Are we being to hard on Lang Lang?

[korlock]

The faces he makes are horrible. I just thought I'd get that out of the way. I have had my share of bashing on Lang Lang in the past just like everyone else. I've thumbed down dozens of his recordings on youtube and criticized him with my fellow music mates. But honestly, part of me has always had a fondness to his style no matter how much I tried to dislike him. For instance, I found his recording of Prok 3, specifically the finale, to be a very good listen.

Despite his "abysmal" recordings I still think that the above shows that we should give him a chance. What does everyone else think? If you ever heard a performance by him that you liked would you keep it to yourself? Would you judge all of his recordings equally? Keep in mind that he is one of the most famous pianists in the world. And many people join the music crowd listening to him first.

[worov]

Keep in mind that he is one of the most famous pianists in the world. And many people join the music crowd listening to him first.

McDonald is the most famous restaurant in the whole world. Many people come there in crowd to eat McDonald's food. But that doesn't mean that the food is good.

[perfect_pitch]

McDonald is the most famous restaurant in the whole world. Many people come there in crowd to eat McDonald's food. But that doesn't mean that the food is good.

QUOTE OF THE DAY!!!   

[korlock]

McDonald is the most famous restaurant in the whole world. Many people come there in crowd to eat McDonald's food. But that doesn't mean that the food is good.

Thats a bad comparison. I'm pretty sure Burger King and Taco bell are just as unhealthy. The point I'm trying to make is that people are introduced to classical music after listening to Lang Lang. Why is that a bad thing?

[rachmaninoff_forever]

Yes, we are being WAY too hard on Lang Lang.

He is a fantastic pianist irrespective of what faceshe makes.  Period.

[thalbergmad]

The point I'm trying to make is that people are introduced to classical music after listening to Lang Lang. Why is that a bad thing?

Because they might think that is as good as it gets.

Thal

[thalbergmad]

McDonald is the most famous restaurant in the whole world. Many people come there in crowd to eat McDonald's food. But that doesn't mean that the food is good.

Eat crap, a billion flies can't be wrong.

Thal

[worov]

Thats a bad comparison. I'm pretty sure Burger King and Taco bell are just as unhealthy. The point I'm trying to make is that people are introduced to classical music after listening to Lang Lang. Why is that a bad thing?

Some of this food is unhealthy, I'm sure of it, but that's not what I meant. I was talking about the taste. People eating McDonald's food have bad taste. Some people have bad taste in food. There are also some people who have bad taste in music.

[iansinclair]

If I don't have to watch him, he's unquestionably good.  Very good.  Is he great?  Time will tell.

If I have to watch him... ah, no, thank you.  In my humble opinion, the visual antics are completely out of place and detract from the performance. 

[louispodesta]

I am 61 years old, and my parents started taking me to symphony concerts when I was four.

Without a doubt, Lang Lang is the most disgusting classical performer I have ever seen in my life.  I cannot watch this man on television without getting physically ill.

For starters, my late teacher taught me, and there are those of you who will disagree and consider this racist, that the Chinese are copyists.   He said that their philosophy of life does not include individual creativity.

So, when you listen to Lang Lang's most recent televised recital from Europe, it sounds like multiple pianists.   He sounds one way when he plays the Chopin, and he sounds like another artist when he plays another composer's music.

Why?  Because he is "copying" a particular recording that he favors.  It is not his individual creative thought on the piece.

When he played the Chopin 1st Concerto with Lorin Maazel, Maazel kept turning around and glaring at him.  He actually looked like he wanted to throw the baton at him.

Why?  Because that piece is supposed to be played in a highly imrovisational style.  You are supposed to milk those trills and those runs for everything they are worth.

Did Lang Lang do that?  No, he did not.  Instead, he played it straight.

Why?  Because that is the way he copyed it from some recording.

I could go on forever on this clown, and that is what he is, but I will finish with two thoughts.

First, he mashes his left hand when he plays chords, and for those young pianists out there who copy these so-called greats, this is one sure fire way to permanently injure your hand.  When he played the Tchaikovsky on News Year Eve, at one point he vigorously shook his left hand and winced in pain.

Next, under the heading of totally and completely disgusting, I have in my possession the promotional flyer for this seasons programs for the San Antono Symphony.  On the front is a photograph of Lang Lang in skin tight leather black pants showing a very definite outline of guess what?

I am sure you can find it online somewhere, but what that has to do with classical music is way beyond me.

As I said, the man is totally and completely disgusting!

