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Topic: Fur Elise 2nd theme  (Read 3047 times)

Offline ranniks

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Fur Elise 2nd theme
on: June 03, 2013, 09:25:14 PM
So how is it sounding? What should I watch for when practising it?

Offline danielespinosa

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #1 on: June 03, 2013, 10:17:17 PM
there are lots of mistakes  ::) you are speeding and slowing  at certain points, you have to keep the same tempo. also you are making staccato at some points that dont have to be there, it should sound smoother.

Practice it slow, in forte, very articulated. When you have very secure withouth any mistakes, play it piano, and more legato. Then it should be ok  :)

Offline j_menz

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #2 on: June 04, 2013, 12:15:20 AM
Slow it down (quite a bit for the moment) and count;)

"What the world needs is more geniuses with humility. There are so few of us left" -- Oscar Levant

Offline ranniks

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #3 on: June 04, 2013, 07:09:19 AM
there are lots of mistakes  ::) you are speeding and slowing  at certain points, you have to keep the same tempo. also you are making staccato at some points that dont have to be there, it should sound smoother.

Practice it slow, in forte, very articulated. When you have very secure withouth any mistakes, play it piano, and more legato. Then it should be ok  :)

Alright. To be honest with you I have no idea what you mean with forte and piano, but I assume from previous experience that it is just a playing style like legato.

Thanks for the input, I'll see what I can do!

Slow it down (quite a bit for the moment) and count;)

Will do. I'm not exactly sure how to count this piece though. This is in 3/8 time I believe. How do you even count that? I was taught by an online video that 4/4 meant 4 beats in a period of 4, so doesn't 3/8 mean half/quarters beats in an 8 time? Or is it just 3 beats in a period of 8?

Hmm, needs a lot of work! :)

Offline hfmadopter

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #4 on: June 04, 2013, 08:54:47 AM

Hmm, needs a lot of work! :)


Yes.

 Where is your teacher at these days ? He shouldn't be letting any of this pass by.
Depressing the pedal on an out of tune acoustic piano and playing does not result in tonal color control or add interest, it's called obnoxious.

Offline ranniks

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #5 on: June 04, 2013, 01:11:46 PM
Yes.

 Where is your teacher at these days ? He shouldn't be letting any of this pass by.

We're not practising this piece to be honest. We're going over a blues piece and the easy version of the moonlight sonata. And of course chords chords chords and more chords, hehe. But they do help though!

I'll see it through with my teacher tomorrow and hopefully I can get this piece nice and steady.

The third theme on the other hand is just long memorisation *gah*.

Offline j_menz

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #6 on: June 04, 2013, 11:37:05 PM
This is in 3/8 time I believe. How do you even count that? I was taught by an online video that 4/4 meant 4 beats in a period of 4, so doesn't 3/8 mean half/quarters beats in an 8 time? Or is it just 3 beats in a period of 8?

3/8 is simple triple metre, so it's "One and Two and Three and" for the six semiquavers in a bar.

Most x/8 are compound metre (counted in groups of three per beat), but this one isn't - it's in groups of two.
"What the world needs is more geniuses with humility. There are so few of us left" -- Oscar Levant

Offline tdawe

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #7 on: June 05, 2013, 03:18:16 PM
Alright. To be honest with you I have no idea what you mean with forte and piano, but I assume from previous experience that it is just a playing style like legato.

Thanks for the input, I'll see what I can do!

Will do. I'm not exactly sure how to count this piece though. This is in 3/8 time I believe. How do you even count that? I was taught by an online video that 4/4 meant 4 beats in a period of 4, so doesn't 3/8 mean half/quarters beats in an 8 time? Or is it just 3 beats in a period of 8?

