suggestions to progress

[bachkrille]

I have a talented student who now plays gmoll balade J Brahms.

He asked me - what do I need to to to be able to play la campanella of Liszt?
which music to I need to master before i can do it?

It would be nice to here some teachers advice. So please give your opion
Thanks
Bachkrille

[faulty_damper]

He needs a pair of hands attached to a body that are not broken.

Really, the best way to learn a piece is to start learning it.  IF he has any problems, then those problems should be addressed by you, the teacher.  IF he has no problems, then there is no problem and he would be able to play it.

I'm concerned that he is even questioning the required pedagogy of this piece.  What mountain do I need to climb before I can climb Mt. Everest?  You could try climbing the local mole hill.  After successfully stepping on it and callapsing it, you could try the sand hill in the playground.  After that, there is a sand dune at the beach.  And after that, there is the steep 5th street hill.  ... And maybe after that, you could try Mt. Diablo.  ... and then finally, you can try Mt. Everest.

But the problem with each of these "mountains" is that they each require different abilities to climb.  The mole hill can be climbed just be stepping on it.  Of course, there will be no mole hill after you take your foot off of it.  The sand hill at the playground can be climbed by taking two steps.  The sand dune requires more walking and a bit better balance as the sand will move under your feet.  The 5th Street hill just requires you to walk 2 blocks.  Mt. Diablo, you can just walk the on the road.  Mt. Everest, you need a Sherpa.

But how do you know what skills you need to be able to do something?  You usually don't know specifically until you do it.  With La Campanella, it requires the ability to do right hand leaps and left hand arpeggios.  Can you do these things?  If not, then learn it so you have practice doing it.  Liszt did write this as an etude.

So an etude means "study".  And you want to use another piece to learn how to do this study.  In essence, you are using a piece as a study to learn how to do a study.  Hmm...

[Brian Healey]

I completely agree with faulty damper.  The toughest part of being a teacher is deciding the best route for learning certain techniques for a piece. In some cases, the best thing is to actually dive right into the piece and learn as you go. Having goals is the best way to progress, and if this the student's goal, I would just go for it, and if you encounter problems along the way, deal with them the best way you know how.

On a personal note, when I was young I really loved (and still love) Debussy's "Clair de Lune". I told my teacher I wanted to play it, and he didn't feel I was quite ready, because he said it was an advanced piece and that I wasn't quite at that level yet. I set a personal goal that I wanted to play that piece, so I went home and practiced it on my own. Just a month after mentioning it to my teacher, I played it for him and he was astounded. In order to do something you want, you just have to set your mind to it. As Nike says, "Just do it."

[bachkrille]

Thanks for your ideas
Maybe I will let him have a try
Bachkrille

[lostinidlewonder]

I think La Capanella is tough to play at a faster tempo. Slower speeds it wont offer too much difficulty, still its a damn Liszt etude. It's the speed that causes the difficulty and i think to fully appreciate the touch at that velocity requires a lot of piano experience beforehand. Because if one is overwhelmed with the speed they can't appreciate the touch Liszt is trying to represent. If the speed is of little concern to you then you can finally start appreciating what Liszt is trying to show. You have to feel the motion in the hand to understand it, you cant understand it by writing it down, its just one of those things.

I think practicing the opening with both 1,5 and 1,4 is good for the RH important  opening the piece. You have to question is 1,5 or 1,4 their choice. 4 has often greater reach and stability in comparison but its always a personal preference.

I don't think there really is a way to say, play this this and this then you can play this. It just doesnt work that way because the musical experience is always different for everyone. But i think to play these fancy Liszt pieces it would be good idea to play simpler Liszt pieces first, or practice the fancy piece in parts along side other simpler peices as your main study.

[super_ardua]

I can play the first half,  but the 4-5 trills are killing me!! I can't get them fast while playing the d# once every four notes using the same hand.

[super_ardua]

I find the first half easier to play at a fast tempo than a slower one,  because when you play it slowly you start thinking.