Chopin Polonaise Op.53 'heroic' Help

[gblakesley]

Hi my name is george, and i live in the UK. At the moment i have been playing the piano for over 3 years and i am now in debate on what to play for my next concert! 3 months ago  my piano teacher's husband died and consequently my lessons have had to stop because of that. I was working on grade 5/6 when this happened but now i am working grade 8ish. In 3 months i have self taught myself Chopin's Nocturne Op.9 no.2 and Debussy's Clair de Lune. However i am now in the dilemma that there is a Year 9 Musical Performance evening Approching on the 20th of May. The reason of the dilemma is not because i am nervous of stagefright  but more nervous of what i am going to play. I am planning to play  Chopin's Polonaise 'Heroic' Op.53. If i were to accomplish it, it would be fantastic. However i am nervous that i will fail to meet the requirements that the peice needs. I have roughly 20+ days to learn this and i am playing for 3-4 hours a day. If need be i do have Clair de Lune as a backup, but i think i will feel as if i have failed if i do that. Tell me, is this a good idea?

[gblakesley]

Also i have large hands

[outin]

Learning the Heroic Polonaise in 20+ days and perform it?
You already jumped from grade 5/6 to grade 8ish in 3 months of self-teaching, so I'm sure you can do that. Especially with big hands...

I have no idea what a "year 9 musical performance evening" is though, is a quality performance expected or is it enough to just get through the piece somehow?

[ajspiano]

Also i have large hands

What you do with them is what counts.

If your octaves aren't already awesome this will be a very big push.

The heroic is not around grade 8, it is significantly above that, more likely to be listed under licentiate than associate even. Not saying you can't play it, just that you're not going to do it justice within that time frame.

..Speaking as someone who did attempt to learn this work at around your age, and with around 8 years of lessons behind me at the time, having recently completed a bunch of grade 8 works.

....

I rather think the raindrop prelude, op 28 no 15 would be far more approachable in the time frame and just as well known. Perhaps not as flashy as you are looking for though?

Grieg, Op 46 No 4 - In the hall of the mountain king.

^sets a cool mood, gets pretty exciting/dramatic..  not nearly as hard as the polonaise, but 98% of your peers won't have a clue anyway.

[chopin2015]

Nice! Unless you've already looked at the piece before anf tried it, I really doubt 20 days is enough time to get that sound you want. Now, if you already memorized it....maaaaybe. But you would be pushing it too close. Personally, I think the heroic polonaise is harder than any chopin I've tried! And...it seems long.

How bout fantasie impromoptu?

[gblakesley]

Technically i have been looking at this peice on youtube for the past 10  days before this post. Memorising as many notes as possible and listining to as many different interpretations as possible. It was only 2 days ago when i started dedicating my time to it though. At the moment i am 10% of the way to memorising it, however im more worried of the quality when i get to the actuall performance since i wont be working on a steinway (more of a crappy upright school piano actually). Also, a year nine performance evening is literally just for 13-14 year olds where they show off there drama/musical skills. Its just a casual concert

[chopin2015]

Technically i have been looking at this peice on youtube for the past 10  days before this post. Memorising as many notes as possible and listining to as many different interpretations as possible. It was only 2 days ago when i started dedicating my time to it though. At the moment i am 10% of the way to memorising it, however im more worried of the quality when i get to the actuall performance since i wont be working on a steinway (more of a crappy upright school piano actually). Also, a year nine performance evening is literally just for 13-14 year olds where they show off there drama/musical skills. Its just a casual concert

Yeah, keep working on it. But I recommend adding a backup piece. How bout a nocturne?

[gblakesley]

Yeah, keep working on it. But I recommend adding a backup piece. How bout a nocturne?

Yes that will be Clair de Lune

[chopin2015]

How bout op 10 no 3 etude?

[gblakesley]

How bout op 10 no 3 etude?

Nice tune, but i think its a little to sedate for me. I have had 3 months of practicing Op.9 no.2 and Clair de Lune so i think another peaceful type tune would drive me nuts lol. I want my 3 months of intensive hardcore self-taught piano training to end in a finale! Op.53? Hell yeah!

[louispodesta]

There is a smart way to approach repertoire for performances, and then there is the other way.  You are young, but that is still no excuse for doing something dumb, which would be to attempt the Polonaise.   It takes years to polish that piece up to standards.

