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Topic: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight  (Read 6389 times)

Offline beethovenopus2no3movt2

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chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
on: April 24, 2013, 04:14:06 PM
Chopin thought the first two bars were too much like Beethoven's masterwork the "Moonlight Sonata," therefore, he did not have it published. It was written in 1824 and one of his pupils published the work against the composer's wishes. It is now considered one of the greatest and most popular works among piano students for it's polyrhythm, which leads to a beautiful legato middle section. I guess he considered destroying the piece because he didn't want to be plagiarizing Beethoven. If you listen Beethoven measure 187, in the 3rd movement you will hear a similarity. Perhaps this was a goof on Chopin's part, which he realized late.  

Offline birba

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Re: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
Reply #1 on: April 24, 2013, 04:27:32 PM
You present it very well, but it's not news to most pianists.
(or correct me if i'm wrong out there?)

Offline pianist1976

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Re: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
Reply #2 on: April 25, 2013, 06:19:34 AM
It wasn't written in 1824 but in 1834. During many decades it was thought that Chopin didn't publish that work because he assumed it haden't a minimum quality standard (that led to several prejudices to the work, feeling it inferior to the other impromptus by interpreters like the great Cortot).

But the last investigations of Fantasie Impromptu led by renowned scholars such as Jan Ekier reveal that there are other probable reasons for Chopin not publishing it although he was probably proud of this work, that was his first impromptu (the tittle "fantasie" was probably added posthumously):
 
- Moscheles had published his Impromptu OP 89 the same year and it had a few design and rythmical similarities. Chopin may had been feared of being accused of plagiarism.
- Another hypothesis is that this work was private commissioned, which prevented it from being published.

Offline birba

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Re: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
Reply #3 on: April 25, 2013, 07:56:47 AM
I, too, had heard that fact about Moscheles.

Offline beethovenopus2no3movt2

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Re: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
Reply #4 on: April 25, 2013, 12:07:37 PM
Moscheles had published his Impromptu OP 89 the same year and it had a few design and rythmical similarities.

If you listen to opus 2 no 3 movt 2 you will hear Beethoven in the light Bach Well Tempered Clavier Book 1 Prelude 1. Again, this may not have been intended, or may have been a polite borrowing of an idea. I know Brahms politely borrowed from Beethoven. However, I don't think Chopin wanted his music to sound like anyones. He was too much of a romantic for that.

Offline pytheamateur

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Re: chpoin's fantasie impromptu sounds like moonlight
Reply #5 on: May 05, 2013, 08:20:49 AM
I, too, had heard that fact about Moscheles.

That Moscheles piece is not interesting, except perhaps only historicaally, when one hypothesises about the genesis of Chopin's great Fantasie-Impromptu.
Beethoven - Sonata in C sharp minor, Op 27 No 12
Chopin - Fantasie Impromptu, Nocturn in C sharp minor, Op post
Brahms - Op 118, Nos 2 & 3
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