Hmm, needs a lot of work! :)



Forte and piano are dynamic markings. Forte is italian for loud and piano is italian for quiet. Hence the full name of the instrument, pianoforte, emphasizing the range of dynamics it can produce. They will be symbolized on the page as a stylized "f" or "p". Other common dynamic markings you may encounter are pianissimo (the most quiet, pp), fortissimo (the loudest, ff) and sforzando (sf, suddenly loud), mezzo forte/piano (moderately loud/quiet, mf/mp). Many composers will use extra letters for emphasis, triple p or triple f is not uncommon.
Musicology student & amateur pianist
Currently focusing on:
Shostakovich Op.87, Chopin Op.37, Misc. Bartok

Offline ranniks

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #8 on: June 09, 2013, 03:12:50 PM
Today I made a new recording with your suggestions (still havn't gone through with it with me teacher, although, he said it was decent a few months back when I had practised it somewhat longer than usual). I havn't applied the piano/forte/legato etc because I'm not exactly sure how to.

Is it better than the previous recording?

Offline magic_sonata

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #9 on: June 09, 2013, 04:32:15 PM
First off, you need to know what the terms mean. Then, you can apply them.

Piano, (written as a 'p') is a dynamic marking indicating for you to play quietly.

Forte, (written as an 'f') is a dynamic marking indicating for you to play loudly.

Legato is a musical style, telling you NOT to separate notes but play them smoothly, or in other words, together.

When there is an 'm' in front of any dynamic marking, it means 'mezzo'. For example, 'mezzo piano' would be to play sort of soft, but almost loud.
magic_sonata

Offline hfmadopter

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #10 on: June 09, 2013, 04:41:29 PM
Today I made a new recording with your suggestions (still havn't gone through with it with me teacher, although, he said it was decent a few months back when I had practised it somewhat longer than usual). I havn't applied the piano/forte/legato etc because I'm not exactly sure how to.

Is it better than the previous recording?

Listen, we said slow it down and get it even. Sometimes folks here have asked how slow should one go to get something into their hands. I have replied as slow as it takes to do it correctly, my teacher sometime made that excruciatingly slow. Here is an example of what I mean by that, again if need be sometimes ( not me playing incidentally) :


what you have done is somewhat better but not good enough. The accents are totally off for one thing. But don't let that discourage you, I don't mean it to be harsh but to keep working at it.

Slow but recognizable :
Depressing the pedal on an out of tune acoustic piano and playing does not result in tonal color control or add interest, it's called obnoxious.

Offline ranniks

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #11 on: June 09, 2013, 05:09:17 PM
First off, you need to know what the terms mean. Then, you can apply them.

Piano, (written as a 'p') is a dynamic marking indicating for you to play quietly.

Forte, (written as an 'f') is a dynamic marking indicating for you to play loudly.

Legato is a musical style, telling you NOT to separate notes but play them smoothly, or in other words, together.

When there is an 'm' in front of any dynamic marking, it means 'mezzo'. For example, 'mezzo piano' would be to play sort of soft, but almost loud.

Ahhh. Hmmmm. I'll go back to the drawing board with this.

Listen, we said slow it down and get it even. Sometimes folks here have asked how slow should one go to get something into their hands. I have replied as slow as it takes to do it correctly, my teacher sometime made that excruciatingly slow. Here is an example of what I mean by that, again if need be sometimes ( not me playing incidentally) :


what you have done is somewhat better but not good enough. The accents are totally off for one thing. But don't let that discourage you, I don't mean it to be harsh but to keep working at it.

Slow but recognizable :


I'll try David. And those are really slow 0.0. But I'll try a few times on that tempo, thanks!

Offline hfmadopter

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #12 on: June 09, 2013, 05:29:43 PM

I'll try David. And those are really slow 0.0. But I'll try a few times on that tempo, thanks!

Yes slow to get it into your hands then pick it up. You should not be at this really long. When you pick the tempo up you should feel more confident with it.
Depressing the pedal on an out of tune acoustic piano and playing does not result in tonal color control or add interest, it's called obnoxious.

Offline outin

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Re: Fur Elise 2nd theme
Reply #13 on: June 09, 2013, 06:23:31 PM
Ranniks,
I think you should make it a habit of always making sure you can count and understand the rhythm on each indidual measure before trying to play a whole section. It's easier than trying to correct it after you can "kind of play" it through. Because then you have already practiced it the wrong way quite a few times.

For me it's quicker to get the rhythm correct for each hand if I play individual measures HT first. But if that's too difficult then you just have to count. And do that before you do anything else with the piece.
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