Having trouble with composing for piano

[kakeithewolf]

As pretty much anyone who has listened to my piano compositions can glean, piano composition is not my forte. And, whilst it's not my absolute favourite instrument, there is a certain je ne sais quoi to how it sounds that I cannot exact from any other instrument.

I can convey a good variety of emotions with ensembles, organ, harpsichord, and small orchestra. The vast majority of my works are for ensembles or a small Baroque orchestra. But every time I try to compose on piano, regardless of what key I use, I can only exact two kinds of emotion from it: either dark sorrow and deep depression or furious rage and angered lament.

What I am wondering is this: Am I doing something wrong, or am I just not meant to compose for this instrument?

[roncesvalles]

Give yourself some time.  What's important, at least, is that you're expressing something, that the act of composing isn't something that is abstract or purely intellectual for you.  Maybe improvisation will help you out.  Try to depict your moods through your playing, and maybe you'll find a seed for a composition that way.   Or just start playing chords, and find a series of four to eight chords that expresses something other than agony and despair!  Then use those chords as a ground for melody and development.

Another way to approach it is to simply play works by other composers.  Pick a mood, and then pick a piece that reflects that mood.  Get it under your fingers, and then play it, feeling the mood intimately.  Then ask yourself what the composer is doing to achieve that mood.  What sort of harmonies is she/he deploying?  What sort of structure do the melodies have?  And then think about what you would do with similar structure--instead of the chord progression going here, what if it goes there instead?   What if the melody was faster, or in a different rhythm?  While I'm not telling you to copy another composer's works, there are always ideas that can be developed from other works, and this way you can look at the nuts and bolts of something that you know works, and use that knowledge to apply to your own work.

[ted]

Could it be that you are trying to force your ideas to fit written notation ? Very many musicians seem to do this, especially in regard to rhythm. If so, try reversing the direction, letting ideas flow in improvisation first. Once you find yourself repeating reasonably long sections, then, if it sounds good enough to you, if it reliably moves you, attempt to notate it if you can be bothered. Don't worry about what other people might think though, that doesn't matter in the end. Just create to please yourself.

[gregh]

Don't compose for the piano, then. Compose for another instrument, and then play it on the piano.

[gore234]

If you want to create something happy sounding, I would play in a major key and mimic musical phrases by Mozart or Haydn. I compose a melody and then fit a chord progression underneath it. Or you can create a chord progression and then improvise on top and come up with something you like.  Try to create question and answer phrases in the music and set the piece up to incorporate the characteristics of the type of piece you are writing for whether its a sonata, waltz, or fugue.

Everytime I learn a new piece from a composer, I try to mimic their style into my own playing.

[kakeithewolf]

Give yourself some time.  What's important, at least, is that you're expressing something, that the act of composing isn't something that is abstract or purely intellectual for you.  Maybe improvisation will help you out.  Try to depict your moods through your playing, and maybe you'll find a seed for a composition that way.   Or just start playing chords, and find a series of four to eight chords that expresses something other than agony and despair!  Then use those chords as a ground for melody and development.

Hm, this is an interesting note. Almost everything in my life is as you said: abstract and purely intellectual. The only time I use emotion rather than logic is in writing and composing. So, perhaps the reason why I can only seem to exact despair is because I am using that as a way to express that bottled up feeling of darker emotion within me.

Could it be that you are trying to force your ideas to fit written notation ? Very many musicians seem to do this, especially in regard to rhythm. If so, try reversing the direction, letting ideas flow in improvisation first. Once you find yourself repeating reasonably long sections, then, if it sounds good enough to you, if it reliably moves you, attempt to notate it if you can be bothered. Don't worry about what other people might think though, that doesn't matter in the end. Just create to please yourself.

This does seem a very good idea. Most of my composed piano works are repetitive and dull, or purely depressing, rooting themselves in bass. I have noticed I improvise far better than I compose for piano, so perhaps that is where I should start. Akiba.

Don't compose for the piano, then. Compose for another instrument, and then play it on the piano.

There is one trouble with that. I've tried that, but on most of my orchestral pieces and organ pieces, it just can't be played as is. Though, my harpsichord pieces do seem to capture happiness, and may transfer well to piano.

[awesom_o]

Right a short piece for the LH alone.

[gregh]

There is one trouble with that. I've tried that, but on most of my orchestral pieces and organ pieces, it just can't be played as is. Though, my harpsichord pieces do seem to capture happiness, and may transfer well to piano.

I believe that then becomes arranging, rather than composing, and I'm pretty much assuming that it would be a different type of activity for you than the original composition.

I don't know your works, of course. But I've heard Metallica played by cello quartet (the band Apocolyptica from Finland) and by a bluegrass band (check YouTube for "Fade to Bluegrass"-- I expected something cornball, but it was beautiful). Metalheads play Beethoven. Trans-Siberian Orchestra transforms Christmas songs. Greensleaves by a jazz big band.

Those examples are meant to illustrate that a piece can be played with wildly different instrumentation. It might need a little rearranging, but it retains the basic melody and other qualities of the original.

Speaking of jazz, it can be interesting to see how different artists play the same standard and make it their own. For that matter, when I started working on "Polka Dots and Moonbeams" on trumpet, in ignorance of the music save for the piece of paper in front of me... well,  I almost didn't recognize it when I heard it on the radio, but that gave me some better ideas about how to play it. So I wondered if you just have a gloomy way of interpreting music when you sit at the piano. Not that I would know, it's just a thought.

Do you have any specific image in mind when you compose? Think of bunnies hopping around in a meadow.

[j_menz]

Think of bunnies hopping around in a meadow.

Although it's hard to beat what's already out there....

[kakeithewolf]

Do you have any specific image in mind when you compose? Think of bunnies hopping around in a meadow.

Not quite.

Instead of visualizing like I do for writing, I tend to channel emotions when I compose or improvise.

[danthecomposer]

What is your purpose?

[kakeithewolf]

What is your purpose?

That is a question I have pondered for my whole life.

[danthecomposer]

So use that as your purpose and write ponderous music.  Use sus4 chords, 9ths without 7ths (basically a triad with a raised root to the 2nd).  This will avoid the sounds you wrote about in your OP and also represent your ponderous nature.

Worth a shot, no?

Take your musical canvas and audibly fill it with a lick of paint here and a splash of colour there.

I await to 'see' the result.