[slobone]

For starters, my late teacher taught me, and there are those of you who will disagree and consider this racist, that the Chinese are copyists.   He said that their philosophy of life does not include individual creativity.

[...]

Next, under the heading of totally and completely disgusting, I have in my possession the promotional flyer for this seasons programs for the San Antono Symphony.  On the front is a photograph of Lang Lang in skin tight leather black pants showing a very definite outline of guess what?

Gosh, with all your stereotypes about Chinese people, I was sure you'd tell us he didn't have much of a bulge either...

[louispodesta]

In that department, he excels.  You don't end up with a billion and half people without having the right equipment.

I couldn't pass it up.

And, there has been many a philosophy book written on the Asian mindset.   I didn't just make that up.

[slobone]

I don't know what your nationality is, but I doubt very much that you'd appreciate it if people were saying, Well what do you expect, he's Belgian, or Swiss, or whatever. The Chinese have made great strides in their music education in a very short time, and will probably be surpassing most American pianists any day now.

[thalbergmad]

Welcome to the World Gross Generalization Championships.

Thal

[landru]

I've been to two concerts of Lang Lang here in Seattle with the symphony. I listen to concerts with my eyes closed way up in the balcony (and awesome acoustics BTW) so I am never distracted by the visual.

The first was Prokofiev's third piano concerto. It was an amazing experience, really loved it.

The second was a Chopin concerto. It was the most confusing experience I ever had. I had the feeling that somebody on stage really didn't understand the music. My bet is that it wasn't the conductor or the orchestra.

What to take from this? When the music involves real interpretation rather than pyrotechnics, Lang Lang can be at a loss.

[louispodesta]

This is what I keep saying as it involves individuality.  The Chinese culture promotes excellence in performance for the good of the whole, and not the individual person.

And, for the record, I have had to endure racism for practically every day of my life.  That has nothing to do with anything.

Like I said when it came to the peformance with Lorin Maazel, whose philosophy it is to let the music have all of the interpretive freedom that it can, he kept looking at Lang Lang as if to say: who in the world taught you to play this piece this way?

Tony Tommasini of the NY Times keeps giving him a pass by saying things like:  "he is a work in progress."   Hey, he has been out there ten years.   How long are we supposed to wait?

There are dozens of pianists who can play the daylights out of the Prokoviev 3rd.   Big deal and so what.

Let this man play a Debussy Prelude or a Brahms Intermezzo, and you go away saying;  huh?

[thalbergmad]

Lang Lang reminds me a bit of David Beckham. Someone who has made an excellent career out of being nowhere near the best, but getting millions to think he is the best.

Thal

[quantum]

What makes me wonder about all those critics that bash Lang Lang for his visual antics, is with all that attention they focused on with their visual stimuli, what did they actually hear?  Or was it more a dance of listening with one's eyes and plugging up one's ears.


IMO, one of the elements of art music culture I most dislike is the ad nauseam dictum of must do, should not, this-and-only-this, states of mind that many consider prerequisites of this music.  Or at the very least, prerequisite so one may consider the music or performer worthy enough of serious comment. 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

I am 61 years old, and my parents started taking me to symphony concerts when I was four.

Without a doubt, Lang Lang is the most disgusting classical performer I have ever seen in my life.  I cannot watch this man on television without getting physically ill.

For starters, my late teacher taught me, and there are those of you who will disagree and consider this racist, that the Chinese are copyists.   He said that their philosophy of life does not include individual creativity.

So, when you listen to Lang Lang's most recent televised recital from Europe, it sounds like multiple pianists.   He sounds one way when he plays the Chopin, and he sounds like another artist when he plays another composer's music.

Why?  Because he is "copying" a particular recording that he favors.  It is not his individual creative thought on the piece.

When he played the Chopin 1st Concerto with Lorin Maazel, Maazel kept turning around and glaring at him.  He actually looked like he wanted to throw the baton at him.

Why?  Because that piece is supposed to be played in a highly imrovisational style.  You are supposed to milk those trills and those runs for everything they are worth.

Did Lang Lang do that?  No, he did not.  Instead, he played it straight.

Why?  Because that is the way he copyed it from some recording.

I could go on forever on this clown, and that is what he is, but I will finish with two thoughts.

First, he mashes his left hand when he plays chords, and for those young pianists out there who copy these so-called greats, this is one sure fire way to permanently injure your hand.  When he played the Tchaikovsky on News Year Eve, at one point he vigorously shook his left hand and winced in pain.

Next, under the heading of totally and completely disgusting, I have in my possession the promotional flyer for this seasons programs for the San Antono Symphony.  On the front is a photograph of Lang Lang in skin tight leather black pants showing a very definite outline of guess what?

