Interview with pianist Roman Rabinovich

[faulty_damper]

https://www.examiner.com/article/interview-with-pianist-roman-rabinovich?CID=examiner_alerts_article

"EH: Which Chopin Etude is the most difficult for your hand?
Rabinovich: For my hand, I must say the second, Opus 10 No. 2 (laughs)."

My first thought was, he probably curves his fingers too much when he plays.  And here's video that shows him playing in just such a manner.  It's not your hand - it's your technique.

[j_menz]

When I saw you starting a thread about a pianist, my first thought wasn't fit to print. Lo and behold.... 

[faulty_damper]

And when I saw that you replied, my first thought was that you wrote about me, not the topic of the thread. 

[j_menz]

Since the examiner has made this a standard question for their current series of pianist interviews ("Which Chopin Etude is the most difficult for your hand?"), there are no doubt going to be a variety of answers.  It will always, by definition, be a Chopin Etude, and no-one's going to fess up to one of the trois nouvelles, so there's 24 to choose from.  Do you have a specific technical weakness lined up for each possible answer, just the more likely ones, or have you just lucked it thusfar (2 for 2 on my count)?

[faulty_damper]

There are only a couple of techniques you can use to play each etude.  If you use the wrong one, even though you can play all the notes, it will still be difficult and would require excessive practice.  Difficulties with Op.10-2 is usually excessive finger curving.  Another possibility, which was highly unlikely given that he is a competition winner, was one of rigid wrists.  I simply chose the most probable technical issue and from the video it shows that I was correct.  For any difficulty, there's usually a technical issue underlying it.

[j_menz]

Perhaps then you could enlighten us with the full list.  I don't disagree that a difficulty usually indicates a technical issue underlying, and given the possible pianists being interviewed, some possibilities are likely to be missed. A full list would provide the basis for potentially useful discussion.

It would also take some of the ad hominem element out of the discussion, and fend off diversions into arguments about what "most difficult for your hand" means in the context of an accomplished pianist, or how it may not be the same as "has difficulties with".

[faulty_damper]

I don't have a list of possible technical issues with each etude already in mind.  All I know is the goal of the etude and the technical issue it's addressing and figure out the possible issues that can make it difficult or impossible to play.  I've also seen many pianists struggling through these studies so some of that knowledge is from observations.

Although I mentioned the technical thing about the Chopin study, what actually caught my attention was his assertion that pianists today have no creativity, as if classical pianists should be jazz improvisors:
"I think much of it has become one-dimensional, unfortunately. There aren’t many individual voices today. The first half of the century produced so many great pianists with their own sound. You can tell a Horowitz, a Rachmaninoff, Hofmann, Rubinstein, or a Richter from the very first notes. Today, many people sound the same. It’s not too interesting."

He implies that being original in your interpretation is the ultimate goal of classical performance.  This is incredibly egocentric thinking and one I strongly disagree with.  You are not supposed to mutilate and distort the music just so it sounds original.  We already have Horowitz for that ( ).  The performer's goal is to make him/herself invisible and only let the music speak.  The performer should not be a spectacle.

As well, his own interpretation could also be said to be "one-dimensional".  I found his Bach partita (in the video) to be boring and lacking in emotional depth.  Where was the "individual voice" that he talked about?  He clearly was "not too interesting."

[dima_76557]

There are only a couple of techniques you can use to play each etude.  If you use the wrong one, even though you can play all the notes, it will still be difficult and would require excessive practice.  Difficulties with Op.10-2 is usually excessive finger curving.  Another possibility, which was highly unlikely given that he is a competition winner, was one of rigid wrists.  I simply chose the most probable technical issue and from the video it shows that I was correct.  For any difficulty, there's usually a technical issue underlying it.

Why do you conclude that Rabinovich has difficulties with ANYTHING concerning the mechanics of piano playing? He simply answered a question about ranking.

[j_menz]

being original in your interpretation is the ultimate goal of classical performance.  This is incredibly egocentric thinking and one I strongly disagree with. 

But if you have nothing new to say about a piece, why should I pay to listen to you or buy your recording, or even go to the trouble of listening, when I have heard already what you have to say?

