Jacques Duphly

[bernhard]

How would you like a Baroque composer no one heard of (except for a few harpsichordists, and yet as excellent as Scarlatti (Ok, I am exaggerating here) or Couperin?

I just come across this site with the complete works for Harpsichord by Jacques Duphly (1715 – 1789), who sounds even better on the piano (but then I don’t really like the harpsichord).

https://jacques.duphly.free.fr/

All four books are available for free, and each piece comes with a 20 second MP3 clip so that you have an idea of what the music is like. If you can however, get one of the CDs, since some of the pieces really catch on fire well into the one minute range (the Chaconne and Le Pothouin have to be heard in their entirety to be truly appreciated)

Here are my favorites (so far):

The most beautiful Rondeau (2) in book 1
La Victoire , La Felix in book 2
La de Villeneuve, La Forqueray and the amazing Chaconne in book 3
La de Vaucanson , La de Drummond, and the superb La Pothouin in book 4

Feel free to comment.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[Hmoll]

Thanks Bernhard.
I'm at work now, so I'll check them out later, and comment.

[faulty_damper]

Bernhard, I have just printed out the music for the Chaconne from the third book and am wondering what some of these markings on the music mean.

1.  First page: there is this weird looking ÷ sign over and below the second 'chord' in measure 1 and over the first |:repeat:| bars.

2.  The + sign above some of the notes.

3.  The bottom two staves on first page with an * astersisk-like thingy with a + next to it.

Okay, I just dwnloaded the 15second music clip.  The + means a mordent?

[bernhard]

Good choice! Wonderful piece.

1.   The weird looking sign shows you from where to start the repeat (= dal segno). That is, when you get to the end of the first section, on top of the repeat there is this symbol. So you go back to the point where you find the same symbol and repeat from there. (in other words, the repeat does not include the initial chord).

2.   That is an ornament sign. Which ornament? Well, be prepared for some soul-searching research. As it is , “+” stands simply for “ornament here”, without specifying which ornament you should use. In the recordings I heard, it sounds like either a short trill or a mordent, but I suggest you have a look at the treatise by Couperin (L’art the toucher le clavecin” – The Art of Playing theHarpsichord) who was Duphly’s compatriot and so-so contemporary, who provides complete tables of ornaments as well as rules for using them with “good taste” (both the tables and rules are somewhat different from the tables and rules by C.P.E. Bach).

3.   The asterisk is not an asterisk. It is a sharp sign at 45 degrees. It means that whatever note is there within the ornament has to be sharped (look for a similar use on the bar just before it – but with a natural sign: it means that the Bb within the ornament must be made natural).

Good luck!

Best wishes,
Bernhard.
.

[faulty_damper]

Thank you very much, Bernhard.  That makes very much sense.

And on a related matter, the score was very much difficult to read because the notes were not always lined up and it was difficult discerning which rest notes corresponded to which line.

[bernhard]

Thank you very much, Bernhard.  That makes very much sense.

And on a related matter, the score was very much difficult to read because the notes were not always lined up and it was difficult discerning which rest notes corresponded to which line.

Indeed. I have actually rewritten the whole score with a notation software. And the Chaconne is pretty straightforward – a lot of the other scores use a C-clef instead of an F-clef, so unless you are conversant with C-clefs you will have to transpose it.

Anyway, it was free, so stop moaning!

Best wishes
Bernhard

[BoliverAllmon]

this thread needs a huge bump

[pianistimo]

yes!  this is fantastic.  i love the flexibility of rhythms.  it sounds true to the form of the time (whoever is playing).  you almost hear dynamics in the harpsichord by use of fast notes (louder) here and there, and the bass being evened out by often playing less notes but still very resonant. 

romance scale = 10.  i love music of this kind.  it reminds me of guitar music, which reminds me of lute music, which reminds me of the lute player, which reminds me of the lady whom he's playing for (who left out the back door and running off behind him in the pic), but if i were there i'd stay.