Very many people play the Debussy, and most of them play it wrong.  My suggestion is that you listen to  as many recordings as you can of this great piece, and then knock em dead in performance.

Your audience will remember and respect your more for that than by getting up and making an ars out of yourself with the Chopin.

The goal after all is to make beautiful music, and not just impress people with a showy piece.

[gblakesley]

There is a smart way to approach repertoire for performances, and then there is the other way.  You are young, but that is still no excuse for doing something dumb, which would be to attempt the Polonaise.   It takes years to polish that piece up to standards.

Very many people play the Debussy, and most of them play it wrong.  My suggestion is that you listen to  as many recordings as you can of this great piece, and then knock em dead in performance.

Your audience will remember and respect your more for that than by getting up and making an ars out of yourself with the Chopin.

The goal after all is to make beautiful music, and not just impress people with a showy piece.

I do agree to your opinion in that i might make an arse out of myself by performing this peice but each to his own eh? Trust me, i have listined to plenty of recordings of this peice but the only way foward for me is to take a leap. Its the pressure that motivates me! The only real failure is if i didnt try at all. If i believe i could not try this peice in the alloted time then, i wouldnt even attempt it. If you believe that i am making a mistake, than tjats your opinion. However, in hindsight of the fact that its just a casual performance evening, i doubt even if i gave a top notch performance, i would not get as much of lusty applause as the parent's (in the audience) own children. I cant explain my reasoning behind just deciding to pick up and play this peice much more that my reasoning for playing a piano, as for all of us.

[louispodesta]

If we did not respect your opinion, and you do need to spell check your posts ahead of time, we would be doing more other productive things like practicing our own repertoire.

That said, I strongly suggest that you seek out any piano teacher, anywhere, and then run my logic and also yours by this person.

True pianism is not a quasi-gymnastics exercise.  To use a common British bastardization of the language, if that is what you "are all about," then there is no need for further discussion.

Otherwise, if you are in fact a musician, then please seek out the advice of another piano teacher regarding this matter.

Good luck to you.

[gblakesley]

Well, whether or not its a good idea. Im ploughing full ahead with it now so theres no point stopping me
Although after i have done the initial memorising i will post a video to my attempt of it and hopefully i will get some feedback on it. Or atleast thats what i hope to do. Either way its going to happen.
However would it be okay to post the video in this topic or would i have to create a seperate topic in the audition section?

[outin]

However would it be okay to post the video in this topic or would i have to create a seperate topic in the audition section?

It's ok to post here, especially when it's a work in early stages.

[gblakesley]

It's ok to post here, especially when it's a work in early stages.

Cheers, for clarifying. I dont think ill be doing a work in progress video everyday because that will drive everyone insane =) . But i think definatly to get some feedback across the board ill maybe do it once or twice. Hopefully once this post has passed through the unpopular stage i won't have to resurrect it from the dead.

[ajspiano]

Well, whether or not its a good idea. I'm ploughing full ahead with it now so theres no point stopping me

No one tried to stop you. You only asked for advice and received it. Your question suggests that your mind was not made up and that you were looking for advice on future course of action..

Given that all the advice in the thread is that 20 days is a push - the logical course of action is to play a different piece for the performance, and study the polonaise either now or in the future over a longer period..  If you don't what to take on the stance of everyone in the thread why ask the question to begin with?

Those that replied here are competent, and correct in their advice. If you perform the polonaise badly, it is likely that no one in your audience will know the difference but if there are decent musicians they will know, and they will be very unimpressed. By the same token, if you perform something a little easier (such as clair de lune) really well, again, most of your audience won't know the difference but any real musician will be know and you will earn their respect.

.....

This is not meant to discourage you from playing the polonaise, its just a reality check. Even most professionals would not be all that comfortable trying to tackle the heroic from scratch on a 20 day time line. Its not about whether or not you'll get through the notes, its about whether or not you can honestly produce a quality performance. A good pianist/musician isnt comfortable performing something "ok" - you should want to perform it in a way that you'll be proud of and will impress other experienced pianists.

[iancollett6]

You have been playing the piano for "over" 3 years. So this means, no more than 4 years. You have 20 days to prepare Heroic Polonaise for concert!
 I must say, you are destined for greatness if this is is a possiblity! But please, whatever the outcome of the concert, you must post a recording of your efforts.

