Here's Some Advice for Beginning Students

[chauchalink]

I have lurked these forums for a bit but I am new here, forgive me if this post doesn't follow normal posting etiquette.

I noticed that this forum "Student's Corner" has a lot of people asking questions, but few threads with general advice and answers.  I am not expert at piano but I think I can give some advice that I haven't read else where (or perhaps advice that I have read else where that I feel should be emphasized.

Disclaimer: I have only been playing piano for 2 years, I have taken classes at my school for these 2 years.  I am by no means an expert. 

Tips and Advice:
If given the option to choose a piece, choose one you WANT to learn.  This will make some long practice sessions a lot more fun. 

Don't zone in on one part of a piece for hours and hour at a time, after a certain point it just becomes inefficient.  Instead take breaks, work on other parts of the piece, or on other pieces.

Pay attention to the sound that you are making, you should know how your piece is supposed to sound, try to play your piece beautifully in your head while you are playing it.

Keep your back straight, when playing difficult chords [for me at least], a straight back is crucial to get your fingers in optimal position, stops your hands from falling asleep, and allows blood to travel better so you get less sore.  [i was playing with my back bent for hours and noticed after making the switch to a straight back only after an hour or so that my hands felt significantly less tired]

Don't be discouraged if you have to play 1 measure over and over, with only one hand and you still can't get it right.  The more you practice now the less sloppy it will be than if you rush it.  And an accurate but slow performance is better than a quick but sloppy one.

Don't keep making the same mistake over and over and expect it to work itself out later.  This tends to develop bad habits and makes things harder to fix when you're used to playing something wrong.  Fix your mistakes right away and practice SLOWLY.

Playing a piece well has multiple aspects to it.  Proper speed, perfect note accuracy, and proper dynamics.  Don't forget to listen to yourself as you play, have an idea of the sound you want to make.  If you can play a piece well you shouldn't be worried about where your hands go next AT ALL.  When I play a piece, that I've practiced and memorized, I try to meditate and match my emotions to the notes.  It sounds cheesy, but I think  this is the difference between playing all the notes of a piece in time and playing and actual song.



These are just the first few tips that came to my head.  They aren't that original but hopefully this puts a few pieces of good advice in a single area and is a bit more specific than in other areas you may have read the same or similar advice.  Please post any other advice, and criticism!  Especially criticism, I don't want to tell people to do the wrong thing!

[lorcar]

Don't be discouraged if you have to play 1 measure over and over, with only one hand and you still can't get it right.  The more you practice now the less sloppy it will be than if you rush it.  

i have been studying for less than a year now, and I am finding all this "repeat til it's good" tiring to say the least, and monkey-like. Repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat, and again.... cool, isn't? I am struggling to see how this is close to what I had in mind when I started to study piano again after a 25+year hiatus. Also, I dont feel I am learning how to play piano, but I am just learning those pieces I study. I someone asked me if I now how to play i'd definitely say "no". The other day a friend asked me to play in a playful and fun way, both of us. He's pretty good and natural talent, doesnt need any score, and he knew I started taking lessons, so maybe he thought i'd be able to play with him.
Pardon this rant but I am spending so much energy and time on the keyboard that I am wondering if it's worth it, if I should quit, or just switch to some jazz lessons in order to play without score.

[h_chopin148]

i have been studying for less than a year now, and I am finding all this "repeat til it's good" tiring to say the least, and monkey-like. Repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat repeat, and again.... cool, isn't? I am struggling to see how this is close to what I had in mind when I started to study piano again after a 25+year hiatus. Also, I dont feel I am learning how to play piano, but I am just learning those pieces I study. I someone asked me if I now how to play i'd definitely say "no". The other day a friend asked me to play in a playful and fun way, both of us. He's pretty good and natural talent, doesnt need any score, and he knew I started taking lessons, so maybe he thought i'd be able to play with him.
Pardon this rant but I am spending so much energy and time on the keyboard that I am wondering if it's worth it, if I should quit, or just switch to some jazz lessons in order to play without score.

Just repeat repeat repeat doesn't work. You have to use different techniques. For example use a metronome, start slow half speed or slower then once u play it well at that speed go up a click or two if u have an analog metronome or 3-5 beats if u have a digital metronome keep on repeating this until you have reach a bit above your desired tempo. This way, you know that if you can play at a bit above your performance tempo, if and when you actually have to perform it you know that you will be able to play it well at performance tempo.  Another method is using rhythms to in places that have runs, play a run that you find difficult with different rhythms, then you'll find that if you can play it well with rhythms after wards you will be able to play it normally with no problem. 
Also, do you have a teacher? You could ask them about different practicing techniques. You can also look around on the forum for different practice routines that could make your practice more enjoyable. But, don't give up.  You could also always do both classical and jazz. I myself have been learning classical piano for 7 years and I also have been playing piano for my school jazz band for a few years now.  I find that the jazz really helps my piano too, especially with theory. You'll be able to learn a lot about improv, chords and rhythms.
I hope this helps you.