[iumonito]

Great opportunity here.  There seems to be no recording of this repertoire on the piano.  We have ten years to make a splash in this guy's 300 birthday.

Let's do it.

[bernhard]

Great opportunity here.  There seems to be no recording of this repertoire on the piano.  We have ten years to make a splash in this guy's 300 birthday.

Let's do it.

Exactly!

All the recordings I came across of this beautiful music is on Harpsichord. Duphly is just too good to ignore.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[amanfang]

Which notaton software do you use?  Interested in sending file attachments of the entered scores?

[bernhard]

I use Personal Composer. I am happy to attach the files, but unless you have the software, all you get when trying to open it is garbled gibberish. (I tried)

[amanfang]

Nope.  Don't have that program.  I use Finale.      

[benvoyons]

Hi everyone, I'm the webmaster of the website about Jacques Duphly. If you want to contribute to that web site, don't hesitate ! and thanks for promoting his music on that forum. (sorry for my English !  )

S. Ch.

[BoliverAllmon]

Hi everyone, I'm the webmaster of the website about Jacques Duphly. If you want to contribute to that web site, don't hesitate ! and thanks for promoting his music on that forum. (sorry for my English !  )

S. Ch.

no thank you for putting the site up.

[bernhard]

Hi everyone, I'm the webmaster of the website about Jacques Duphly. If you want to contribute to that web site, don't hesitate ! and thanks for promoting his music on that forum. (sorry for my English !  )

S. Ch.

As Boliver said, many thanks to you for making such wonderful music available. 

I would like to make a suggestion for your site. Any hope of having a discussion on Duphly’s ornamentation? I use Couperin’s rules, assuming Duphly follows the same tradition, but it would be nice to have some directions to that end if possible.

Best wishes,
Bernhard

[menancyandsam]

Based on forum members enthusiasm, I decided to try & learn Duphly's "Rondeau (2). 


Background:  I've started taking Piano lesson in May '05.  Hardest pieces learned todate:  Bach's (Petzold) Menuet in G maj, G min, Schumann's Wild Horseman, Beethoven's Sonatina in G.

Anyway, I'm finding the Rondeu pretty difficult to get going & was wondering if it wasn't over my head.  I been finding hs comes pretty easy but ht very hard.  I've got bars 1-8 ht, & been learning 9-17 hs. 





My Questions:

1)  What is the  two in the time sig. mean.  Teacher says its 4/4 time. 

2)  The 10th & 19th bar has only 2 beats.  Are these somehow pick up's for bars 19 & 27? If so  is this common?

2)  What sequence do you play?  Is it 1-9 & then 1-9 again, then 10-18, 19-27 & finish w/ 1-9?

3)  What are these notations:
      a)10th bar has a (1er couplet) notation
      b)19 bar has a (2e fois) (2e couplet) notatation. 
      c)18th & 27th bar has a (au Rondeau) notation.
      d)9th has a (Fin) notaion.

4)  Fingering suggestion and how to play the ornaments:
          I know not to play these now since it just complicates the learning process, but would like to know how to play them so I can work out the proper fingerings. 

5)  What tempo would you suggest?

I ask my teacher the above questions, but he did not really provide me w/ any sufficient answers.  And I tried to e-mail the webmaster of the Duphly site, but have goten no reply.

I might add that when I first listen to this recording on the https://jacques.duphly.free.fr/ web site I did not really like it.  But listening to my teacher play it changed my mind completly.

P.S.  Would anyone else like to suggest any other Duphly pieces that a 1st year beginner could tackle?

[bernhard]

1)  What is the  two in the time sig. mean.  Teacher says its 4/4 time.

Your teacher is correct.

2)  The 10th & 19th bar has only 2 beats.  Are these somehow pick up's for bars 19 & 27? If so  is this common?

