Beethoven Symphony 9 Liszt Transcription

[waltersm96]

On the 2nd movement of Liszt's transcription of Beethoven's 9th Symphony, there is a G-D-G-Bb chord in the left hand 5 measures after rehearsal A (the fortissimo part). I can reach G-D-Bb very easily, but adding the octave G makes me unable to do so. Is there some way to play it that I am not seeing?

If not, would it be better to break the chord or just play G-D-Bb or to play D-G-Bb ?

Thanks for any help 

[j_menz]

You roll it. Frankly, if you didn't already know that are you sure you should be trying to play this piece?

[waltersm96]

I figured that I should roll it, that's how I've been practicing and that's how I learned to play stuff that I couldn't reach. This is just the first piece I've ever been physically unable to play as written and I asked my former teacher (unfortunately I'm out of lessons right now) who said that he would play the top Gm chord without the G in the lower octave.

Thank you for responding. It's appreciated.

[nyiregyhazi]

You roll it. Frankly, if you didn't already know that are you sure you should be trying to play this piece?

not necessarily. a better alternative could possibly be to play the bass alone and then the rest of the chord in one. this way you fake the togetherness of a blocked chord- as if its just one sound. I'm equally bemused though. I have no idea how anyone could seriously have reached the level to attempt such a transcription while having to ask what to do if you can't reach a chord.

[thalbergmad]

a better alternative could possibly be to play the bass alone and then the rest of the chord in one.

My teacher used to insist on this approach with large chords. I thought he was crazy, but with some dedication it does give a preferable sound, although to envisage it without a piano, it seems daft.

We seem to be plagued with simple questions about extremely challenging works of late.

Thal

[indianajo]

not necessarily. a better alternative could possibly be to play the bass alone and then the rest  I'm equally bemused though. I have no idea how anyone could seriously have reached the level to attempt such a transcription while having to ask what to do if you can't reach a chord.

You're not very bold.  I'm practicing stuff years past what my teacher had me doing 45 years ago.  Are you afraid to practice without a guide?  
I think rolling chords on pieces that orchestras play all together sounds bad.  I'm practicing Pictures at an Exhibition, and the Chicago Symphony under Fritz Reiner doesn't roll chords. So I don't. Some chords I put an interior note in instead of the long reach one. Some chords I play the low note with my foot. I'm not Russian, I don't have that kind of reach, but that doesn't mean I have to play the native six hole wood flute.  

[nyiregyhazi]

You're not very bold.  I'm practicing stuff years past what my teacher had me doing 45 years ago.  Are you afraid to practice without a guide?  
I think rolling chords on pieces that orchestras play all together sounds bad.  I'm practicing Pictures at an Exhibition, and the Chicago Symphony under Fritz Reiner doesn't roll chords. So I don't. Some chords I put an interior note in instead of the long reach one. Some chords I play the low note with my foot. I'm not Russian, I don't have that kind of reach, but that doesn't mean I have to play the native six hole wood flute.  

I said nothing about being brave enough to try to things without a teacher. virtually every piece I've learned was done almost entirely independently of teachers. Rather, I said that if someone doesn't know for themself how to deal with a chord that cannot be stretched, they're unlikely to be experienced enough for such a difficult work- either with or without guidance from a teacher. How can you possibly be up to such a challenge without having experienced such a bog standard pianistic issue?


I'm not altogether opposed to rewriting of textures, but given that Rachmaninoff saw fit to play the bass note separately in the opening of the second concerto (with the upper notes as blocked chords), I certainly wouldn't be defaulting to rewrites before even contemplating a means of executing every note. it may not always be the best answer, but sometimes you can emulate the swell of an orchestra even better with an anticipated bass followed by a blocked chord. Many great players of the past actively contributed to their style of "orchestral" sound via the gesture. I often use it for simple bass octaves, where stretch is no issue. although spreading every note one by one is often too weak and notey for a full texture, a bass followed by the block chord is often even more orchestral than an single attack.

[j_menz]

I'm practicing Pictures at an Exhibition, and the Chicago Symphony under Fritz Reiner doesn't roll chords. So I don't. 

Might I point out that Pictures at an Exhibition is a piano piece that was transcribed for orchestra, the reverse process of the Beethoven in question.

I should apologise. I tend to call the blocked chord approach a roll as well as the normal arpeggiated roll. The effect is rather different, and I should have been clearer.