Skill level through the years

[lvschubert]

Dear all,

I have been playing the piano now for 3 years. I have owned one for 2, and for the first year I couldn't play as often as I should've as I had no pianos around, other than at my music school. I am currently 18, and have been (unfortunately, I think) doing the Suzuki Method since I began. As you can see from my 'signature', the hardest pieces I can play so far are:

Schubert's Impromptu D. 899 No. 3,
Chopin's Nocturne No. 20 Op. Posth. &
Mendelssohn's Op. 19 No. 6 (Venetian Gondolla No. 1)

I feel that I have progressed very well for the amount of time I've been playing, but I have seen many people on youtube etc. saying that they are learning Beethoven's Pathetique 1st movement after just a year of playing. Is this even possible? It is way, way out of my reach so far. And another thing is, that the pieces mentioned above took me a max. of 2 weeks to learn (some less) whereas I see people talking about taking months to learn something. I am really good at memorizing, but is it that they play everything so slowly that they are able to play something regardless of their skill level? These questions have always bugged me.

Thanks in advance.

[outin]

And another thing is, that the pieces mentioned above took me a max. of 2 weeks to learn (some less) whereas I see people talking about taking months to learn something. I am really good at memorizing, but is it that they play everything so slowly that they are able to play something regardless of their skill level? These questions have always bugged me.

I can only speak for myself. It does take me months to learn a piece. First it may take me weeks to properly memorize one page of music (I especially struggle with remembering the fingerings). Then it takes me many more weeks to get the sound good enough. Or actually I don't think I have "finished" any piece yet 

Almost everything I play is a bit above my skill level I guess...I tried to play easier stuff in the beginning but that I could not memorize at all 

[hfmadopter]

Everyone learns at a different rate, I don't believe there is any standard that says you will learn something in a few weeks vs a few months. It sounds to me that you have done well in three years, especially since you had no piano in the first year. I have trouble understanding how people take lessons with no piano but it seems to occur enough. My teacher wouldn't take students with no piano or who only had an electronic piano. I would not teach someone who didn't have a piano but electronic or so called digital pianos have advanced to the point I would teach someone who owned a half decent one of those..

To me learning a piece and memorizing a piece are two separate activities. That said, I had the first movement of the Pathetique done in about my 5th year of lessons I believe ( long time ago now so it's not totally clear as to exact time frame). I played that memorized in a recital the following year at any rate.

Now that I'm older ( 62) I play easier pieces but I play them more advanced in detail, better dynamics. I feel I make prettier sounding music at this stage I'm in than when I was younger. Just the brain is a bit fuzzy ( too many different kinds of meds for it to be clear) so I am not bothering myself with super complicated music. For me the good news is I can play piano ! I can tune and repair my piano myself. I can teach early piano if I want to and I can teach a mid level secondary approach to playing piano if I choose to ( I've thought of this many times, nobody offers this here in my area any longer as far as I can tell and I got a lot from that course myself 35 years ago, I could teach adults this course).

So that's how it goes. Get it all in now, I feel your rate of success is unimportant as long as you are advancing ! If you need to advance faster all I can say is to study smart and often ! I think it's better to fit in several 30 minute sessions that are really constructive than to burn yourself in a 3-5 hour straight through study activity. 30 min and a break, 30 and a break, work on something else for 30 and another break. This way your brain absorbs better IMO.

[caioramos]

What hfmadopter said is completely true in my opinion, everyone learns at a different speed.. also the question about how long it takes for a piece to be completed varies according to its complexity and length, of course you will take less time on a 2 pages piece than on a 15 pages masterwork full of details, but it still varies depending on your skill... as you get better, you learn faster, as also according to how good you can read and memorize. I have a friend pianist who is going for her master degree, she can manage an entire Sonata in less than a week at an incredible level of quality, but well, she has 20 years of playing.

But from personal experience what I would say is believe yourself if you feel your capable of going farther. Give it a try, at least if you can't, go back a little. You asked if people play slower so they can play anything besides their level. It's partly true but it can go so far. There will be a point that something is so overwhelming difficult for one that he cannot play even slow. But I can guarantee fast progress is not a miracle. I'm not boasting, but I feel it's good for a matter of building facts. I started playing piano about 1 year and a half ago, from scratch. I have good memory like you but my sight reading sucks so much. But I can read well if I take my time. My ongoing repertoire I have the chopin revolutionary etude, etude op10 n4 and the Ballade no1. I also finished memorizing the grand polonaise brilliant after a month. I can just play really slow some parts, now I hope to be able to play it at a decent speed in a couple months. It's a big piece like the ballade after all. The ballade took me 3 months and I'm still polishing some harder passages. But it's mostly done.

