptable to roll the chords or even leave out notes as long as you don't compromise the integrity of the music.

Offline andrewd084

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Re: Slightly altering a piece?
Reply #4 on: April 18, 2012, 02:47:27 AM
Thanks for the advice everyone. You guys have been a huge help.

Learn something else :D.

In all seriousness, what possessed you to learn this piece?

I like the way it sounds, and it is challenging in a way that I haven't tried before. The octaves, jumps and trills I'm not terribly worried about - just the notes I can't reach ;)

I do realize that it will probably be impossible to play perfectly as written. I feel that pedaling is something to which I've given a lot of attention, but still, you're right that it's obviously written for tall pianists. If I reach a point where I'm unhappy with it, I'll scrap it and move on to the next work on my list.
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