I am sure you can find it online somewhere, but what that has to do with classical music is way beyond me.

As I said, the man is totally and completely disgusting!

For every bad performance you have of his, I can come back with 10 really good ones.  

It's a shame that all of his bad performances get all the attention, but whenever he freaking nails a piece, everyone ignores it. 

It's as if you guys don't want him to be a good pianist.

He's not my favorite, but I won't deny his talent.

Sure he may act like a clown, well actually, I went to one of his concerts last year, and I expected him to make the outrageous faces that I see on YouTube, but it was the complete opposite.  Even the repertoire he played was unlike what I saw on YouTube.

But anyways, sure he may act like a clown, but that doesn't change the fact that he's a good piano player.

[chopin2015]

Ok the prok and chopin comparison doesnt work. Lang lang can play prok because it is high drama, not just because it has little musical feel(its not atonal) which would allow him to play naturally heartlessly(no,!). He wouldnt do well with chopin because its subtle music, not everyone has so much patience and poise(hes not that type of man) with music like chopin concertos. I dont know either concerto, but i can tell by looking at lang lang. He likes technicality and probably believes musicality cant exist without it. He looks different than yundi li, and they play different. I think lang lang wouldnt be his awesome self if he was poised like ashkenazy, but he should know his weakneses!
Although most of us cant talk much, were not famous pros...cept j menz and ajspianer, who are the same person...
In most probable case, most people, i bet, prefer chopin to prok, so they dismiss lang lang as a liked pianist when really he is just not a chopin guy...lol

[hfmadopter]

In most probable case, most people, i bet, prefer chopin to prok, so they dismiss lang lang as a liked pianist when really he is just not a chopin guy...lol

I think most just don't like to view him and can stand the music he produces, is what we are hearing from the peanut gallery here.

I'll give him his just due, I could not out perform him or even come close and I probably make some pretty stupid looking faces myself when I get deep enough into my music. As others have said, he is not my favorite pianist but I should say the average you tuber isn't coming close to his performance level, like it or not. Lang Lang has found his way, good for him !

If I want to hear Chopin, I dig up some Horowitz videos !

[forte88]

I am 61 years old, and my parents started taking me to symphony concerts when I was four.

Without a doubt, Lang Lang is the most disgusting classical performer I have ever seen in my life

 

[j_menz]

He has a hugely successful recording career, a string of (sold out) concerts with the worlds great orchestra, has performed before the crowned and uncrowned heads of three continents, has a string of awards and was listed as one of Time's 100 most influential people.

Methinks he couldn't give a toss what a few jaded haters on PS might think.

If you don't like him, watch or listen to someone else!

Or go practice til you can do better.

[thalbergmad]

Methinks he couldn't give a toss what a few jaded haters on PS might think.

If it was only us, quite true.

Thal

[g_s_223]

I think we will find that there are works which suit him: Prok #3 may well be;

however, for Chopin (PC #1 Pollini) or Beethoven (PC #4 Arrau) etc others would suit.

[nivek57]

For starters, my late teacher taught me, and there are those of you who will disagree and consider this racist, that the Chinese are copyists.   He said that their philosophy of life does not include individual creativity.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you on the above, quoted comment. What I find really, really irritating is that you know a comment you're making could potentially be racist, but yet you say it. It makes it worse when you're aware of it, no?

I'd like to know what you think of Yundi Li, louispodesta. He, too, is Chinese.

Anyway, to get back on topic...

I dislike the flamboyancy that Lang Lang displays in his performances. As many of you can agree with me, when you close yours eyes and listen to him play - he's great.

Watch this video of him:

If he was more like that, meaning less artsy and less dramatic with his facial expressions and limb movements, I would spend my hard-earned money to attend his concerts.

Ever heard the quote "salute the rank, not the man"? Well, I think a lot of the population has clouded judgement and is letting his "artsy flaws", shall we call it, distort their opinions on the sounds he produces on the keyboard.

Let's not forget he's signed to a major classical record label. Producers couldn't possibly haven been that deaf when they picked a needle in a haystack. And doesn't he sell out concerts? I don't think people go for his sex appeal, for his ability to dance or do magic tricks, etc. Why else then? Hmmm. Perhaps he's actually good at what he does.

[thalbergmad]

Perhaps he's actually good at what he does.

Good but not great. Nowadays you don't have to be the best to succeed.

I am not convinced that racism has anything to do with it. I know two Chinese pianists that do not rate him and it is not through jealousy as both are musically and technically his superior.