[lojay]

Also, I dont feel I am learning how to play piano, but I am just learning those pieces I study.

I'm not saying your situation may be like mine, but most teachers I've taken lessons with either can only teach certain types of students or can't teach at all.  I've studied with really talented pianists that would have been really good for a super determined student who had tons of time to practice, but wouldn't be good for the working adult student.  One such teacher-pianist seriously told me that she expected me to practice at least 5 hours a day (I barely practiced 5 hours a week at the time).  Maybe your teacher is not suitable for you?

Also, are you not learning how to read music?  Are you not learning new techniques through your pieces?  Is your teacher assigning ear training?

I someone asked me if I now how to play i'd definitely say "no". The other day a friend asked me to play in a playful and fun way, both of us. He's pretty good and natural talent, doesnt need any score, and he knew I started taking lessons, so maybe he thought i'd be able to play with him.

How long has your friend played?  If he has played since he was young, he probably forgot or doesn't know how hard it is to learn the piano.  Very few people can take a year of lessons and improvise at a high level (this not only takes good technique but also requires a practical knowledge of theory and a good ear amongst other things I can't think of).

Pardon this rant but I am spending so much energy and time on the keyboard that I am wondering if it's worth it, if I should quit, or just switch to some jazz lessons in order to play without score.

If you think you're spending a lot of energy and time, I promise you that there is someone else in the world that's doing more and improving less (hopefully...haha...)

Whether you're taking jazz lessons or whatever lessons you're taking (I'm going to assume classical), you're still going to have to develop technique, learn theory, and train your ear. 

Also, depending on what you want to do with Jazz, you may still have to learn from a score.  If I were you I'd take jazz lessons in addition to whatever you're doing now.

[outin]

i have been studying for less than a year now, and I am finding all this "repeat til it's good" tiring to say the least,

Then don't do it like that. Only repeat when you feel you need to and always do brain work also, not just mindless finger drilling. You should evaluate before repeating. Which is sometimes hard to do, but that's how you improve.

It's good to understand that if you repeat something the same way, it won't get better. It will be just the same. So always THINK what you are doing. If you can't figure out HOW to make it better, ask your teacher.

Practicing like this is harder work for the brain, but it's never boring. And you'll get addicted to those little moments of success when you actually figure out how to do something

[lorcar]

Also, do you have a teacher?

You can also look around on the forum for different practice routines that could make your practice more enjoyable.

thanks a lot

I had a teacher from october to june, now it's summer vacation, i'll have a new teacher in september.

When I looked around the forum for some "method", it seemed to me that the consensus here is toward  the decomposition of a score in smaller sections and groups of bars (the Bernhard method if I dont fail). So the method suggested would be: HS slow for small pieces, the speed up, join hands, repeat 7 times in a row, then go to the next small section and start again.

[lorcar]

Also, are you not learning how to read music?  Are you not learning new techniques through your pieces?  Is your teacher assigning ear training?


Whether you're taking jazz lessons or whatever lessons you're taking (I'm going to assume classical), you're still going to have to develop technique, learn theory, and train your ear. 

Also, depending on what you want to do with Jazz, you may still have to learn from a score.  If I were you I'd take jazz lessons in addition to whatever you're doing now.

thanks
for sure I am learning every time I study. But I dont feel I learn HOW TO PLAY. I feel I am learning THAT SPECIFIC PIECE I AM STUDYING.
Also, i feel weird the way the memory works. I might be able to play without score the pieces I am studying, but it's just mechanical memory, if you ever asked me to "sing" the piece spelling the right notes I wouldnt be able to do it

[lorcar]

always do brain work also

You should evaluate before repeating.

So always THINK what you are doing.

thanks
what you wrote it makes sense, but I have no idea what it does mean in practice. Any example?
what is the brain work if my little finger slips down during wide jumps from chord to chord or my pedaling s***s?
I'd really appreciate any practical example of what you mean

[emill]

I feel awkward trying to answer your question, but let me just tell you about my experience with my son.

I would often see him bring his pieces to school where there is no piano and as often too I would see him spend 1-2 hours or even more in the evenings reading the pieces while in bed.  Similar to reading a book as one awaits sleepiness .... only difference is he does not sleep until he puts the pieces aside.

Got curious and asked him what he was doing .... he says "mental practice".  And what exactly is that? he says, he plays the pieces in his mind ... practices the LH ... the RH .... the pedaling and all together in his mind. He also does the tempo .... very slowly at first, then picking up as he gets more familiar with the piece ..... also with the phrasing.  In other words he does what he wants to do like in the piano ... but only without the piano. 

