I didn't know you could be more or less dead.
Hollywood says you can, so it must be true.
To preserve the staccatto, I'd use 1 or 2 on the bottom note of each. 1 if it's white, 2 if it's black. Top note is whatever falls most naturally over the note required. I assume you've listened to recordings and know the pace you need to go.
I think would probably sound a little heavy handed, with so many jumps between positions. I'd just do as much as possible to fit at least two different chords into every hand position. From there, the details find themselves.
It shouldn't. The thumb/index are used to base the fingering on, not the playing, which should take it's lead from the top note.
The problem is that the formula you suggest demands a significantly big movement before every new chord. That will make it very hard to avoid excessive accentuating. Stylistically, it's clearly light and gentle- not virtuosic by nature. By conceiving either two or three chords per position, with as few movements as possible, it's much easier to maintain appropriate musical lightness. There's no justification for slinging the whole arm over each time unless a punchy and energetic drive is wanted. The first significant position shift that I'd employ wouldn't come until the end of the 2nd group of 6. At this point, I'd make two groups of two chords each. It's simple and straightforward when you make mental and physical groups that keep shifting the bare minimum. To throw the arm around between position after position where there's no physical necessity would be both more difficult technically and more difficult to control musically. PS the secret is to ask yourself what fingering you would take if each chord was only played once and if it were legato. Most of it takes minimal thought if you view it that way. Then apply the same fingering.
I think your playing deeper into the keys than me. I don't find the sideways movements significant at all and, because I'm closer to the front of the keys I'm more concerned about avoiding having to twist to get into position - that would cause me more problems.One of the reasons fingering is often quite a personal thing, I guess, is that some movements come easier and some come harder and that varies from individual to individual..EDIT: I should also add that the original orchestration has those staccatos as bowed, not pizzicato, so it's not too crisp a staccato - closer to detache IMO.
throwing the arm to the side so often almost inevitably equates to it plummeting down with more force, at least some of the time. I'd actually be stunned to see a top professional accompanist making so many changes of position.
A gently moving "place of readiness", if you will.
We clearly perceive what's happening differently. I don't see anything like "throwing the arm to the side", I see a gentle and slight movement; perfectly easy, natural and controlled. A gently moving "place of readiness", if you will.
I am amazed that this has turned into another technique argument thread.Thal
This aria is not difficult at all! It doesn't go fast, you know. It's very soft and light. Just imagine you're accompanying valentina...
The poster said he's missing notes. If he takes advice that suggests finding brand new hand positions for almost every new note (rather than grouping into bigger chunks), he'll be in big trouble. I don't even view this as a technique issue - but an issue of applying common sense fingerings to keep things simple, rather than to force yourself into constant physical adjustments that serve no direct musical function. The more notes you have comfortably under your fingers (rather than a significant arm adjustment away from being so) the easier it is to play. As I said, there's good reason why we don't typically play a staccato melody with one finger. Too many adjustments is that reason.
"Lol" doesn't even begin to express what I felt when I read this.
Do you have to play it in tempo? I would probably use something like this:
Which apart from the occassional use of the third on the bottom note is actually in line with what I had in mind.Given that he is accompanying a singer in her audition, I would imagine it has to be played at whatever tempo she has determined for the aria, so "at tempo" is pretty likely.@ N - I don't understand your moving from fixed position to fixed position at all. My hands move around as required, and pretty constantly. I'd never regard them as fixed>move>fixed. Maybe I'm misunderstanding.
Perhaps you didn't mean the thing about 1 and 2 as a guiding principle (implying avoidance of the third even if available for use, within a big position ) but simply for particular spots where it keeps things in a single position?
I didn't mean to imply an avoidance of the third. If it's on hand and easily available, by all means use it. 1 and 2 seem to me to occur most often though and I was more concenrned with the awkwardness of moving them each on and off black notes, causing the hand to potentially twist a bit (unnesccessarily). If the third is handy and avoids extra movement, that would be preferable to using one of the others and moving further than necessary.
I think it works as a secondary principle, but it would wreak havoc in bar 2. I'd only follow that as my guide where it does not conflict with a primary principle of integrating many notes under a prepared position. If it starts forcing many position shifts at short notice, it can cause major problems. Also, in a few cases I'd take a thumb on a black key for the sake of getting more out of a single hand position (not in this specific example though). In this example the 1 and 2 thing (where useful) sorts itself out between black and white keys, simply by conceiving positions.
We clearly have a different mental approach going on; I don't think in terms of positions at all, rather of flowing movement.
Movement flows easiest when many fingers are at the ready. It's not about a fixed arm but fingertips that are ready on the keys. Quick shifts generally interrupt flow more than they aid it- for the simple reason that there's more ground to cover and more often.
Like i said, the tempo is not fast.
I have accopanied this aria countless times and i can assure you there is absolutely no problem in using the same finger from one chord to the next.
That's a little fast.
One should avoid repeating use of the same middle fingers (234) from one chord to the next (especially given the speed of the semiquavers), I am surprised one so called expert failed to promote this. Repeating the same middle fingers does not promote a supple hand at all. Bar 1: (35) (12) (14) (35) (14) (25) (14) (23) (15)Bar 2:(52) (14) (23) (14) (35) (24) (35) (42) (13)Bar 3: (35) (12) (14) (35) (24) (15) (14) (23) (15)
? so how do you play major scales in thirds without ever using 3 twice in a row? Given how fast people can execute those, it's clearly not something that need be excluded. By striving to make the most of each hand position, you will avoid repeating fingers where it would be harmful. The concept already takes care of that- because the harm comes from needless position shifts.However, when you need to change hand position, either way, there is scant difference. For example, I have not the problem starting the second beat of bar 2 with 13 35- ie the standard fingering for A major thirds. If you're genuinely ruling out that fingering, it would be of interest to know how you finger A major thirds.
I'm sorry but we already have the context to discuss we do not need your random examples to look at thanks. I am interested that given your so called expertise you could not even provide a proper answer in this thread but still decided to word salad it and try to show people they are wrong.
I'm not interested buddy, I responded because I felt the poster could be misled by advice that promoted many hand position changes. And without giving a supposed rule that would rule out the validity of standard major thirds fingering.
I didn't provide an answer because I don't believe in spoonfeeding fingers but in finding your own with chunking.
If you think my fingering advise is misleading then you gotta go learn how to play piano again.. buddy.
Then tell us how you finger major scales without repeating the middle finger, as your rule says not to. How about the A major in the chopin thirds etude? If you want to stand by your rule as being a genuine guiding rule (rather than a surface trend that results from playing with big chunks under the hand) you need to demonstrate how you manage to employ it in this context. otherwise, it ain't no rule, sorry.
I already said we do not need your random examples we have all the notes and context we need right here in this thread. You are trying to talk about other random things, WE HAVE THE DAMN MUSIC IN FRONT OF US.
Topic: I am soo dead 