If you look at bar 1, it has only two beats as well. This is called an “anacrusis”, and it is a way to start a piece on a weak beat (technically called an upbeat), so that it “prepares” for bar 2 (which would be considered the true first bar, if you follow my drift). When the first section ends (on bar 9), the missing two beats of bar one are supplied. This is why bar 9 has only two beats (they are the missing beats of bar 1). However this practice is not universally adhered to.

Like wise, bar 10 – the start of the second section of the piece – is also an anacrusis which is completed at the end of the section (bar 18 – with only two beats).

Finally bar 27 should complete the anacrusis of bar 19 – which contrary to the previous sections does not seem incomplete at all – but actually is as you will see next.

2)  What sequence do you play?  Is it 1-9 & then 1-9 again, then 10-18, 19-27 & finish w/ 1-9?

This is a “rondeau”, a form first used in poetry and then adapted to music. A rondeau is a poem where a “refrain” is repeated after every stroph (or stanza), like so:

Refrain

Stroph 1

Refrain

Stroph 2

Etc.

Refrain.

In this case, the refrain is the first section (bars 1 – 9) – or premier couplet.

So it should be played like so:

First section (bars 1 – 9) - repeat
Second section (bars 10 – 18) - repeat
First section again – no repeat
Third section (bars 19-27) - repeat
First section (end) – no repeat

As you go from the first section to the third, replace bar 9 by bar 19 – the first two beats of bar 19 replace bar 9 – and that is why bar 19 is not an anacrusis (but it is in a sense).

3)  What are these notations:
      a)10th bar has a (1er couplet) notation
      b)19 bar has a (2e fois) (2e couplet) notatation. 
      c)18th & 27th bar has a (au Rondeau) notation.
      d)9th has a (Fin) notaion.

These are directions to play the several sections and their repeats as explained above. (1er couplet mean first section, 1er fois means first time, Fin, means end)

4)  Fingering suggestion and how to play the ornaments:
          I know not to play these now since it just complicates the learning process, but would like to know how to play them so I can work out the proper fingerings.

I have realised the ornaments for this piece following Couperin’s directions – Duphly was roughly contemporary with Couperin and they were both French, so I assume that Duphly followed the same rules. But the cruel truth is that we have no idea (at least I have no idea) what such ornaments are. Signs like such “+” do not represent specific ornaments, but rather suggestions that at that point the performer should ornament. In Duphly’s time, ornamentation was mostly improvised by the performer, the composer did not imposed his own ideas (Couperin did and was much resented by performers who viewed it as patronising and and encroachment in their area of expertise). If I have time during the weekend I will try to post the scores. However they are just suggestions, being neither binding nor authoritative. I would be most interested in directions for Duphly’s ornaments myself. (Also, have a look at reply #3 above)

5)  What tempo would you suggest?

Crochet = 66 – 80

I might add that when I first listen to this recording on the https://jacques.duphly.free.fr/ web site I did not really like it.  But listening to my teacher play it changed my mind completly.

There are some excellent CDs of Duphly available (the site has a list). I strongly suggest you get some. Unfortunately they are all on harpsichord.

P.S.  Would anyone else like to suggest any other Duphly pieces that a 1st year beginner could tackle?

Most of the pieces are of similar difficulty to the rondeau. You may try “La de Drummond”, “La De la Tour” and “La Forqueray” all of which are very beautiful.

I hope this helps.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[menancyandsam]

Thank you for replying, it is greatly appreciated. 

Just to clarify the sequence of playing starting with the 1st section that leads into the 3rd section.  This would be played bars 1-8, 19-27, 1-9 end.  Is that right?

My questions probably belong in the Student Corner Forum, but I was unsure how to get it there.

Thanks again.

[bernhard]

Thank you for replying, it is greatly appreciated. 

You are welcome

Just to clarify the sequence of playing starting with the 1st section that leads into the 3rd section.  This would be played bars 1-8, 19-27, 1-9 end.  Is that right?

Yes, that is correct.

Best wishes,
Bernhard.

[BoliverAllmon]

congrats for learning the duphly