Seems complicated to me, but it seems to work well with him. He seems to learn faster than many other in his age group.  Whether this actually helps, I do not really know, but he does almost all the complicated pieces he plays with a lot of "mental practice".  IN fact in some pieces, he spends almost 50% of his time in "mental practice".

Good luck to you.

[hfmadopter]

thanks
for sure I am learning every time I study. But I dont feel I learn HOW TO PLAY. I feel I am learning THAT SPECIFIC PIECE I AM STUDYING.
Also, i feel weird the way the memory works. I might be able to play without score the pieces I am studying, but it's just mechanical memory, if you ever asked me to "sing" the piece spelling the right notes I wouldnt be able to do it

Adult students often are impatient and all the more so in today's world where all our digital gizmos give instant results. What happens as you learn a new piece of music is you also learn some new form of technique. As technique builds over " the years" you one day find that have the tools to work with to play pieces from a past level or a level that you have long since passed and do so with ease on pieces you haven't played before. On and on it goes over "the years".

If you want to play by ear then one way to learn is to take a course that addresses this form of playing. You won't get that from standard methods of piano course or teaching. How To Play The Piano In Spite Of Years Of Lessons touches on it towards the end of the course for instance. One summer I took a course like this/similar to, at around year 5 or 6 of taking standard lesson. Much easier to do if you have some structured background in piano and music. In fact the instructor only taught the course if you had sufficient background. It was fun and interesting, I'd like to take a refresher now some 25 years later ! I use the techniques learned in that course all the time in pop music FWIW.

[lorcar]

  How To Play The Piano In Spite Of Years Of Lessons 

thanks
i didnt know this book, and it seems one reviewer on Amazon thinks exactly what I had in mind

("This book has changed my life! I struggled at the piano forever until I discovered this wonderful book! While it clearly will not be for everyone wanting to learn piano, it was perfect for me. As a youth, I hated piano lessons because of the mechanical approach to learning songs that I didn't even like. I felt like I was a human playback machine. Know what I mean? Whereas, it seemed my guitar-playing friends were having all the fun. When they wanted to learn a new song, they would just start asking what the chords were. Then, they would just practice playing the chord progression at home. Later, when they got really comfortable with that, they would start getting really creative, adding interesting little frills and things and MAKING A LOT OF COOL MUSIC knowing, really, just a little bit of actual information about the song + having musical ideas of their own. So, how come piano lessons were always so different? You don't have to be jealous of your guitar-playing friends anymore. This is the book my friend's guitar teacher would have written, if he played piano. ")

in general, I feel traditional piano lessons dont teach  harmony/theory, which in my opinion is needed if you want to start to improvise or reproduce any music you have in mind. Any other book suggestion is highly appreciated

[bronnestam]

thanks
what you wrote it makes sense, but I have no idea what it does mean in practice. Any example?
what is the brain work if my little finger slips down during wide jumps from chord to chord or my pedaling s***s?
I'd really appreciate any practical example of what you mean

It is your brain work from beginning to end, unless you think your limbs are controlled by someone alien force.

Let's say you constantly, or very often, make a mistake when you play a certain bar. Often - at least for me - we don't consciously analyze exactly WHAT this mistake is, we just notice that oops, wrong again, and then we repeat the whole thing and hope for better luck this time. If we are slightly more ambitious we slow down a lot, and we may, or may not, avoid that mistake. But that is not analyzing.

Analyzing is this: you observe yourself very, very carefully while you play, to pinpoint your mistake. Perhaps you happen to play an F where it should be G while doing a downrun, because it is more familiar and "comfortable" to stretch for that F.
Then you think of how this should be corrected in the best way. Maybe you need to change the fingering, maybe you need to twist your hand a bit more, maybe you just need to repeat the note before + that G several times until it starts to feel natural. Or you can try to play legato if the score says staccato, repeat every keystrike three times, or whatever you might come up with for practising. (Or try this, which is very effective: make a deliberate stop right before that G, put your finger right above the G key, and then keep on playing. Do this a couple of times, with shorter and shorter stops.)

THEN, when you have figured out a possible "solution", you play.

There was a time when I used to lose my temper when I had made the same mistake for the 124th time. I played that faulty F, stopped, angrily hit the G a couple of times: THIS is the key. THIS! THIS! THIS! and then I kept on playing (or left the piano in rage). This was not an effective way to correct a mistake, I can tell ...

[outin]

thanks
what you wrote it makes sense, but I have no idea what it does mean in practice. Any example?
what is the brain work if my little finger slips down during wide jumps from chord to chord or my pedaling s***s?
I'd really appreciate any practical example of what you mean

In a case of finger missing the key, you can think of: Am I trying to play too fast, should I slow down? Am I moving in a way that compromises accuracy? Is the fingering good or should I rethink it? Do I take the time to find the keys after the jump before pushing into the keys?

Pedalling: How did I do it? Did it sound good? How can I change it to make it sound better?

Just some examples...