ARCT set list help!!!!

[draganpower]

Played a year of ARCT repertoire and would like some help selecting a List D, List E
Planning to have my exam in one or two years.

List A: Bach - Prelude and Fugue in C# major, BkI BWV 848
List B: Beethoven - Sonata in C minor, opus 13, Pathetique
List C: Chopin - Nocturne in C# minor, Opus 27 no.
List D: Debussy - Ballade or Pagodes

I can play all these pieces in the list above

Proposing
List E: Bartok - Roumanian Dances Opus  8a first movement (leaning more to this piece)                                                        - Allegro Barbaro
          Ginastera - Argentina Dances # 2
          Prokofiev - Scherzo
                        - Vision fugitives

Concert Etude: Liszt - Un sospiro (leaning more to this piece)                      
                      Chopin - Etude opus 10, no 12, Revolutionary
                      Rachmaninoff - Etude Tableau opus 39 no 8 or no 9
                      

I feel my repertoire is quite Romantic and impressionistic. Would this be an issue? I love Chopin, Ravel, Liszt, Debussy, and Rachmaninoff hence my more romantic/impressionistic dominated repertoire.

[nanabush]

Hey!  I've played some of the rep you listed.

For the List D:  Both are EXCELLENT choices.  Underplayed as far as I know... usually people will play one of the Debussy Preludes or Images.  I found the technique in Pagodes easier to grasp than the Ballade (the Pagodes has some fast RH passagework, and some large voicings, but the finger independence in one of the mid sections in the Ballade is very tricky).

Pagodes is a really nice piece, but I love having it in the SET with the other two Estampes.  The Ballade is a standalone piece, and is definitely less heard than the Pagodes.  I'd lean more towards that personally but it's really up to you.

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For List E... I'm pretty sure you need all 3 Danzas Argentinas (I played the set for the ARCT).  In any case, the second one is beautiful, the first one is very straightforward, and the third one is a beast from hell.  Check out the third one, try running through it and you'll definitely find the awkward stuff.  It's a great piece though, super bombastic.


The Roumanian Dances are really cool too.  I took a two week course in France, and this was one of the pieces I was working on (the first Roumanian Dance only).  Some awkward Bartok-y stuff in the octaves will make you really tempted to drop some of the notes, because the tempo just keeps picking up throughout.  The slow middle section is really cool, kind of mystical sounding.  Articulation is huge in this piece, look at the variety of symbols over the notes... that's one of the things that I wish I was more careful with before bringing the piece to France

Un Sospiro is a great etude for the ARCT.  It has some pretty intense technical demands (compared to the Gr.10 etudes, which seem to be more than just one level below all the concert etudes for ARCT).  It also shows how you can make the piano 'sing'.  It's just a killer piece, loads of fun to play.  It's generally in the group of "overplayed" pieces, but it's a very safe choice for the ARCT.

The Rach etudes are pretty intense.  Did you by any chance play the G minor for your Grade 10?  I know the d minor (#8) is a good double note study, has lots of musical passagework, and typical beastly writing near the end (where he layers the melody, RH accompaniment, and left hand darting all over the keyboard).  It's a really strange piece, but I freaking love it.  The D major (#9) is a huge piece... you can definitely play these if you've done some Rach before, but it might be a bit daunting if you are not very familiar with his stuff (but I'm guessing you are if you are choosing these pieces by him).

So yea, there's my input on some of this stuff!  I did my grade 10 about 7 years ago, and the Pathetique (only two movements) was my list B.  I did the Grieg sonata for my 'classical sonata', and they promptly removed it from the syllabus a few months later (probably realized that he's far from Beethoven/Mozart/Haydn sonatas lol).  Pathetique is a good one, but maybe check out another.  This is a piano genre that has so many monumental/epic works.  The Pathetique is among them, but definitely explore the other Beethoven sonatas.  The F# Major Op.78 is amazing, only around ~11 minutes, and the second movement is hilarious.

[draganpower]

Thank you for the extensive reply Nanabush. Do you think my repertoire is too romantic/impressionistic heavy? My piano coach is always cautioning me the pieces I pick.

For the list B, I actually started learning Mozart's K310. Learnt the first movement but my coach said I didn't have the essence of Mozart. I was playing too much like Beethoven. So I picked up the Pathetique and I do realize it is so overplayed. I actually played two movements of the Pathetique for my grade 10 exam 6 years ago. I stopped playing piano after obtaining my gr. 10 diploma. I just started playing piano again 8 months ago. My piano coach wanted me to play piece I knew and wouldn't be difficult for me to pick up so I have a piece under my belt. I am still just strengthening my fingers and gaining my technique back.

The other choice I was thinking of learning would be Beethoven's  Sonata opus 31 no. 2 (Tempest). However, so much time and effort is needed to learn and perfect a whole new three movement sonata. I am undecided if I should focus on the pieces I have now or learn another sonata.