I'm not defending eccentricity for the sake of novelty, but originality that is still true to the music.

[faulty_damper]

Why do you conclude that Rabinovich has difficulties with ANYTHING concerning the mechanics of piano playing? He simply answered a question about ranking.

It's not an question about ranking, it's one of quality.  There are qualitative differences between this study and the others.  You can play the others with the technique he uses, but it just happens to let him down in this specific study due to its unique requirements.  The technical difficulties are   why different pianists would answer this question differently.

But if you have nothing new to say about a piece, why should I pay to listen to you or buy your recording, or even go to the trouble of listening, when I have heard already what you have to say?

I'm not defending eccentricity for the sake of novelty, but originality that is still true to the music.

I would make the assumption that you've never heard the music before which is why I want to be as true to the music's intention as possible.  If you've ever heard a bad performance and it was the first time hearing it, you would think the music was bad, not the performer.  It's only when you already know what it sounds like that you can compare, which is what you're saying.  As well, most recordings kind of suck in terms of musical quality.  Take Yundi Li's Chopin, for example.  He plays Chopin like Japanese anime music.

[dima_76557]

You can play the others with the technique he uses, but it just happens to let him down in this specific study due to its unique requirements.

Do you have any ...uhm... evidence for this statement? Have you actually witnessed him playing this particular etude?

[faulty_damper]

Do you have any ...uhm... evidence for this statement? Have you actually witnessed him playing this particular etude?

Don't need to. You can clearly see the technique he uses in the video.  Pianists don't change their technical vocabulary just because they play a different piece, just like foreigners don't change their sound palette when they speak a foreign language; they rely on their old one.

[j_menz]

I would make the assumption that you've never heard the music before

Then you'd often, though by no means always, be wrong. Not just in my case, either.

As well, most recordings kind of suck in terms of musical quality.

I keep forgetting how awful all the pianists who actually made a career of it were.  

[outin]

My first thought was, he probably curves his fingers too much when he plays.  And here's video that shows him playing in just such a manner.  It's not your hand - it's your technique.

I don't think you can assess anyone's technique by the amount of curving of their fingers. People have very different ratios between the length of their fingers, their thumb is placed differently and they also have different shape of fingertips. There are individual differences in the way tendons are attached. Very long fingers work differently than short ones. For some it seems to be necessary to curve certain fingers more to maintain good touch and control. Watching professional pianists play it seems clear that the hand shape affects the way they play. It's only logical that the hand shape also makes certain passages more difficult and some more easy. Even with my inferior skills I have noticed that I find some passages easy that are generally considered difficult, while some things that even total beginners have no trouble with require a lot of work, simply because my hand does not "fit" without special adjustments. I don't see how it would be different for real pianists, they have just solved most of these issues already.

[lazyfingers]

I don't think you can assess anyone's technique by the amount of curving of their fingers.

I agree with you. However, what I do find useful though is which part of the key they use, which of course, like you say is influenced by how long their fingers are and consequently how curved their fingers are.

Like there is no such thing as an "ideal" hand shape/finger length, there is not such thing as ideal curvature.

[outin]

I agree with you. However, what I do find useful though is which part of the key they use, which of course, like you say is influence by how long their fingers are and consequently how curved their fingers are.

Wouldn't it also depend on the piano one plays? With proper grands it seems to be much easier to just go as deep as the fingers would require, without the sound suffering...at least it is for me...

[faulty_damper]

I don't think you can assess anyone's technique by the amount of curving of their fingers.

And yet I was able to tell, based only on his stated opinion of the most difficult Chopin etude, how he actually played the piano.  Just because you can't, doesn't mean others can't.

[lazyfingers]

Wouldn't it also depend on the piano one plays? With proper grands it seems to be much easier to just go as deep as the fingers would require, without the sound suffering...at least it is for me...

Unless one is contemplating an electronic keyboard, key lengths are sort of standard nowadays at least.

I'm actually referring to which part of the key they use, which if you infer from my previous statement cannot be too close to the fall board if there is any curvature of the fingers involved.