Thal

[pianoamit]

Lang Lang (having met and spoken to him) is a charming and very charismatic man. As a musician, let's just say there is something still to be desired. I was given free tickets to the Beethoven Concerto cycle in the Albert Hall, so I went, and I think The Guardian's review is amazingly accurate...

https://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2012/mar/21/philharmonia-salonen-lang-lang-review

[forte88]

For starters, my late teacher taught me, and there are those of you who will disagree and consider this racist, that the Chinese are copyists.   He said that their philosophy of life does not include individual creativity.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with you on the above, quoted comment. What I find really, really irritating is that you know a comment you're making could potentially be racist, but yet you say it. It makes it worse when you're aware of it, no?

I personally don't see anything racist about how culture(and language) influences how people develop.
There are always two sides. The ideas of Confucius weren't meant to produce the best musicians, they were intended to keep many peoples(the socalled Han Chinese)on a large landmass living together peacefully and harmoniously. And it worked. To contrast Europe split in small kingdoms was continuously at war. Also, similar philosophies and medical practises in Asia allowed for less suffering in Asia than in Europe. But I think that's why Europe excelled at the arts, Christians suffered a lot more and to make life more bearable they made great music.(compare that to the Buddhist cacophony). Also the competition between the small states responsible for much bloodshed also produced much innovation, coz in the race between life and death they had to be.
And finally whereas the accentuating of losing the ego (individuality)and the collectivity ensured more harmonious living, the suppression of individuality and conformity doesn't do much good for originality and that's what art is about.
But when it comes to music, Europe even without individuality would have produced better music is testified by the Middle Ages when anonymous composers would write great music. Europe had the Greek inheritance of musical scales, intervals of Pythagorus

[j_menz]

it is not through jealousy as both are musically and technically his superior.

But do they get the fame, the money and the groupies? Jealousy can take many objects.

[chopin2015]

Lang Lang (having met and spoken to him) is a charming and very charismatic man. As a musician, let's just say there is something still to be desired. I was given free tickets to the Beethoven Concerto cycle in the Albert Hall, so I went, and I think The Guardian's review is amazingly accurate...

https://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2012/mar/21/philharmonia-salonen-lang-lang-review

Yeh, he still has many years to go, in his carreer. He will play them better next time. Since his concerts sold out, then fantastic news!There are many people that love music!

[louispodesta]

If you want to see the difference between Lang Lang's histrionics and that of a true musician pianist, I enclose the following links:  I just sent these playing examples to the classical music critic for the Chicago Tribune, so I thought you guys should have it too.

They are You Tube live performances of Mieczyslaw Horszowski who was the oldest living concert pianist in history, having died at the age of 100 in 1993. The second link was recorded two years before his death.

His teacher was Leschetizky, whose teacher was Karl Czerny.  He made his debut at the age of eight in 1905 and played in this 19th century style for the next 90 years.

And, unlike Lang Lang, he wasn't world famous.  Most of you have never heard of him.

However, it is stunningly beautiful music.  Enjoy.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?

[louispodesta]

Sorry for the mix-up on the first Horszowski link.  It is the most important one.

Lang Lang couldn't get to this level of musicianship if he lived to be a thousand.

Enjoy.

[forte88]

But do they get the fame, the money and the groupies? Jealousy can take many objects.

why groupies?

Just because he's Lang Lang doesn't mean there's two of him

[j_menz]

why groupies?

Just because he's Lang Lang doesn't mean there's two of him

As in plural?  LOL, you really do need to get out more. 

[rachmaninoff_forever]

I think J Menz is the best pianist of them all.

[j_menz]

I think J Menz is the best of them all.

Best Lang Lang groupie?  I'm not even in the competition.

[teran]

The "typical Asian" thing doesn't really apply because he went to an American conservatoire and was mentored by western pianists.

In any case, I don't get why people are so uptight about him making funny gestures at the piano, I mean, you're not supposed to be watching music. -__-

I never look at a pianist when I listen in concert etc, I feel it detracts from the listening no matter how stoic they appear.

Besides, Glenn Gould made plenty of funny faces, gestures, and sounds at the piano, but it's okay because he's not asian, so let's just call him eccentric.

[pfhorrest]

He keeps classical music more relevant to more people than many performers. The value of that is so great that I think I would respect him just as much even if he was only half the pianist that he is.

And he is a very good pianist. There is no question about it. His theatrics, I think, are dramatized because when we see him in videos, recordings, etc. you can close up on his face and see everything he is doing, but in the actual audience itself his stage manners look totally fine and I'm not bothered by them at all - it's like stage makeup in that way.

