problem with my teacher

[drazh]

hi
I have a good teacher. but sometimes he recommends some practice which I know is wrong ie finger independence exercise which is out of date. i didnt talk to him about this because didnt want him be angry. what should I dops: I dont want to change my teacher

[dcstudio]

where did you hear that it was "wrong"? I am just curious as to where you are getting this information and why you consider this source to be more accurate than your teacher's perspective when it comes to recommending exercises for you personally.
Forgive this example but-- Beethoven did not always agree with Haydn either--but that in no way diminished Haydn as a teacher.  each artist must find his own path...I guess what I am saying is that it is completely natural to not always agree with your teacher.  don't sweat it...and perhaps you could share your misgivings with him concerning this issue. I am sure he would happily explain his reasoning.   

[drazh]

dear dcstudio
my sources are
several comments  of bernhard which is a great  teacher (at least i think)
and  a book by georgy sandors :piano technic:

[p2u_]

I have a good teacher. but sometimes he recommends some practice which I know is wrong ie finger independence exercise which is out of date.

Don't think too much, drazh. Neither bernhard nor Georgy Sandor would ever object against your doing what your teacher recommends especially for you. Testing fingers for "independence" (= check that one finger does not hinder any of the others) is actually a very useful approach if done with care and awareness.

Paul

[dcstudio]

dear dcstudio
my sources are
several comments  of bernhard which is a great  teacher (at least i think)
and  a book by georgy sandors :piano technic:

GREAT!!
my friend, if I may say--your teacher should be quite impressed that you have taken the time to research other sources--if he is anything like me he will more than enjoy debating his point of view with you.  Give it a try!   

[ajspiano]

hi
I have a good teacher. but sometimes he recommends some practice which I know is wrong ie finger independence exercise which is out of date. i didnt talk to him about this because didnt want him be angry. what should I dops: I dont want to change my teacher

...certain finger independence exercises can perhaps be a terrible idea if done wrong..  however, do you not suppose that finger independence as an musical idea or concept is a fairly valid aim? infact..  since we are quoting bernhard as a valid source, why not consider this -

Using 2/3 part inventions...
..superb for the acquisition of the following skills:

1.      Independence of the hands.
2.      Contrapunctual thinking.
3.      Finger dexterity and independence.
4.      Development of cantabile.
etc. etc.

https://www.pianostreet.com/smf/index.php/topic,2714.msg23310.html#msg23310

I suggest you ask your teacher exactly what he hopes to achieve with the excersise and why he thinks it works. Reference your concern against sandor if you like, he's an accepted and valued source - you may be misunderstanding your teachers point...  and if he's not open to debate or giving sufficient explanation for your needs as a student you may have a bigger problem than potentially being given bad exercises.

[keypeg]

I have read discussion on the same topic in another forum.  A couple of things not yet mentioned here is that the OP is experiencing pain and the teacher says it doesn't matter.  One of the exercises is to hold down the outer keys (C and G) raise a middle finger as high as possible and strike the key - discomfort at the "high as possible" being considered as ok.  Does it matter if the pain is mild discomfort or something more?

[p2u_]

I have read discussion on the same topic in another forum.  A couple of things not yet mentioned here is that the OP is experiencing pain and the teacher says it doesn't matter.  One of the exercises is to hold down the outer keys (C and G) raise a middle finger as high as possible and strike the key - discomfort at the "high as possible" being considered as ok.  Does it matter if the pain is mild discomfort or something more?

Discomfort close to pain sensations? This doesn't sound good me. It's exactly what has given the old finger school its bad reputation. Fingers *can* be lifted without discomfort (especially the index finger, middle finger and pinky, but they should be more or less straight when lifted, and then come down bent (as the famous teacher Adele Marcus prescribes). In that case there is no discomfort. "As high as possible" seems overkill to me, and is probably a preparation for "striking with force", which is plain wrong. "As high as is still convenient" would be better. I do lots of finger lifting (practising, not playing), but I never "strike" a key. I let the fingers "drop", but it's probably more correct to call it a gentle swing into the key with just enough acceleration to sound the key mezzo forte. The result is a beautiful Lipatti-like sound with lots of pretty (not harsh) overtones, something like the sound of a marimba. It's meant as a workout for the extensors that are greatly neglected in daily life, but that have a considerable workload in piano playing, even if you play close to the key. It's also a wonderful "letting-go" exercise because of the drop after the lifting. It is very, very difficult to do, and it's not something you can let students do without guidance.
P.S.: "Holding" exercises are risky if the teacher forgets to mention how very little you need to keep a key down.

Paul

[keypeg]

I'm less interested in whether the exercise is good to do, because how a teacher presents something can make all the difference, than I am in the disregard of discomfort or pain.

[p2u_]

I'm less interested in whether the exercise is good to do, because how a teacher presents something can make all the difference, than I am in the disregard of discomfort or pain.

Disregard of anything a student experiences is bad in all regards. That speaks for itself, so I didn't explicitly mention it as a bad factor.

Paul

[the89thkey]

Just don't do it if you don't like it. You are not your teacher's slave.

[drazh]

hi
thanks for reply
I asked because I wanted to know if it is ok I will do it and tolerate any pain because other more experienced teachers  recommend that.
thanks