Sure with some chords/key combinations, the middle fingers come close to the fall board but that is the way the hand is shaped. Eg. Thumb on c#, 5 on c#, the other fingers have to be close to the fall board. But when you do say, Chopin Op 10 no 5 or Op 25 No 1, then where you land can a great bearing on what accuracy you have (ie. if you have "flat" fingers) and what tone you will achieve.

My experience is that with modern pianos both grand and upright, the key lengths usually is not an issue. But of course if you have "flat" fingers that might be a different issue.

[outin]

Unless one is contemplating an electronic keyboard, key lengths are sort of standard nowadays at least.

I'm actually referring to which part of the key they use, which if you infer from my previous statement cannot be too close to the fall board if there is any curvature of the fingers involved.

Sure with some chords/key combinations, the middle fingers come close to the fall board but that is the way the hand is shaped. Eg. Thumb on c#, 5 on c#, the other fingers have to be close to the fall board. But when you do say, Chopin Op 10 no 5 or Op 25 No 1, then where you land can a great bearing on what accuracy you have (ie. if you have "flat" fingers) and what tone you will achieve.

My experience is that with modern pianos both grand and upright, the key lengths usually is not an issue. But of course if you have "flat" fingers that might be a different issue.

I have very little experience with different pianos. Maybe there's something wrong with my upright, but it's extremely difficult to play it well close to the fallboard and this is what my hand shape requires to be able to play some things without harmful tension. I do not experience such difficulties with my teachers grands. So I have assumed that uprights (with their different mechanism) are in general more difficult to play.

[outin]

And yet I was able to tell, based only on his stated opinion of the most difficult Chopin etude, how he actually played the piano. 

That does not in any way contradict what I wrote. If certain hand shape requires more curved fingers for good control and tonal results, then obviously things that are easier to play with less curved fingers would be more difficult for them, right? Just like those people who can play easier and better with straight fingers will find some type of music more difficult.

If there was a universal optimal technique that works as well for every hand shape and every piece, I don't think there would be such differences in the way and quality even great pianists play the same music. But if you indeed possess such a technique unknown to the majority  of players, even professionals, why don't you show us how it works and share it with all the aspiring concerts pianists as well? Simply writing about it is not enough to spread the word, since we both seem to agree that you cannot learn to play the piano just by reading about it.

[lazyfingers]

I have very little experience with different pianos. Maybe there's something wrong with my upright, but it's extremely difficult to play it well close to the fallboard and this is what my hand shape requires to be able to play some things without harmful tension. I do not experience such difficulties with my teachers grands. So I have assumed that uprights (with their different mechanism) are in general more difficult to play.

Uprights do feel different. However, we do what we must.

The upright action is very different. For one, you mentioned the shortened lever action (which to some extent you can ameliorate by playing close to you and further from the fall board - meaning more curved fingers). They are generally less responsive (without the double escapement mechanism) and also when the una cord is used, the action moves closer to the strings and hence distorts the feel altogether. With the grand, the action shifts left and hits fewer strings and in different parts of the hammer, but this does not change the length of the key strike.

Without much analysis, I would say that you are merely experiencing the shorter leverage action of the action when you play closer to the fall board on your upright and maybe also how the springs in your action work. But this is merely conjecture.

[outin]

Uprights do feel different. However, we do what we must.

The upright action is very different. For one, you mentioned the shortened lever action (which to some extent you can ameliorate by playing close to you and further from the fall board - meaning more curved fingers). They are generally less responsive (without the double escapement mechanism) and also when the una cord is used, the action moves closer to the strings and hence distorts the feel altogether. With the grand, the action shifts left and hits fewer strings and in different parts of the hammer, but this does not change the length of the key strike.

Without much analysis, I would say that you are merely experiencing the shorter leverage action of the action when you play closer to the fall board on your upright and maybe also how the springs in your action work. But this is merely conjecture.

Probably. My piano is only a few years old, and maybe stiff because of that as well. It also has a silent mechanism, this seems to affect the touch.

Curiously, it becomes much more responsive and comfortable to play when I can use the right pedal. But that won't help with baroque, which I like to play...

[pianoman53]

It's funny how the "experts" in this forum get terribly offended both from people who asks for evidence of their expertise,  and from other users refuses to give evidence when the "expert" asks for it. Trolling at the highest level!