Is there such a thing as too effortless?

[ruvidoetostinato]

It was just something I was wondering about. 

Is there ever a point when effortless technique can be bad?

Opinions?

[p2u_]

Is there ever a point when effortless technique can be bad?

Yes. Although one can never have enough "technique", there is a point at which the "performance" becomes nothing more than a cheap circus trick:

1) When the musical intention is missing (we hear nothing but mechanics).
2) When the artist himself distracts attention from the music by deliberately doing something that has absolutely nothing to do with the musical performance. *

* I once witnessed world-famous pianist X, who was playing a very beautiful Adagio movement in a Mozart sonata. Suddenly, as if this was agreed upon beforehand, a lady in one of the first rows had a FAKE coughing attack. World-famous pianist X offered her his handkerchief while one hand "happened to be" free. Laughter in the hall. But it was all beside the musical point. The concert reviews the next day were not very flattering...

Paul

[j_menz]

It was just something I was wondering about. 

Is there ever a point when effortless technique can be bad?

Opinions?

Liszt apparently thought so. "I don't care how fast you can play your octaves, I want to hear the Polish cavalry".

All technique is "too much" when it is an end in itself, not a means to a greater end. If it's in pursuit of that greater end, no amount of technique is ever enough.

[ruvidoetostinato]

How about a hypothetical situation in which a "harsh and aggressive" and technically demanding piece is played very musically... but the technique seems so effortless that it visually seems... easy?

I have a buddy or two that are on the other end of the spectrum.  They play very beautifully, but have excessive showmanship.

I'm wondering if it will have a similar effect if a work demands a sense of aggressiveness, but the showmanship is completely nonexistent, and simply utilizes effortless technique.

Yes. Although one can never have enough "technique", there is a point at which the "performance" becomes nothing more than a cheap circus trick:

1) When the musical intention is missing (we hear nothing but mechanics).
2) When the artist himself distracts attention from the music by deliberately doing something that has absolutely nothing to do with the musical performance. *

* I once witnessed world-famous pianist X, who was playing a very beautiful Adagio movement in a Mozart sonata. Suddenly, as if this was agreed upon beforehand, a lady in one of the first rows had a FAKE coughing attack. World-famous pianist X offered her his handkerchief while one hand "happened to be" free. Laughter in the hall. But it was all beside the musical point. The concert reviews the next day were not very flattering...

Paul

Wow.  I would have understood if it was a comedy concert/performance like Igudesman and Joo.  I witnessed a less serious happening.  When pianists play pieces that end with a pianissimo, yet feel the need to release with intensity. 

I also saw a concert in which the pianist pelvic thrusted in rhythm with three repeated chords in the low register of the piano.  Some sort of new technique? LOL.

Liszt apparently thought so. "I don't care how fast you can play your octaves, I want to hear the Polish cavalry".

All technique is "too much" when it is an end in itself, not a means to a greater end. If it's in pursuit of that greater end, no amount of technique is ever enough.

I agree. 

[p2u_]

How about a hypothetical situation in which a "harsh and aggressive" and technically demanding piece is played very musically... but the technique seems so effortless that it visually seems... easy?

I cannot think of any existing Work of Art that was created especially to LOOK "technically demanding". There are indeed many instances, in which a pianist's "fluent" technique is completely beside the point (Beethoven with a Liszt approach, for example; too smoothly and therefore stylistically incorrect). That's the difference I always like to emphasize between mechanics and technique: Mechanics is playing all the notes in the right time, even following all the instructions concerning volume, etc. but it still sounds empty (The layman will say that we hear nothing but "technique"). Technique on the other hand is EVERYTHING that is needed to bring the music to life, including inspiration, which is mostly the result of hard work in a certain direction. Therefore, if music is supposed to sound "harsh and aggressive" (passages in music by Prokofieff, for example), it should also be played that way. War scenes are not a walk in the park under the stars with your beloved one. There should be absolutely no discrepancy between the movements a pianist makes and the resulting sound image.

Paul

[lostinidlewonder]

The best pianists don't look like they are tired or worn out while playing. Just look at their videos. They can play extremely technically challenging pieces but their hands float over the keys and look comfortable with great ease. To me a great pianist is one that can do this, efficiency of movement, grace in their style of playing. I have met many high level pianists who play excellently but they are so worn out at the end. Do you think you can play like this your whole life? If you aim to play piano for a long time and into your twilight years you need an effortless touch or at least find more efficiency in your movement. What you can get away with in your youth will punish you when you are older.

[ruvidoetostinato]

Thanks for the opinions all. 

If you aim to play piano for a long time and into your twilight years you need an effortless touch or at least find more efficiency in your movement.

Totally agree.  Effortless playing is important in maintaining a career in playing.  I've met so many people that have had massive tension when they play music.  Some have just forced themselves through it, though I always wondered how some people can continue to play piano with pain.  I mean hell, I think we're all masochists to an extent, but never physically!

There should be absolutely no discrepancy between the movements a pianist makes and the resulting sound image.

Paul

I can see the idea.  I do believe that in general, the current character will naturally shine through physically, without the need to fabricate movements.   Though I've witnessed some cases when the movements were minimal, but the sound produced was unexpectedly harsh.  Kind of throws me off when those people perform.  Interesting how varied styles are.