[pianist1976]

Well, it may not be a good idea as in my humble opinion there's such a huge gap between the OP's last repertoire and the Polonaise he want to play. He may be a prodigy or not, I cannot judge that as long as I never listened him to play but even prodigies need instructions and a progressive learning.

But every person must commit his/her own errors. They say that success is made of a chain of failures, and they are many times necessary in order to learn and evolve. So, if you are convinced and you want to go ahead, just do it! It may be a nice experience whatever you success or not. Anyway, after this I would reflect about the next steps and would look for the advice of a competent teacher.

[gblakesley]

Well, it may not be a good idea as in my humble opinion there's such a huge gap between the OP's last repertoire and the Polonaise he want to play. He may be a prodigy or not, I cannot judge that as long as I never listened him to play but even prodigies need instructions and a progressive learning.

But every person must commit his/her own errors. They say that success is made of a chain of failures, and they are many times necessary in order to learn and evolve. So, if you are convinced and you want to go ahead, just do it! It may be a nice experience whatever you success or not. Anyway, after this I would reflect about the next steps and would look for the advice of a competent teacher.

I apologise if i seemed curt in the previous posts, i think its just me trying to steel myself for something like this. I also fully respect your advice and everyone who has stated there opinion. However, I think at this point in time it is definatly a good idea to have a reality check (thank you for posting a reality check above). I admit, it will probably be no Rafel Blechacz but ill give it my all, good or bad. Also am already seeking professional help however i have not done so yet since it is difficult finding someone in the area. At the moment though, I have no idea if its going good, or bad. But hopefully after i memorised as much as i can I will post a video of my progress which should clarify the origi al question; is this a good idea? If it is not, than it is has still been a worthwhile experiance. As Nike put it 'Just do it'

[gblakesley]

At the moment i have been making good progress with the peice (in my opinion) and am preparing myself for the performance. However I am having some difficulty managing some parts in the peice. When i try and look at  professionals do it, its a little to fast for me to see. One problem is when the main melody kicks in (the octavies not the melody after the beginning). I am having trouble with some of the repeated notes and they see slighty to fast for me to grasp. Granted my Piano keys are heavy, but this stil bother me. Any tips?

P.S I have changed the name of the topic from 'Is this a good idea' to 'Chopin Polonaise Op.53 'heroic''

[whiteboyfunk]

I would not recommend attempting to perform either Chopin's Heroic Polonaise or Fantasie Impromptu as was advised by another member here. They are both tough pieces to perform up to par, in public and most importantly similarly to how the audience has likely heard these very popular pieces in the past. I think a professional performance of them takes more than 20 days to accomplish. If you're able to do this though, more power to you!

I would take another route and select something that you can be very expressive with that is somewhat simpler, maybe something you've learned in the past, where you can really polish it and make it yours. This has already been relayed in this thread, however, so I doubt you will take heed. Best of luck to you.

[virtuoso80]

If you must do a Polonaise, why not Op.40, No.1 first? Less to learn, and still exciting.

[johnmar78]

Hey Gblank, I played this piece 4 years ago and its on the Youtube. Being an amateur player, it took me 6 weeks- 3 hours a day to do a decent my recordings. Bare in mind, if you think you can do it wthin in such short time, how about show us some of your pre-recordings /inprocess on op53 and we can start from there. Is 20 days already gone???

From experience, I reckon if you can achieve 70% of professional speed it would be VERY good already. Otherwise, step back to slower controlled tempo.

[jeffkonkol]

Military Polonaise is a MUCH better choice. 

If you have made up your mind, you've made up your mind and there is nothing to be done about.... but in a good faith effort to maybe help you see a different perspective.... go to the middle section of the heroic with the fun little left hand octaves. (affectionately referenced as the coffee grinder)  Now practice it a few times in a row without resting in between.  You may very well have the octave technique to do this section correctly, switching your muscle groups frequently, relaxing, and not oxygen starving your hands due to wrist tension....or you may be trying to muscle through it... playing it a few times in a row without a rest will show you that.... but if you are muscling through the section it will be worse in the competition when you have nerves, and you will deplete whatever energy you have leading to a weak ended at best.

The heroic is very well known.  I disagree with earlier comments that the audience wont recognize a mistake... I think with this piece every mistake will be obvious....

good luck with whatever you decide to perform :-)