Used Yamaha C7 vs. ...

[going4grand]

Hi, I'm looking to buy a grand, budget upto ~20k. I'm currently looking at a used Yamaha C7 and trying to figure out if it's good value or if I should settle for a much smaller new piano. The C7 is from 1989, they just replaced the bushings, which greatly improved the action. I like the sound a lot but the action needs further regulation - it's currently not even and when I play I "drop" soft notes at some places. Compared to new pianos, the action does not respond as well or intuitive. They had a technician working on it when I was there and he was definitely able to improve it but there still seems to be a lot of difference compared to a new C7. Another concern is that there are some cracks in the sound board - very thin, but clearly visible. The ribs are still firmly attached.

My main question is how good this piano can become with further regulation and voicing and secondly, if the sound board is an issue and if I can expect major repairs in the near future. I do plan to have an independent technician assess the piano before making a decision.

The new piano that I liked best within my budget is a Kawai RX-1, 5'5. The action is fantastic, and I like the tone although the bass is of course not as deep and overall it probably has less dynamic range.

If the C7 can be brought to a close-to-new level and kept there with reasonable maintenance and replacements than I will obviously prefer that, the alternative is to buy the smaller Kawai and upgrade later to a larger one.

Any advice appreciated on what I can expect with the C7!

[m1469]

I have a C7 from 1982, which I purchased privately in *very good* condition for 16.5K.  I have been playing on it for several years now, and overall I believe I have grown very much with it as my main practice instrument.  While it's important to be able to get as much as possible out of any instrument we play, I am aware that there are characteristics about my piano which I have responded to musically over the years, and these characteristics just aren't there in smaller pianos.  

I also housed a smaller Kawaii for about a year or more before I bought my C7, and was renting a Nordiska, 5'6" (or so) before that.  I liked the Kawaii and sometimes think about downsizing to that one that I housed years ago (for financial reasons), but when push comes to shove I have a very difficult time letting go of the C7.  It's a very nice piano and I have never felt the purchase was a bad investment.  I had spent several years looking at and playing instruments of many types before I found my C7.  

I can't give you professional advice on the value of instruments, but musically and technically I can definitely say it was a very good choice for me with where I was at and the budget I was working with.

[going4grand]

Thanks for your reply m1469!

That sounds like a great price given the very good condition of the piano. I'm definitely with you in preferring the 7' size over a smaller one... I'm just trying to figure out if this particular one is worth fixing up and if the price is right. I also would prefer not to wait for many more years before I upgrade (I'm currently playing a small Yamaha upright..., which is why I'm looking at new alternatives as well.

Cheers,
Sebastian

[gvans]

I have a 1985 C7, and love it, and agree with m1469's comments. However, I am concerned about the soundboard cracks in the instrument you are looking at, since the soundboard is, essentially, the heart and soul of any piano. Any piano tech wizards out there with an opinion?

[m1469]

I'm not a soundboard wizard, but I've been told anyway that it's not necessarily a deal breaker if it's cracked (especially small ones) and that people make a bigger deal about it than it really is (mine is not cracked, just for the record).  

[gvans]

m1469's right, once again. Here's a quote from Larry Fine:

"Soundboards  have a tendency to dry out, shrink, and crack as they age, especially in environments that have pronounced seasonal variations in humidity.  The shrinkage results in a loss of crown, or curvature, from the soundboard, which can be detrimental to the tone.  But the cracks themselves are usually harmless unless they are accompanied by buzzing sounds or other problems."

The question then, would be, how's the crown of the soundboard? And is there any buzzing?

[hfmadopter]

If you own a piano, especially a nice grand and experience a sound board crack and deal with it ( it needs repair or doesn't need repair or you just monitor it) is one thing. To willfully go out and buy a piano with a cracked soundboard , IMO isn't such a great idea. You don't know the instrument but you do know it has this obvious flaw. During weather changes those cracks may open up, there could be episodes of different tonal quality and yes even buzzing. Why take that chance unless your tech is telling you they are of such inconsequential importance to nt matter at all ( could be superficial cracks in the soundboard surface, thats a different matter all together).

For the record, sound boards can be repaired but it's a very involved task unless the crack spans a rib where a little white glue and a couple of screws is about all that is required if there is separation from that rib and buzzing going on. The complete repair requires removing the harp and shimming the cracks, so complete disassembly of the piano. It's worth doing on a piano of a specific tonal value as there is no absolute that a new sound board will sound the same.