[ming304]

Aren't live classical music performances an audio-visual performance?

I mean I kinda like seeing Lang Lang's funny expressions cause you'd never see any other pianist do it. So it's kind of a unique aspect of his performance. And he makes his playing look fun which might kind of bridge the gap to young people who may find classical music boring.

And if Lang Lang really is a 'copyist' then who's faces is he coping? 

And who said asians had small eyes 

[beethovenopus2no3movt2]

If you want to see the difference between Lang Lang's histrionics and that of a true musician pianist, I enclose the following links:  I just sent these playing examples to the classical music critic for the Chicago Tribune, so I thought you guys should have it too.

They are You Tube live performances of Mieczyslaw Horszowski who was the oldest living concert pianist in history, having died at the age of 100 in 1993. The second link was recorded two years before his death.

His teacher was Leschetizky, whose teacher was Karl Czerny.  He made his debut at the age of eight in 1905 and played in this 19th century style for the next 90 years.

And, unlike Lang Lang, he wasn't world famous.  Most of you have never heard of him.

However, it is stunningly beautiful music.  Enjoy.

Mr. Long Long is brilliant and should never be questioned


https://www.youtube.com/watch?

[kchi]

Although I'm not familiar enough with Lang Lang's playing to critique it, I am rather impressed with what he was able to achieve as a child. By the time he was 14 years old, he was studying at Curtis, had won the junior Tchaikovsky International, and had played all of the Chopin Études.

[louispodesta]

My apologies to those who viewed the Horszowski links.  The first one was in error.

Unfortunately, it is far the best example of what true musicianship and pianism can be without the histrionics.   Enjoy, and wait for the smile when he takes his bow.  The audience just loved him.

[yohankwon]

*too, as in "Are we being too hard on Lang Lang?"

[chopinrabbitthing]

Yes I do, the guy is entitled to do what he does. Yes, he does make some funny faces, and he may not be as musical as some of the greats (i.e Horowitz) but he does play some good music, especially when you compare him with other Asian pianists. Yes he does play quite fast, but so did Glenn Gould and Evgeny Kissin. And like the two mentioned, Lang Lang is a brave guy, I think he's true to himself and what he does.
If some of you snobs who "live" on Pianostreet detest him, just avoid his recordings. You know how many kids he has inspired to learn music? I'm one of them.
And I know Asians have gained some infamy on only being "technical" and not "musical" but dude, Lang Lang tries, and that's what makes him stand out from the other pianists.

[rajochowdo]

Here is my opinon

Why he is bad:
1. His performances are VERY inconsistent. A concert pianist does have some highs and lows but the difference between two consecutive performed works is never DRASTIC. With Lang Lang it is and this proves that he may be suited towards some composers rather than others
2. My teacher taught me that through exaggerated expressions on stage, even if you play well, your performance just becomes cheap. People like Horowitz did nothing dramatic but produced the most beautiful interpretations of pieces known today. Yundi li does get a bit tipsy on stage but his musical craft and class is never affected and the supreme standard of performance makes up for any cheapness from his face. Lang Lang on the other hand exaggerates too much. this equals cheapness and often distraction from playing
3. he is ignoring the public. He can ignore hundred or so ordinary joes  ( even though he shouldnt: as a performer the audience matters A LOT) but when thousands of people preach for an improvement in playing standard then something must be done

Why he is good:
1. some nice interpretations of pieces out there
2. Must have been really good before fame. Maybe overconfidence caused him to deprecate in quality
3. Has a bright, charismatic personality that appeals to the audience through the music.

My overall opinon:
He can be good, he can be REALLLY BAD, is quite cheap, should appreciate audience more, charismatic, got overconfident. Inconsistent: more prominent bad than good

[rachmaninoff_forever]

3. he is ignoring the public. He can ignore hundred or so ordinary joes  ( even though he shouldnt: as a performer the audience matters A LOT) but when thousands of people preach for an improvement in playing standard then something must be done


He can be good, he can be REALLLY BAD, is quite cheap, should appreciate audience more, charismatic, got overconfident. Inconsistent: more prominent bad than good

Actually, most people like him the way he is now. 

So why would you change for the minority?

[rajochowdo]

How is it a minority?

[rachmaninoff_forever]

How is it a minority?

More people like him the way he is than people who don't like the way he is.

At the end of the day, he still sells out his concerts.

If you don't like him, then you're not gonna pay like 50 bucks to see him play.  

So it's pretty obvious that he's considerate of the audience.  Or else nobody would pay to see him.