Now, I can't play the etudes at that lightning speed as some interpreters play, but I can play at a really decent speed, but I started very slow as anyone else. And I still practice then everyday.
It reminds me of the time I joined this forum, and got to read an interesting thread about some guy that wanted to learn the rev etude in 2 years. Most people said he was nuts, and that was impossible. Some supported him. At the end he had some personal problems, he had a college going on and at the end he couldn't do it. I though at the time if I could do it in 3 years I would be more than happy, but I did it in 1 to my surprise. The point is, you don't have to believe anyone but you. So I hope my case help you and other people that read this that its a real fact one can progress so far in so little time, also, I'm not so young, I'm 27, quite a late starter, and I got a good teacher from the beginning, but mostly it was my confidence that got me there. Sure my playing is not the same as of someone who has 5 or 10 years of playing, but the fact I can play those pieces decently, is enough cause I learned so much challenging myself.

Some people say a piece is never done, I believe that. Even if you play something now decent, but not masterfully, it doesn't matter cause in some years you will get there, but you learned so much by overcoming yourself, that's important. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be playing at this level if I followed the normal piano program and stayed a whole year playing easy pieces, and going up slowly. So I really support people who have this impetus of challenging themselves every time. Also, I can say there is no age to start playing the piano, that's pretty obvious for me right now. Of course there are benefits starting at an early age, but also, it doesn't mean everyone who start early will be good, why is that? cause it's the individual that matters and hard work.

[jayeckz]

I feel that I have progressed very well for the amount of time I've been playing,

Everyone learns at their own pace.  What matters is how you feel about your progress. 

I have seen many people on youtube etc. saying that they are learning Beethoven's Pathetique 1st movement after just a year of playing. Is this even possible?

Definitely possible.  What matters is how dedicated and how much they are willing to work for it.  Post a link of their playing!  Most likely the playing is terrible.

And another thing is, that the pieces mentioned above took me a max. of 2 weeks to learn (some less)

That's extremely impressive!  Let's assume you were at this level for about half a year?  26 weeks...at the bare minimum 13 late intermediate pieces completed?

whereas I see people talking about taking months to learn something.

Everyone learns at a different pace.  I was assigned Pathetique when I first got interested in piano.  It took 2 weeks to learn the notes and bring the first movement to tempo; however, it was carelessly learned and there was no attention to details.

I am really good at memorizing,

Good is relative.  I know a pianist that can play classical pieces (Haydn/Beethoven/Mozart) by ear after hearing it a few times.  He can memorize entire Sonatas for performance in a matter of hours.  Apparently, his memory was this amazing; he learned the Prokofiev 3rd Sonata in a day after 2 years of learning the piano.

but is it that they play everything so slowly that they are able to play something regardless of their skill level?

People take more time for different reasons.  Some people don't practice.  Other people pay attention to more details.  Some other people lack technique and have to develop the technique in addition to learning the notes.

[hfmadopter]

It takes me months to learn most any piece to a level that I would want to present it in a performance. It's always been like that for me. But I have to say I was not ready for Parthetique in any form after my first year of piano lessons. I think in my second year I learned some Preludes and a Clementi piece, then we went on to Bach exercises . My first year was some simple pieces and books and a big thing was hand writing scales and chords in a manuscript book ( today they probably don't even get into you hand writing scales and chords, my teacher felt this got it into your head best). Also in the second year we got into books of different forms of scales and chords). In my second and third year I got to pick some of my own work and do some pop along with classical. And I was an adult student.

But today I can do arranging of my music and am glad of that. Many pop pieces don't suit me as written. I'll buy some David Nevue pieces and learn them as is, most other work I end up rearranging to some extent..

Of course today is a bit different too. I even find myself going online and seeing/listening to how masters play or played these pieces. In that way at least you know how it's supposed to sound. I remember learning Grillen, never heard of it never mind heard it played. Had no clue what I was getting into or how it should go. You couldn't just go online and hear something, there was no such thing as online !

[lvschubert]

My ongoing repertoire I have the chopin revolutionary etude, etude op10 n4 and the Ballade no1. I also finished memorizing the grand polonaise brilliant after a month. I can just play really slow some parts, now I hope to be able to play it at a decent speed in a couple months. It's a big piece like the ballade after all. The ballade took me 3 months and I'm still polishing some harder passages. But it's mostly done.

How on earth can you play the Ballade No. 1 after a year and a half??? How long do you practice every day? I know that some passages are very easy but that middle section is very hard. There is no way I could do it at the speed at which it is normally played.