I am leaning more towards the ballade for my list D as well. Great minds think a like haha. I also really love Pagodes. It is such a hard choice... I still have time to decide this one.

I am more worried about what to play for my List E and etude.

My apologies, it was supposed to say Danzas Argentinas opus 2. I absolutely love the second one and the third one does look ridiculous. I am really worried how heavy my romantic pieces are; the third movement is quite technical but the second seems too romantic for the repertoire I have. I think I am going to pick up the Roumanian dances opus 8a no 1. I also know my coach loves Bartok.

I want to play Un Sospiro. I am just worried how technically demanding it is and wondering if I am ready for it yet. I also, never played liszt before... so there is  going to be a huge learning curve there. However, I sight read a little of it and I think it is manageable but requiring a lot of work. I absolutely love this piece and it is more of a romantic show piece haha.

Rachmaninoff I did play the etude tableau opus 33 no 8 in g minor for my gr 10. I also played Rach's Prelude opus 3 no 2. So I believe I have grasp of Rach. However, no 8 seems so romantic and I feel like I need a show piece in my repertoire but difficulty of no 9 is quite out there.

Based on the pieces I have learnt so far, do you think un sospiro or Rach's no 9 are in reach for me?

[nanabush]

I'd probably suggest Un Sospiro.  I played that as my concert etude (it was either that one or the Eb major Etude Tableaux from Op.33 for me).  I feel that the harmonic language in Un Sospiro is MUCH more straightforward than in the Rach.  I think also generally the technique required in that is an extension of the Grade 10 technique (arpeggios, chromatic scales, broken chords, parallel scales).  The Rachmaninoff has a lot of contrapuntal weirdness going on, has a lot of chromaticism, and I think the thick texture is just harder to project.

Trust me, Un Sospiro is a good stepping stone as an etude from Gr.10.  It's all really subjective, but I think you could definitely have a good go at that piece.  The sections are pretty noticeable; try a bit of each, get some good fingering, there's nothing awkward in that piece, and it doesn't need to be a speeding bullet.

[awesom_o]

I like your choices.

You should be aware that the Etude Tableaux in D minor from op. 39  is EXTREMELY difficult.

I came to it after having played two of the Concertos (2 &3), the original version of the 2nd Sonata, several Preludes, and five other Etudes-Tableaux. I find it just as challenging as those big works... almost as challenging as the 1st Sonata.

I don't know the D major, no. 9, from op. 39 as well. It's less difficult than the D minor, but still quite a bit harder than anything else on your program.

[draganpower]

Thanks guys for your suggestions. I think my set list so far will be

List A: Bach - Prelude and Fugue in C# major, BkI BWV 848
List B: Beethoven - Sonata in C minor, opus 13, Pathetique
List C: Chopin - Nocturne in C# minor, Opus 27 no. 1
List D: Debussy - Ballade or Pagodes (still can't decide)
List E: Bartok - Roumanian Dances Opus  8a first movement
Concert Etude: Liszt - Un sospiro

and I think I may learn the Beethoven's Tempest. It is not as overplayed as Pathetique and I absolutely love it. I still have time to learn a new list B and might as well utilize it.

If you guys still have tips, please let me know.

[pianoman1349]

From personal experience, a lot of examiners would rather listen to the Ballade than the Pagodes, even though both are great pieces.  That being said, because the Ballade is early debussy, they may not necessarily understand the major stylistic differences from the early Debussy style from the more common impressionistic/abstract styles found in Debussy's later music.  An example would be comparing the compositional style of Debussy's piano trio with his "Pour le piano" suite.

A very well played Tempest tends to get very high marks.  However, the opening "Largo" measures really set up the examiner's impression of your performance ... essentially if you screw up the atmosphere of the opening a major chord, the rest of your performance will be scrutinized in greater detail.  Another tip that I received from several examiners, an outstanding musically informed second movement can forgive many sins in the fast movements ... I don't know why, but it always seems to be the case.

Just as a side note, in terms of your program, it does seem a little one-noted as the majority of the works that you have chosen have a "lyrical" feel to them (Bartok excluded), and textually seems very much the same.  In some respects, the Pathetique might be a better choice, as the first and second movements are a little more contrasting than the Tempest.   As much as I love the Chopin nocturne, I would change it to another romantic piece ... maybe the Fantaise impromptu Op. 66 by Chopin or the Mendelssohn Introduction and Rondo Capriccioso Op 14???  I'm not sure if there really is another option that may work, with your program.  Do keep in mind that you are allowed to take a break approximately half way through your program ... you should try to plan your program in such a way so that your program can logically reach a conclusion of sorts before you take your break, and then reach a climax/thrilling conclusion in the second half after the break.

Anyways, these are my ideas (or rant) on ARCT programming.  Best of luck and have fun with your repertoire