Liszt B minor Sonata

[gvans]

I found this VHS tape from a concert I gave some years ago (decades ago would be more accurate but that sounds reeeeally bad), transferred it to .mp4, and put it up on you-tube. I've been thinking about resurrecting the work and playing it again, partly to see if my memory still works, partly to see if my fingers can still do it justice.

Any thoughts out there on this deep issue?

It's not a short piece you might play at a dinner party. No, the B minor is strictly 2nd-half concert material.

The twenty-year old Johannes Brahms, visiting Liszt at Weimar, fell asleep during the maestro's performance of the work. Perhaps Brahms had a bit too much wine or beer at dinner. Perhaps he'd been traveling too much with Joachim. Perhaps he just didn't care for it.

Me, I rather like it. I think it's one of Liszt's best.

[chopin2015]

I like this too. But, a new recording would allow for more dynamic range! If not, then atleast you have this!

J

[gvans]

That's a good reason to give it another crack.

[chopin2015]

Do you perform in public? You could do a double agenda and get it up to "speed" again so u can record it and maybe a couple other piecesvfor a recital? 

[gvans]

Yes, I play out frequently (well, three, four times a year)...usually chamber works, but recently a full recital (Beethoven Op. 26, Chopin Op. 29/ 53, Liszt Un Sospiro, Debussy Estampes).
I'm planning another program. Sometimes it's harder to resurrect a piece you played years ago than to start fresh...sometimes not.

I'm curious if you or anyone at PS has strong feelings on the matter.

[chopin2015]

Sure, I dislike resurrecting pieces, but only if you can't remember it at all. If here and there you are forgetting notes and hand movements but kindofbremember the piece, take a good 3 weeks to start all over. Play from memory all the way through as much as you can first, then go back to the book and from the beginning look it over good. Don't rip through the technical parts for a while and literally do slow, hs practice (just to warm up, though!). What's cool about doing that here is that it is fun because you already know the piece so practice goes fast!

[gvans]

Ah, to be 21 again (and with a young brain)! I can read through the piece and remember bits and pieces, but after 30 years, it's pretty much like relearning the entire thing. Still, it's a classic work, and the sound and video on the ancient recording are suboptimal. My video guy (now deceased) was experimenting with the zoom a bit much.

Funny thing about the Liszt sonata...after the concert in the vid, I was hired to play at this big medical function. I think they wanted Mozart. I played the Liszt, and pissed everyone off. I kept thinking how it put Brahms to sleep.

"Can't you play something nice and quiet?"

[perprocrastinate]

Funny thing about the Liszt sonata...after the concert in the vid, I was hired to play at this big medical function. I think they wanted Mozart. I played the Liszt, and pissed everyone off. I kept thinking how it put Brahms to sleep.

"Can't you play something nice and quiet?"

Hehe, they don't know how privileged you are to be able to play Liszt's Sonata!

[rachfan]

Hi gvans,

A marvelous performance by your younger self! Although it was a long while ago, I salute you on your playing.  I very much enjoyed it.  

I can read through the piece and remember bits and pieces, but after 30 years, it's pretty much like relearning the entire thing.

Indeed.  Many of my analog recordings from the mid-1980s of Rachmaninoff's pieces are in the archives here at Piano Street.  I've never been a "full circle" person, meaning that once I learn and record a piece, I put it away... forever.  But I did want to digitally redo at least some of these Rachmaninoff preludes and am in the process now.  My first discovery: Relearning music is just as hard as learning it the first time, as you suggested above!  To complicate that, I find that, not surprisingly, my concepts of the music have changed in some ways too.  So I have to discover new ways to project that to the listeners.  I believe that if you were to relearn the Liszt Sonata, you'd unavoidably have your moments of frustration in the relearning process.  But once you have it in your mind and fingers, you will have regained a treasure.

Thanks for sharing your youthful rendition of the sonata.

David

 

[le_poete_mourant]

Well if you start to relearn this piece, make sure you get the rhythm right at the beginning.  After the G octaves the next measure starts with a quarter note rest and then a quarter note, but your younger self distorts the rhythm and it sounds more like a half note. Maybe this is by design, but it doesn't work and it's not very true to the intent of the piece.  Also, a lot of your descending triplets (like the one at the beginning of the section immediately following the D major Grandioso) are distorted, with the 1st eighth of the triplet group almost twice as long as the others... Again, maybe a "style" decision, but it comes cross as either careless or tasteless.  Bottom line, this is one of those pieces that you can't bullshit around with...  I know it's Liszt, but I think you're on to something when you say that it's one of his greatest works. It's a very serious work and I'd approach it, in a re-learning, with the same seriousness as we afford Beethoven sonatas... Don't let yourself slide on the details and try not to fall into some of those older habits. The bad habits are the biggest traps to avoid.  


When you get to the first "crucifixus" section -- the C# minor Pesante -- and then it's F minor counterpart.  This needs much more gravity and angst. You sort of flippantly passed through it.  It's agony!!

When Liszt writes Recitativo, treat that like opera.  I watched your video of Un Sospiro from this year and you definitely have that ability and sound -- I think when you go back to the Sonata that will only add to your interpretation.

I admire your ability to keep your piano chops while having your other life stuff going on (sorry, I googled you... )

[gvans]

Merci, rachfan, and le_poete_mourant, for your comments. Yes, to relearn it will be some work. But, as le_poete says, the tempo liberties on this youthful recording are pretty bad. The list of things I would play differently is epic. I think I might relearn it, especially now that I've bought a decent Urtext. And I agree, one should approach the piece with gravity and respect -- after all, Liszt only wrote one sonata. But what a sonata it is!

P.S. le_poete: Google all you wish.

[le_poete_mourant]

Merci, rachfan, and le_poete_mourant, for your comments. Yes, to relearn it will be some work. But, as le_poete says, the tempo liberties on this youthful recording are pretty bad. The list of things I would play differently is epic. I think I might relearn it, especially now that I've bought a decent Urtext. And I agree, one should approach the piece with gravity and respect -- after all, Liszt only wrote one sonata. But what a sonata it is!

P.S. le_poete: Google all you wish.

Work, yes, but the greatest work there is!  I do appreciate you sharing this video -- it was interesting for me to watch as it also got me wondering what I will look back on and see in twenty years from now or what have you.....  It would be very cool if you could post another video when you've relearned it, for us to see how you & the piece have grown over the span of time.

[gvans]

OK, I'll post it. It may take a while. I get in only one serious week of practice a month, and I've got two chamber groups that keep me busy. Plus writing fiction. Plus surfing.

By the way, Benjamin, have you played any of the Liszt orchestral works (PC #1, Totentanz, etc.)? If you perform any of them half as well as you played that Beethoven 3rd PC in the competition (a crystal-clear, brilliant, and creative rendition), I would sure love to hear it!

[emill]

Hi!!!

Personally, I feel this is a convincing performance .... Bravo!!!.

And you can say that AGAIN ... "Ah, to be 21 again (and with a young brain)!"  hehhee .... I seem to be forgetting everything and would like to be 21 again ... even 31 or 41!!!!

My son loves Lizst and I sometimes hear him play parts of this, but has not
formally decided to tackle it.  I hope he does soon.